Illini Basketball 2025-2026

[RabidDawgClassic]

I think this is a misread. I don't have any anger towards Hamer. I don't respect him because he's bad at coaching defense (and has personal traits that make him an easy target for keyboard warriors). The closest thing I have to anger is dismay at the hold he had over BU to continue to in his role and drive this past season's underperformance. To your point, that is a BU issue. I like the Crocker hire and am hopeful that he is given the chance to turn things around. But I was hopeful with Chester too and we see how that turned out.

What are his personal traits that bug you? The leggings? Like the ones KJ wore? Is there anything else? I stand by my stance that the majority of opinions formed about Hamer are seeded by one prominent poster and the rest of us, except for a few, have no clue what he does or doesn’t provide for the program, with or without the mythical and magical hold he has over the head coach.

 

[GatorMcKlusky]

To be fair, people's complaints about current staff members are pretty much just what they get fed by one particular insider, so what people's complaints about this one will be hinges on that.

I don't know about everyone else, but I come here mostly to listen to the insiders. I appreciate what they have to say because they know a lot more than I do about the current state of Illini athletics.

 

[texillwek]

What are his personal traits that bug you? The leggings? Like the ones KJ wore? Is there anything else? I stand by my stance that the majority of opinions formed about Hamer are seeded by one prominent poster and the rest of us, except for a few, have no clue what he does or doesn’t provide for the program, with or without the mythical and magical hold he has over the head coach.

Y'all still beating this poor, dead horse?

 

[socalini]

What are his personal traits that bug you? The leggings? Like the ones KJ wore? Is there anything else? I stand by my stance that the majority of opinions formed about Hamer are seeded by one prominent poster and the rest of us, except for a few, have no clue what he does or doesn’t provide for the program, with or without the mythical and magical hold he has over the head coach.

The only way in which one prominent poster seeded my personal opinion about Hamer was by confirming that Hamer was in charge of the defense: A defense which was not evolving to meet challenges; not effective against many teams' style of play; and which appeared to cost us several close games.

 

[Mobi]

I don't understand the anger directed towards Hamer. Underwood is the head coach, if he is okay with the way Hamer runs the defense, then the anger should be directed towards him. If he doesn't like the defense being played, he should make a change.

Hamer is just the scapegoat and yes the blame is on Brad. You can't fire a coach with a top 20 offense year in year out but you can fire a defense coordinator, and hopefully find a better one to fix the defense. I know it's different but happens all the time in football.

I think Brad can take teams to Final four but I am skeptical about a championship with subpar defense. (Hope I am wrong.) Historically, champion teams were top 20/25 in both offense and defense. I will never argue firing a coach who has every potential to take you to Final four but maybe not championship (e.g., Bo Ryan). But I think Brad clearly has a higher ceiling than Bo so that's my frustration.

 

[splitter]

I would rather have a marquis home game against the likes of Arizona or Tennessee (even if they become a loss) any day of the week over a cupcake game. It is fun for the fans and it can only help the overall resume.

The only cupcake game i want scheduled is an IL compass or I 74 - I 57 team. The one with a Q1 or Q2 projection. Portal watching.

 

[CoachHooleyHoo]

I'd accuse you of cherry picking tempo-dependent metrics, but you do realize (and admit) we play at an extremely high pace.

I think it is overstated by many, which was my original statement. I didn't say, you know, "in general, that they're way overstated".

Definitely it is an area for improvement, and really the only sentence you typed that I would take issue with is 'This was a pretty bad defensive team' as being the 40th ranked D on Kenpom & 42nd ranked D on Torvik isn't 'a pretty bad defensive team', that is nearly top 10 percentile. And I do of course tend to lean toward these tempo-free stats as I feel that is important given how we play on offense.

What would you do in lieu of the drop coverage with the personnel we have?

All fair points and I do agree that tempo plays a big part of it. But again, I feel like watching that team, it was pretty clear there were some significant defensive deficiencies. And again, I do concede that a big part of that is personnel...that can't be completely overcome with scheme. But coaches are paid big money to figure out how to minimize that as much as possible.

I would like to see us to do more hard/high hedges. With our length, we could make it tough on the ballhandler and force them out higher. Just felt like our bigs got caught in no-mans-land on the drop coverage way too often.

 

[Emerson Bigguns]

I mean did you not understand Bears fans hatred of Shane Waldron? Or Mel Tucker years ago?

Plenty of good head coaches hire bad assistants and retain them out of loyalty.

Doug Pederson ended up getting fired from head coaching jobs in both Philly and Jacksonville because of his loyalty to Press Taylor. Bill Belichick hired Matt Patricia as an offensive coordinator one year.

Obviously, my examples are football related because there are clear roles but if a guy is being touted as a defensive coordinator for struggling defenses thrn he will obviously catch flak for it.

In NCAA football you can have up to105 players. In basketball you can have 15. The HC isn't delegating to nearly the same degree.

 

[PepeSilvia]

Bingo. Drop, AND going over the screen takes away the 3 and protects the basket. The hole is in the middle which is why it’s an analytically sound coverage. Analytically, the 2 worst shots you can take in a pick and roll situation is the mid range pull-up and the floater.

Drop also keeps the game 2 on 2 between the handler and the screener and their defenders. The other 3 guys can stay with their man and take away high percentage, catch and shoot, kickout 3s.

I just want to point out that a lot of NBA teams have started drastically limiting the amount of drop coverage they play and a lot of teams switch it up and play even less drop coverage in the playoffs. Go watch the Celtics vs Raptors series a few years ago if you don't believe me.

Drop coverage is extremely vulnerable to pick and pop bigs with the guard following over the screen and the drop big not being close enough to close out. You can basically get an open look for the screener every time unless someone else is rotating which then creates another open guy.

Also, a wide open pull up jumper isn't necessary an inefficient shot for good shooters(plenty of guys can shoot 50% or even better in a single game matchup on an open pull up free throw line jumper). It also gives said guard space to get a full head of steam and attack your big if you don't have a dominant rim defender(Illinois has not had that rim protector but Big Z is capable).

All together, drop coverage is very matchup dependent and should be a tool you can use to opposing offenses different looks than something that you consistently play against everyone. If teams don't have a good pnr ballhandler or a pick and pop big it can be very effective but it can also put you in situations where Desmond Claude nearly singlehandedly beats you.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that since this is college basketball you should primarily hedge and go under screens while mixing it up and trapping or running drop coverage in certain matchups/situations. It's college so it's going to be extremely rare that you're playing someone that can consistently pull up 3's and punish you for hedging and going under(we aren't covering Steph Curry) and honestly if you can bait teams into taking a bunch of pull up 3's you will likely do very well defensively.

The defense should really be adaptable and adjust depending on matchups and I haven't really seen the Illini do that recently as it seems they just want to sit in a base shell and play everyone the same which makes them easy to gameplan against imo.

 

[Weatherspoon1]

Y'all still beating this poor, dead horse?

Literally the best GIF ever

 

[splitter]

Agree but think the first round of Kansas games should be on campus. Do the other places afterwards kinda like Tennessee

Do the same with either or Louisville/Kentucky

alternate home and home. Then do Indianapolis. Take that IU.

 

[splitter]

Bingo. Drop, AND going over the screen takes away the 3 and protects the basket. The hole is in the middle which is why it’s an analytically sound coverage. Analytically, the 2 worst shots you can take in a pick and roll situation is the mid range pull-up and the floater.

Drop also keeps the game 2 on 2 between the handler and the screener and their defenders. The other 3 guys can stay with their man and take away high percentage, catch and shoot, kickout 3s.

I do think sometimes we go over on non shooters, and I’m not a big fan of that.

Overall, you need a top 40 defense and top 10 offense. The question is if we have personnel to get a top 40 defense, regardless of scheme, CONSISTENTLY.

The defense was a roller-coaster ride just like the season. Second year together should smooth things out.
Smooth roller-coaster ride is not a good metaphor but let's go around again.

 

[Mobi]

I just want to point out that a lot of NBA teams have started drastically limiting the amount of drop coverage they play and a lot of teams switch it up and play even less drop coverage in the playoffs. Go watch the Celtics vs Raptors series a few years ago if you don't believe me.

Drop coverage is extremely vulnerable to pick and pop bigs with the guard following over the screen and the drop big not being close enough to close out. You can basically get an open look for the screener every time unless someone else is rotating which then creates another open guy.

Also, a wide open pull up jumper isn't necessary an inefficient shot for good shooters(plenty of guys can shoot 50% or even better in a single game matchup on an open pull up free throw line jumper). It also gives said guard space to get a full head of steam and attack your big if you don't have a dominant rim defender(Illinois has not had that rim protector but Big Z is capable).

All together, drop coverage is very matchup dependent and should be a tool you can use to opposing offenses different looks than something that you consistently play against everyone. If teams don't have a good pnr ballhandler or a pick and pop big it can be very effective but it can also put you in situations where Desmond Claude nearly singlehandedly beats you.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that since this is college basketball you should primarily hedge and go under screens while mixing it up and trapping or running drop coverage in certain matchups/situations. It's college so it's going to be extremely rare that you're playing someone that can consistently pull up 3's and punish you for hedging and going under(we aren't covering Steph Curry) and honestly if you can bait teams into taking a bunch of pull up 3's you will likely do very well defensively.

The defense should really be adaptable and adjust depending on matchups and I haven't really seen the Illini do that recently as it seems they just want to sit in a base shell and play everyone the same which makes them easy to gameplan against imo.

I agree with you b/c I kind of hate drop coverage but sometimes you have to play drop due to personnel. I am NOT convinced that Tomi is best suited for hedge. But both of them are probably better than switch all for us due to the fact that really bombed in 2023-2024.

My main confusion is Underwood's teams' defense weren't always "bad". Our defenses were top 30 in 2021-2023, supposedly before Hamer became the defense guy. Can anybody tell me the differences in schemes?

 

[jamarvelous31]

Funny, I think if you asked this board I think we would give the Illini a B to C last year. I think B+. ESPN? A.

Big Ten report cards for the 2024-25 season

Rutgers' star duo fell short of expectations while Wisconsin's John Tonje helped the Badgers surpass theirs.

www.espn.com

 

[Chukwuwumba]

I’ve heard Crocker is like Steve Kerr, but a better tactician and player manager.

Why not both? I’m sure staff was waiting for the warriors season to end to bring him on board.

 

[alaskaillini]

Laying the blame of some sub-par defensive performances at the feet of an assistant coach is pretty narrowminded, IMO. I highly doubt Brad is rubberstamping anything, and execution has as much to do with the player's physical attributes, attitudes, aptitudes, and health as anything else.

Maybe you don't like the scheme, maybe you don't like the adjustments, but that stuff is on Brad. The fire Brad bandwagon is pretty lonely these days, regardless. If you want to get on board, be my guest.

Fans with no working knowledge of the development of gameplans, or evaluations of the execution of those plans assuming that firing a member of the coaching staff is going to fix it all is just... you can fill in the blank.

If he's staying its because Brad likes him, and isn't putting the blame at his feet. Brad has been right more often than not in his career so far. He certainly has a better idea of what the coaching staff does well and doesn't do well than anyone posting here.

As noted, the defense was top 40 KenPom. But I think the more important observation is that defense is also chemistry related, and last years team had ZERO time playing with each other previously, and then during the season, they had limited opportunities to practice defense as a unit because one or more were often sick or injured. Lack of practice translates to limited numbers of schemes done well that can be used in games. It was late in the year before they started mixing coverages on the PnR. Top 40 was not terrible under the circumstances and I think a lot of the criticism was overdone.

 

[Iamgroot]

 

[AndyKaufmanstutor]

So no accountability for Hamer? With that rationale, should we take it up the chain higher and blame Whitman because he’s the one who hired Underwood?

 

[OB positive]

My only real bones to pick with the defense is we don’t seem to have a counter for what we do. Last year we would drop, and if that didn’t work…we would drop. I think that is truly a personnel thing because we don’t have the guys to do much else.

Personally I’m a firm believer that you have to be able to zone every now and then if a team gets some rhythm on you. But I understand the reluctance if our defense goals are to keep teams 3s low and be an elite rebounding team. Zone doesn’t correlate well with that.

Stop the drop coverage period is what I would prefer. Hard hedge and get back. Hold up the the ballhandler, even if it's just temporarily. That's what everyone does to us and it's been very effective. Don't know why we haven't figured out an answer for it yet.

 

[OB positive]

I agree with you b/c I kind of hate drop coverage but sometimes you have to play drop due to personnel. I am NOT convinced that Tomi is best suited for hedge. But both of them are probably better than switch all for us due to the fact that really bombed in 2023-2024.

My main confusion is Underwood's teams' defense weren't always "bad". Our defenses were top 30 in 2021-2023, supposedly before Hamer became the defense guy. Can anybody tell me the differences in schemes?

I think Tomi could hedge just fine. I watched several other teams use it this year with slower centers get by with it. The key is staying in the passing lane as they get back.

 

[NarrowJ]

Good watch/listen for anyone with qualms re: Hamer or Tyler (around the 8 minute mark, maybe a bit after)

Summary:

With Hamer/Tyler as assistants UI has averaged over 25 wins per season
Hamer/Tyler are 26-14 in the B1G, 4-2 in the NCAA tournament
Offense has been ranked #3 and #14 in those seasons
Defense has had some question marks but is overall a top 5 (by metrics) defense in the B1G over the past 2 seasons
Brad has been offensively-focused with roster moves, so personnel continues to drive defensive scheme
Defensive scheme is what makes the most sense with the personnel

Don't shoot the messenger, these guys are paid to do this (certified ball-knowers)

 

[SVSTORM]

I guess I’ll be the one to ask…
Was Crocker at the top of Brad’s list? If not, were we limited financially or were there reasons that the “bigger” names didn’t pick up the phone as we as a fan base were expecting?

 

[Illini2010-11]

I guess I’ll be the one to ask…
Was Crocker at the top of Brad’s list? If not, were we limited financially or were there reasons that the “bigger” names didn’t pick up the phone as we as a fan base were expecting?

Per earlier in the thread by 0440:

"This was a 1a and 1b situation and a lot of people close to it think this was Brads 1a"

 

[Emerson Bigguns]

As noted, the defense was top 40 KenPom. But I think the more important observation is that defense is also chemistry related, and last years team had ZERO time playing with each other previously, and then during the season, they had limited opportunities to practice defense as a unit because one or more were often sick or injured. Lack of practice translates to limited numbers of schemes done well that can be used in games. It was late in the year before they started mixing coverages on the PnR. Top 40 was not terrible under the circumstances and I think a lot of the criticism was overdone.

I think you hit on something vitally important here, so I'm going to double down on it.

We have all bemoaned the lack of continuity to some degree. Whether the lack of it is on the staff or the circumstances, the fact of the matter is that the coaches have had to totally rebuild the team two years in a row.

On offense, it's a little easier to mask miscommunication or lack of understanding of the principles of the scheme with outstanding individual play. If a play breaks down, go make one on your own. We've had guys who can do it.

It's not that simple on defense. If someone is on the wrong page or misses an assignment, you pay for it... quickly.

Nearly everyone on the team was learning new schemes and terminology last season. The coaching staff can't just keep piling on new schemes and expect it to work. The more you play together, the more complex and varied you can be in your approach. Combine the all around newness of the entire team with the injuries, illnesses, and schedule demands, and there really wasn't a lot of time to make major adjustments.

 

[Illini2010-11]

I think you hit on something vitally important here, so I'm going to double down on it.

We have all bemoaned the lack of continuity to some degree. Whether the lack of it is on the staff or the circumstances, the fact of the matter is that the coaches have had to totally rebuild the team two years in a row.

On offense, it's a little easier to mask miscommunication or lack of understanding of the principles of the scheme with outstanding individual play. If a play breaks down, go make one on your own. We've had guys who can do it.

It's not that simple on defense. If someone is on the wrong page or misses an assignment, you pay for it... quickly.

Nearly everyone on the team was learning new schemes and terminology last season. The coaching staff can't just keep piling on new schemes and expect it to work. The more you play together, the more complex and varied you can be in your approach. Combine the all around newness of the entire team with the injuries, illnesses, and schedule demands, and there really wasn't a lot of time to make major adjustments.

Last year, yes. Two years ago the primary core of the team was intact from the year before (less Domask). I think that is why it was so surprising that the team two years ago was so bad defensively...luckily the offense more than made up for it and carried the team to an E8. I expect the offense to be much better this coming year as well. If the defense steps up even marginally from this last season, then we should see better results.