come on guys.....cell phone records ie.....pinging, tracking the movement of her phone. Surveillance aka the video of them in the same room her walking over to him.....All the story does is rehash the public documents we have all read. They don't have any further information other than what has been released that we all have seen .
TSJ Thread
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Sincere question, does your friend know the actual particulars of this case? I ask that question because other than those of us who are really seeking all the details out like we are don't realize how questionable these charges actually are. I live in St. Louis and everybody I talk to here about the situation assumes there was an accuasation of forced sexual intercourse, versus what it turned out to be, 5-10 seconds of digital penetration in a public place with no witnesses other than the accuser? They assume it was either a he said/she said regarding consensual sex, or there is DNA evidence, or they wouldn't have charged him with rape. Having read all the charging documents and TSJ's filings, many attorneys have a different opinion than your friends. Just curious if your friend has dug into the details of the case, or just made the assumption most people do when they hear he was charged with rape...
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Was the reporter lazy and didn't bother to read the actual details of the charging document, or was he intentionally biased? The details are out there, yet few are included in this account. It sounds like half-truth with some mistakes thrown in for good measure.
Terrence Shannon Jr. alleged rape case occurred at Jayhawk Café in Lawrence
LAWRENCE (KSNT) – Court documents are shedding new light on the arrest and subsequent suspension of a University of Illinois basketball player for an alleged rape that occurred in Lawrence. C…www.ksnt.com
"Court documents state law enforcement corroborated the victim’s story with other witnesses, cell phone records and a surveillance video from inside the café."
VERY poorly written article that I guarantee the DA fed to them.Terrence Shannon Jr. alleged rape case occurred at Jayhawk Café in Lawrence
LAWRENCE (KSNT) – Court documents are shedding new light on the arrest and subsequent suspension of a University of Illinois basketball player for an alleged rape that occurred in Lawrence. C…
"Court documents state law enforcement corroborated the victim’s story with other witnesses, cell phone records and a surveillance video from inside the café."
Another way to say it is there's no evidence on surveillance or phone records to make police believe she's not being truthful. They're treating her as honest until proven dishonest. And from what the public is aware of, nothing contradicts her story. In fact, everything she said (times, places, sequence of events, etc.) seems to be supported by her phone history and the available surveillance.
There is a small window of time when they were both in the Martini Room together. There likely isn't going to be any sort of hard, smoking gun evidence of what, if anything, happened in there. It's her story against his and will come down to who is more likeable.
We can tell ourselves that this case is a sham because that's what we want to be true but I'm expecting to have to ride this out all the way til the end.
This
It’s ‘so easy’ for a person’s life to be messed up in a major way these days. All it takes is an accusation and social media and then you’ve got one great big problem.
As has been said... this Shannon process will move along at its own pace and whatever comes out of it... comes out of it.
But what this does is show just how vulnerable all of us are to having our lives and futures disrupted (if not ‘destroyed’) quickly in a flash of an instant. We are each walking a tight-rope every day when even if we do our best to toe the line and ‘live right’ we are always at the mercy of a single use of our own bad judgment... or some person who harbors a grudge and wants to strike out at us wrongly. The web and social media have brought with them a massively-sized megaphone that blares out every moment of every day anything a person wants to say or claim and have that splashed to every corner of the Globe. Futures, lives, reputations always in the crosshairs of every possible attitude and agenda of others. And then once things get into 'The System'... then even more agendas and wildcards come into play.
And most certainly including our own missteps and mistakes. And since it is not possible for us to achieve perfection... we each run afoul of that standard as we run out just barely ahead of frenzied arms always at the ready to clutch and drag us down and declare our shortcomings to all the World.
And forgiveness is not always easy to extend. To us, and by us. Especially in World where conflict, anger, extreme thinking, and the seeking of self-promotion rules supreme.
Whatever did happen in Kansas in the span of one short evening will echo for a very long time among the lives of the accused... the accuser... the families of both... and a University and basketball team of players that just want to play a game they love. And they hoped to do it with a supreme roundball talent that uses the ball court to perform his personal magic.
All knowing that those long and extended arms of vulnerability to others is ever-at-the-ready to grab hold of you and me and anyone and turn our lives upside down.
Corroborate doesn't mean "proof," insert
instead of proof in this caseGoillinikobd
- Southeastern US
Well, that describes today’s society in seven paragraphs.
Glad I am 70 and don’t have to walk on the thin ice of dating and sex in today’s world.
In my day, Fatal Attraction certainly scared the crap of our wandering eyes and roving hands. Boiled rabbits and bathtub drownings coming back to life…. Nightmares.
the national
- the Front Range
One would think.
Infer what you like. You are proving his point about an inability to discuss this case in isolation.
Virtue signaling is the constant bringing up of other victims and the broader problem of sexual violence - which is understood by all to be a bad thing, or at least should be. And if any here feel otherwise I doubt more posting on it will change their minds.
Let's discuss this case in this thread.
I do agree that we do not have all the facts here. Of those we have, I do not see the merit in charging him and seeing 95% of the country think TSJ raped this woman (notwithstanding Kansas's strict definition).
You know you've been spending too much time on this board when your brain tells you this is misspelled.
Then one might ask what is the point of their existence if not review the information available to make a reasonable assessment independent of the court or university on whether the student/athlete is being treated fairly on any penalties or suspension that have been applied.
Good one! I'm surprised I didn't automatically type "Sencire" question in my comment.
Not to mention poorly written, riddled with mistakes, and biased again TSJ.
Come on already Judge Whoeveryouare. Give us a dang ruling already.
Illinicpa14
- Chicago
Given he’s in court tomorrow and would miss this game anyway, guessing it gave her more time to review.
This reminds me of the Johnny Depp and Amber Turd trial. That word must have been used at least 1000 times
The answer to this question is that they exist to do exactly what they are purported to do. To make an assessment and a determination. What I think is being left out here is that this policy isn't just invoked in matters of criminal cases.
For example, if the woman making the allegations had gone public with a social media post detailing the same things she told the detective, but did not go to police at that point, my guess is that Josh Whitman may have even then initiated this policy. And at that point I could very well see the panel decide not to suspend Shannon, provided he proclaimed his innocence and gave them reason to believe that.
But a criminal charge bears another level of credibility. It means that in the judgement of the elected professional prosecutor whose job is to make these decisions, the allegation is supported by evidence. That's a pretty heavy thing, and it makes sense to weigh it that way. I'm not sure the panel is particularly inclined to make a judgement on a criminal case themselves anyways, but even if they are, they don't have access to the evidence right now. And in the absence of the evidence, it is completely understandable that they're erring on the side of the criminal charge.
But again, that's not to say they would never reinstate a player. Because the policy doesn't only apply to situations where there are criminal charges. It's in the situations without charges where they're probably most likely to reinstate.
Fighter of the Nightman
- Chicago, IL
I think what he and other posters are referencing are…
1. Josh said the charges TRIGGERED the suspension (i.e., that’s the “auto setting” for TSJ), but the DIA has a 3-person panel to potentially override that suspension in some situations (i.e., the panel is the “manual user” who can decide a blanket suspension just because charges are filed isn’t fair or whatever).
2. Josh SPECIFICALLY touted the panel as being created because he/the DIA was well aware that the legal process is incredibly slow.
I don’t know how I’d vote on that panel today, honestly … but if “being charged” is a situation where an ironclad suspension must remain in effect, then yes - the panel is indeed incredibly useless and pointless.
bdutts
- Houston, Texas
I think the panel is a University one and not a DIA one, in that there are no DIA personnel on the panel and the panels doesn't report into the DIA. At least that's the way I understood what Whitman said during his press conference.
Court Day.......nothing should come out of it but still good to move on to the next step.
They could be more of an independent ("third party") check on the validity of the suspension. The DIA and the University leadership say that this person is suspended under the misconduct policy. The review panel then looks at what is known and agrees or disagrees if the suspension should have been enacted per the policy.
The panel is a member of the law faculty, a member of the student affairs office, and someone else I want to say someone from the DIA that does not report to Whitman. That group of people is not qualified to interpret evidence and say yea this suspended person is innocent let's let him play before his criminal case is wrapped up.
It could be useless in this case, but not useless in all cases of suspended athletes. I'd assume athletes can get suspended under the policy for less serious charges than what TSJ was charged with.
Based on the incomplete information available, different people will draw different conclusions related to TSJ's criminal charges. When I try to empathize with the University, I assume their primary objective is to maintain the University's pristine image, which I am sure the three-panel team and most of the university administration assumes it is doing well. I mean, why would they not take the path of least resistance and throw this young man under the bus to protect the image of the University? Why would someone who hands down edicts from an ivory tower lower themself to the alleged events at a college bar in another state? Why is some young man's ability to throw a ball in the basket more important than the institution that gives these administration types their power and meaning in life?
These individuals have a public and private persona. In public, they preach their love and support for the students and the betterment of humankind; however, in private, it is all about defending the institution and power structure. This three person panel, that has been outsourced from the athletic department is set up in a clever way. BU defers to his boss JW, JW and the Athletic Department defer to the three person panel, and now the three person panel will defer to the legal system. Now no one has to make any tough decisions or damage the institution, and the money keeps flowing (everyone keeps their prestigious job title). Before this nightmare began, TSJ and University's interests aligned since TSJ was helping the money flow. Now the University perceives TSJ to be a costly liability and is implementing a wait and see strategy (on the legal system) while hiding behind University policies and procedures. If fans and supporters of the University do not make their voices heard, this will not end well for TSJ or the University.
These individuals have a public and private persona. In public, they preach their love and support for the students and the betterment of humankind; however, in private, it is all about defending the institution and power structure. This three person panel, that has been outsourced from the athletic department is set up in a clever way. BU defers to his boss JW, JW and the Athletic Department defer to the three person panel, and now the three person panel will defer to the legal system. Now no one has to make any tough decisions or damage the institution, and the money keeps flowing (everyone keeps their prestigious job title). Before this nightmare began, TSJ and University's interests aligned since TSJ was helping the money flow. Now the University perceives TSJ to be a costly liability and is implementing a wait and see strategy (on the legal system) while hiding behind University policies and procedures. If fans and supporters of the University do not make their voices heard, this will not end well for TSJ or the University.
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