Alabama

IMPE Legend · Feb 23, 2023

People need to stop citing the statement of Miller's lawyer as a factual account.

Known facts: Miles texted Miller "I need my joint". That refers to his gun. Miller brought it to him. A woman was killed.

Alabama said they didn't know about the text message until the hearing this week. They still let him play. That is disgraceful.

Boomauer · Feb 23, 2023

jjv0004 said:
Re-read the statement again from the attorney. He was already on the way to pick him up. He was not going there to give him the gun. He was already going to pick him up. He was not going there to drop off the gun. One step away from being an accomplice? He had no idea what had gone on or that anything had happened.

I always assume that a defense attorney is going to portray his client in the best way possible....leaving out things that might infer any level of guilt and pushing the storyline of complete and total innocence and virtuous character. The truth lies in between the lines somewhere.

RabidDawgClassic · Feb 23, 2023

Johnny Lawrence said:
I would be a terrible juror because unless there was empirical evidence (video, text messages, etc.) I could absolutely buy this (assuming extremely well paid) defense attorney's account. At the very least I wouldn't convict.

That would actually make you a very good juror.

battle · Feb 23, 2023

re: get our facts straight. i based my post yesterday off of the article which quotes police testimony but stated the article was so poorly written one could not determine what happened or a timeline. the reporter did not do their job to find facts or do a good job in describing the events. I would not use the attorney statement as a source of 'fact'. the article and the attorney statement conflict on numerous points, notably the request for and the delivery of the gun. criminal implications aside, the (only) point many posts are making is that when players get suspended a game for being late to a shoot around or a team meeting or other team rules, ... somehow its incredulous, Miller was not suspended at all

USAFILLINI · Feb 23, 2023

lol, the amount of people who are bending their moral compass in order to say he isn’t in the wrong is wild.

After being out all night, he brings a gun to another nightspot parking lot, where someone uses it to murder a woman. He very easily could have ignored the texts or just went home. What did he think he needed the gun for at that hour? He’s going to be taken to the bank on a wrongful death suit, and most likely would have been charged if he wasn’t a star athlete.

alaskaillini · Feb 23, 2023

Maybe it is because I am from Alaska, and the average adult male here owns from 5 to 30 guns, but I don't see where there is any case against Miller. He gave a gun to its owner. He did not give it to the murderer, and apparently did not know there was any intent of the owner to give the gun to a third party to commit murder. He lacked the requisite intent to be an accessory - you have to know of the intent to commit a murder and, with that knowledge, intentionally do something that facilitates that murder.
If you want to argue he acted with bad judgment, that is on the table. But as a college student and varsity athlete, I am not sure I would want anything to do with someone else's handgun and, if they asked for it back, I would probably want to get rid of it.

USAFILLINI · Feb 23, 2023

Miles contacted Miller and asked him to bring his gun to where they were, according to police. The gun belonged to Miles.

When Miller got to the scene, Miles told Davis, “The heat is in the hat.” Det. Branden Culpepper said that meant a gun was present.

Miles added, “There’s one in the head.” That, Culpepper said, meant a round was in the chamber.

Miles moved his girlfriend back to get her out of line of fire, Culpepper added.

Miller’s windshield was struck twice by gunfire in the shooting, police testified. Another Alabama basketball player, Jaden Bradley, was also at the scene of the shooting, according to testimony.

Point-Illinois · Feb 23, 2023

I’ve been curious about Jaden Bradley as well. Why was he there? From all accounts I’ve seen he showed up around the same time.

Why?

Why all of a sudden did both basketball players arrive right before the shooting?

It definitely could have been a coincidence. Maybe Miles texted both about being picked up. But them being in the same area at that exact time, right before the murder is interesting.

He also played last night and scored 6 points.

Riverview Farms · Feb 23, 2023

Just finished listening to Jason Whitlock's podcast on this story. Interesting take.

IlliniKat91 · Feb 23, 2023

Riverview Farms said:
Just finished listening to Jason Whitlock's podcast on this story. Interesting take.

Got a link? I've always enjoyed Whitlock's articles. I wouldn't mind listening to his podcast, too

illinitiger · Feb 23, 2023

IlliniKat91 said:
Got a link? I've always enjoyed Whitlock's articles. I wouldn't mind listening to his podcast, too

This?

Fearless with Jason Whitlock - Ep 387 | Why Alabama Basketball Star Brandon Miller Delivered Handgun to Teammate Darius Miles

Alabama sparked outrage following testimony that implicated basketball star Brandon Miller in a murder investigation. Detectives say that Miller’s former teammate, Darius Miles, texted the sophomore, asking him to meet him to retrieve a gun that Miles left in Miller’s vehicle. Miles now faces...

podcasts.google.com

theNewGuy · Feb 24, 2023

USAFILLINI said:
lol, the amount of people who are bending their moral compass in order to say he isn’t in the wrong is wild.

After being out all night, he brings a gun to another nightspot parking lot, where someone uses it to murder a woman. He very easily could have ignored the texts or just went home. What did he think he needed the gun for at that hour? He’s going to be taken to the bank on a wrongful death suit, and most likely would have been charged if he wasn’t a star athlete.

Did he do anything legally wrong?
I don't think so.

Should he face some sort of consequence for his actions?
Yes.

Ask yourself this tho. Would you want to be driving around in the middle of the night, in Alabama, with a gun that is not registered to you?
There are quite a few ways that a situation like that could go south really quick.
Did Miles purposefully or accidently leave it? idk.
but I would bring that gun back faster than you can say lickity split.

gibb52 · Feb 24, 2023

Did Miller do anything wrong? He brought a gun to a confrontation that ended in a murder. Had he said no the woman would be alive today. He contributed to her death. In a country that is constantly harping about gun violence, assault weapon bans, more and more gun laws, reducing gun violence comes down to the responsible ownership, use, and handling of firearms. Did he do the responsible thing to bring Miles his gun?

Riverview Farms · Feb 24, 2023

Thanks, Illinitiger, for the link. Jason Whitlock is a very calm speaking insightful person. He is making a point about culture that makes for a very difficult reasoned discussion. Emotions flair and preconceived ideas define arguments. I have a family full of grandchildren that don't look like me so I have a perspective that appreciates how Jason Whitlock frames his point of view.

OrangeLife · Feb 24, 2023

alaskaillini said:
Maybe it is because I am from Alaska, and the average adult male here owns from 5 to 30 guns, but I don't see where there is any case against Miller. He gave a gun to its owner. He did not give it to the murderer, and apparently did not know there was any intent of the owner to give the gun to a third party to commit murder. He lacked the requisite intent to be an accessory - you have to know of the intent to commit a murder and, with that knowledge, intentionally do something that facilitates that murder.
If you want to argue he acted with bad judgment, that is on the table. But as a college student and varsity athlete, I am not sure I would want anything to do with someone else's handgun and, if they asked for it back, I would probably want to get rid of it.

He never should have had it.... why did he? I own guns as well, but if my son texted me from a bar late at night to bring him his gun I put that on ignore.

Bigtex · Feb 24, 2023

OrangeLife said:
He never should have had it.... why did he? I own guns as well, but if my son texted me from a bar late at night to bring him his gun I put that on ignore.

agree the same for me. But we are parents - different perspective than 18-20 year olds.

WhiteHorseWings · Feb 24, 2023

alaskaillini said:
Maybe it is because I am from Alaska, and the average adult male here owns from 5 to 30 guns, but I don't see where there is any case against Miller. He gave a gun to its owner. He did not give it to the murderer, and apparently did not know there was any intent of the owner to give the gun to a third party to commit murder. He lacked the requisite intent to be an accessory - you have to know of the intent to commit a murder and, with that knowledge, intentionally do something that facilitates that murder.
If you want to argue he acted with bad judgment, that is on the table. But as a college student and varsity athlete, I am not sure I would want anything to do with someone else's handgun and, if they asked for it back, I would probably want to get rid of it.

Maybe it’s because I’m not from Alaska, but this is terrifying to me.

Johnny Lawrence · Feb 24, 2023

USAFILLINI said:
lol, the amount of people who are bending their moral compass in order to say he isn’t in the wrong is wild.

After being out all night, he brings a gun to another nightspot parking lot, where someone uses it to murder a woman. He very easily could have ignored the texts or just went home. What did he think he needed the gun for at that hour? He’s going to be taken to the bank on a wrongful death suit, and most likely would have been charged if he wasn’t a star athlete.

Is it really inconceivable that he dropped his off friends and was texting with them throughout the night without any mention of any sort or argument or trouble? College towns aren't very big. From the reports he was on his way back to pick them up and a couple minutes out when he received the text about the gun. He then pulled into a !!!! show and was just as surprised as any bystander there.

Grandpa · Feb 24, 2023

WhiteHorseWings said:
Maybe it’s because I’m not from Alaska, but this is terrifying to me.

If there were bears and wolves all around your home you might feel differently. If food was 3 times as expensive because it is basically imported from elsewhere you would probably hunt. I'm not from Alaska, but I read. Alaskaillini could tell us more if he feels like it.

chrisRunner7 · Feb 24, 2023

USAFILLINI said:
lol, the amount of people who are bending their moral compass in order to say he isn’t in the wrong is wild.

After being out all night, he brings a gun to another nightspot parking lot, where someone uses it to murder a woman. He very easily could have ignored the texts or just went home. What did he think he needed the gun for at that hour? He’s going to be taken to the bank on a wrongful death suit, and most likely would have been charged if he wasn’t a star athlete.

I think you're spot on about that prediction. There's a big difference between criminal and civil liability... no need to prove "beyond a reasonable doubt" that Miller conclusively knew something bad was about to happen.

Yost · Feb 24, 2023

One thing that I have not seen in any article is any indication of what Miller did after the shooting? Putting aside whether he should or shouldn't have brought Miles his gun late at night when he knew Miles had been partying (I would imagine a black kid in Alabama doesn't want to drive around at night with a weapon that doesn't belong to him), what did he do after he witnessed Davis walk around and shoot into a car with three people in it?

I was a defense attorney until recently and that is frequently a question prosecutors would ask. Yeah your client didn't know before [x thing], but what did they do after they found out?

2qtslow · Feb 24, 2023

He got out of there as soon as the bullets hit his windshield. His attorney says he did not know if anyone else was hit. Those shots were probably fired by Davis, but that may not be a sure thing.

Yost · Feb 24, 2023

2qtslow said:
He got out of there as soon as the bullets hit his windshield. His attorney says he did not know if anyone else was hit. Those shots were probably fired by Davis, but that may not be a sure thing.

Everyone leaves when shots are fired. That's not particularly surprising. I would take the lawyer's statement (as well as anything the police say) with a grain of salt. Miller watched someone walk around and fire into an occupied vehicle. It's reasonable to assume at that point that someone had been hit. The lawyer is using a different of "knowing" than a prosecutor typically would.

Going back to what did he do after he saw fire into that car? Did he call 911? It sounds like he did not. He was there to take Miles home according to his attorney. Did he take Miles home after the shooting?

I'm not saying that I think prosecutors should charge Miller with anything, but Brandon Miller is extremely lucky that this happened in Tuscaloosa. He clearly made a lot of really dumb decisions in a situation that resulted in the death of a young mother.

Calvin · Feb 24, 2023

BMoreIllini said:
We don't have all the facts, we probably never will, but I think it's hard to condemn a 20 year old and ruin his future with the current facts at hand.

+1
I get why people are critical of AL here, but it seems like the alternative would be its own injustice. Why would the team apply a punishment when the criminal justice system (at least at this point in time) says he's a cooperative witness? I could see suspending him if he was under suspicion, but what we know at this point is that his version of events has been vetted and he is not under suspicion.*

Put it another way, would you want to be suspended or fired from your job if it was you returning the legally owned gun to someone who'd left it in your car, and unknown to you, they lost their !@#$ and would subsequently shoot someone with it? That's the interpretation the police have at this time. The car parking is a red herring --there's no evidence that says he was doing anything other than returning the thing.

*Goes without saying, but I reserve the right to change my thoughts on this one if the facts change.

Point-Illinois · Feb 24, 2023

This is out of a Yahoo sports article that came out today:

“Miller, it was revealed via pretrial testimony by a Tuscaloosa detective, drove to the scene with a firearm belonging to Miles in the backseat of the car. Miller arrived soon after receiving a text message from Miles stating “I need my joint [gun]” and using slang to describe that some level of dispute was underway.”

The bold is interesting. It’s the first I’ve seen somebody write about more of the dialogue besides “I want my gun”. (Paraphrasing) If there was an indication of an argument/dispute used in the same few texts as wanting the gun, (and that’s a big if, none of this is necessarily fact) then it makes Miller’s decision that much worse and Bama’s decision to let it all go and hope for the best look awful.

We already know:
-It’s around midnight
-Friend has texted asking for the gun
-High likelihood friend is inebriated in some way (Miller did drop them off at a bar)

That’s already grounds to say Miller should be punished by the coach/school for a lack of good judgement. Add “-Friend mentioned a dispute/argument/situation at the same time that he asked for the gun” and the floor drops out.

I pray for Ms Harris’ little boy and their family.

Link to article