Andre Curbelo in the transfer portal

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#226      

IlliniKat91

IlliniKat91
Chicago, IL
IlliniKat91
Roundball Sage said:
So one big narrative going is that fan's public criticism of a player is enough (or at least a big factor) in his wanting to move on. That's a tough argument to make.

The place he's going... aren't there fans there too? And maybe impatient ones? And keyboard warriors who just wait for someone to screw up so that some kind of outrage can be publicly made? People are people. Fans are fans. You can't get away from them. And there is no place one can go to avoid criticism.

The best way to avoid criticism? SUCCEED. That's what you as a player want. That's what your fans want.

And as for criticism itself, there's a bad narrative these days going around that ANY criticism is bad. That is false. There is such a thing as CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. And a player is going to get both useful and useless criticism. The player must be strong and selective enough to stand up to both kinds. And learn from both kinds.

With Curbelo, this was a marriage that just wasn't going to work anymore. Either from his side, the Illini side, or both. He will take his Illini experience with him as a personal growth achievement and fine tune his considerable skills in a fresh environment.

Things didn't work out maybe the way many Illini fans had hoped. But the attempt was made. The results are in. And both the Illini and Curbelo can turn this into a Win-Win situation for both parties.
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The only issue I have with the first bit I highlighted is that it gives guys the idea that they can achieve perfection and just stop. That's not the culture I'd hope for (or see forming) around Illinois basketball. Give me that Ayo in-the-gym-and-dying-to-be-coached-24/7/365. Talent and not wanting to coast is where it's at.

As for the second, people who don't want to be coached are bad at receiving any criticism, even constructive. People are bad at giving it, too, particularly on the internet. I think they biggest difference is that places like Illinois are basketball crazy, so those fans are way more vocal on Twitter, Instagram, etc. The highs from the positive feedback end up being REALLY high, but the lows are like being dragged over hot coals.

If he ends up at a school where basketball isn't the star (like, say Miami), then he might get a little less of that.

I love Belo. He's so much fun to watch. I hope he can find a place where it's fun for him to play again, too.
 
#227      

the juiceman cometh

T
the juiceman cometh
Roundball Sage said:
And as for criticism itself, there's a bad narrative these days going around that ANY criticism is bad. That is false. There is such a thing as CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. And a player is going to get both useful and useless criticism. The player must be strong and selective enough to stand up to both kinds. And learn from both kinds.
Click to expand...
I don't think anyone on here has a problem with constructive criticism, but comments like these are not constructive:

"Looking forward to you getting an opportunity to play more minutes and set the ncaa record for most turnovers in a season!"

"I’m glad you’re leaving so you can carelessly turn the ball over for a new team and go 1/15 in FGs. Sheesh. You’re overrated. Adios hombre."

"Thank you. Our turnover ratio just improved +6 per game and our field goal % will increase by 10% as well. Best of luck with the Harlem Globetrotters."

"How did the transfer portal work out for Andre Miller; I’ll wait for your answer"

"Don’t let the door hit you in the !!! on the way out"

"Yeah we don’t fw quitters around here man."

"You won't be missed. Better without you. Feelings hurt because you turn the ball over too much. Too sensitive. Be gone. Ty!"

These were comments on his goodbye Twitter post. Nothing constructive here, just pure hate. To a guy saying bye. I love our fanbase overall. 99% of the comments were positive. But this 1% is toxic and loud and unfortunately, in this day and age, unavoidable. And I don't think just telling these guys to toughen up is the answer. I am sure the Athletic Dept has thought about how to help athletes tune out and deal with this type of "criticism" (it's online harrassment honestly), and hope that it's a priority going forward.
 
#228      

chrisRunner7

chrisRunner7
Spokane, WA
chrisRunner7
the juiceman cometh said:
I don't think anyone on here has a problem with constructive criticism, but comments like these are not constructive:

"Looking forward to you getting an opportunity to play more minutes and set the ncaa record for most turnovers in a season!"

"I’m glad you’re leaving so you can carelessly turn the ball over for a new team and go 1/15 in FGs. Sheesh. You’re overrated. Adios hombre."

"Thank you. Our turnover ratio just improved +6 per game and our field goal % will increase by 10% as well. Best of luck with the Harlem Globetrotters."

"How did the transfer portal work out for Andre Miller; I’ll wait for your answer"

"Don’t let the door hit you in the !!! on the way out"

"Yeah we don’t fw quitters around here man."

"You won't be missed. Better without you. Feelings hurt because you turn the ball over too much. Too sensitive. Be gone. Ty!"

These were comments on his goodbye Twitter post. Nothing constructive here, just pure hate. To a guy saying bye. I love our fanbase overall. 99% of the comments were positive. But this 1% is toxic and loud and unfortunately, in this day and age, unavoidable. And I don't think just telling these guys to toughen up is the answer. I am sure the Athletic Dept has thought about how to help athletes tune out and deal with this type of "criticism" (it's online harrassment honestly), and hope that it's a priority going forward.
Click to expand...
That is disturbing. I don't know why people get such a kick out of being complete jerks online.
 
#229      

IllinialuminAZ

IllinialuminAZ
IllinialuminAZ
the juiceman cometh said:
I don't think anyone on here has a problem with constructive criticism, but comments like these are not constructive:

"Looking forward to you getting an opportunity to play more minutes and set the ncaa record for most turnovers in a season!"

"I’m glad you’re leaving so you can carelessly turn the ball over for a new team and go 1/15 in FGs. Sheesh. You’re overrated. Adios hombre."

"Thank you. Our turnover ratio just improved +6 per game and our field goal % will increase by 10% as well. Best of luck with the Harlem Globetrotters."

"How did the transfer portal work out for Andre Miller; I’ll wait for your answer"

"Don’t let the door hit you in the !!! on the way out"

"Yeah we don’t fw quitters around here man."

"You won't be missed. Better without you. Feelings hurt because you turn the ball over too much. Too sensitive. Be gone. Ty!"

These were comments on his goodbye Twitter post. Nothing constructive here, just pure hate. To a guy saying bye. I love our fanbase overall. 99% of the comments were positive. But this 1% is toxic and loud and unfortunately, in this day and age, unavoidable. And I don't think just telling these guys to toughen up is the answer. I am sure the Athletic Dept has thought about how to help athletes tune out and deal with this type of "criticism" (it's online harrassment honestly), and hope that it's a priority going forward.
Click to expand...
This is insane. I generally wonder if these are, in fact, Illini fans though. I really can't fathom any "fan" doing this.
 
#233      

gibb52

G
gibb52
did he do that was the end of a lot of AC sentences.

How did he do that followed by why did he do that pretty much sums up his game.

Or in the words of Jimmy Buffet "some of its magic and some of its tragic"

Good luck to him wherever he lands.
 
#234      

Go Nats 88 Illini

Go Nats 88 Illini
Fairfax, VA
Go Nats 88 Illini
Roundball Sage said:
So one big narrative going is that fan's public criticism of a player is enough (or at least a big factor) in his wanting to move on. That's a tough argument to make.

The place he's going... aren't there fans there too? And maybe impatient ones? And keyboard warriors who just wait for someone to screw up so that some kind of outrage can be publicly made? People are people. Fans are fans. You can't get away from them. And there is no place one can go to avoid criticism.

The best way to avoid criticism? SUCCEED. That's what you as a player want. That's what your fans want.

And as for criticism itself, there's a bad narrative these days going around that ANY criticism is bad. That is false. There is such a thing as CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. And a player is going to get both useful and useless criticism. The player must be strong and selective enough to stand up to both kinds. And learn from both kinds.

With Curbelo, this was a marriage that just wasn't going to work anymore. Either from his side, the Illini side, or both. He will take his Illini experience with him as a personal growth achievement and fine tune his considerable skills in a fresh environment.

Things didn't work out maybe the way many Illini fans had hoped. But the attempt was made. The results are in. And both the Illini and Curbelo can turn this into a Win-Win situation for both parties.
Click to expand...
There is no constructive critism on a fan message board. Thank God no player comes on here to get tips of the trade...

Well, maybe constructive critism for other posters...now we may be talking.
 
#235      

Spirit of the Prairie

S
Spirit of the Prairie
Future Walk-On said:
I'm a bit weirded out by some of our fans on social media. There is a reason his accounts online are restricted from comments. Dude moves half way across the country (from a former) to a boring, flat, farmtown and gives his all for our school, yet people still have the urge to harass a 19 year old on social media.

I live in a smaller D1 bball town now and can tell you they see everything: Boards, Twitter, IG. They will search their names to find it, if they aren't tagged.

I'm not saying this is the reason he is leaving. IMO it couldn't have helped...especially when Trent has to bring it up himself publicly.

Dude was nothing but Illini love and class for his 2 seasons and in his farewell letter. He even stayed after a close coach bailed. I doubt this is a happy time for him.

The MLK Day Andre vs. Purdue is what I fear could torment us for the next 2-3 years. He is only a sophomore who missed half a season with head injuries.

We can keep hoping, but need to stop expecting 1 and done lottery picks and let the kids develop.

Start winning/losing WITH/BEHIND the team instead of thinking they are winning for you or losing to spite you.

This isn't an investment, it's a donation.
Click to expand...
Some pretty great people have chosen to go to, and stay at, what you feel is "boring farmland." It has long seemed to me that Illinois fans have an old-fashioned " inferiority complex" and it results in a kind of pathetic attitude of gratitude to players who come to Illinois. They are getting a pretty great opportunity. And "boring" is not a thing for those with imaginations and interests. "Boring farmland" has produced some of he sport's greatest basketball players. We have no idea whether Curbelo will become one of the greats. He had some sporadic - and erratic - great moments, but so have most of our players.
One of our proven "greats" is Trent Frazier. He stayed, he improved, he was unselfish. He was a better player when Curbelo was not on the court.
Don't get me wrong, I loved Curbelo when he played on the TEAM, but I also thought Giorgi was thoroughly delightful and wish he had stayed. Giorgi seemed happy to be an Illini. There are too many lingering mysteries when it comes to players - like WHY is Curbelo leaving? Why did Dee Brown lave the coaching staff? ... Etc. Guys we all thought we were in a mutually "loving" relationship with suddenly go away, leaving us shocked and wondering,"was it something we said? Was the farmland too boring?"
 
#236      

GetAWin

G
GetAWin
Spirit of the Prairie said:
Some pretty great people have chosen to go to, and stay at, what you feel is "boring farmland." It has long seemed to me that Illinois fans have an old-fashioned " inferiority complex" and it results in a kind of pathetic attitude of gratitude to players who come to Illinois. They are getting a pretty great opportunity. And "boring" is not a thing for those with imaginations and interests. "Boring farmland" has produced some of he sport's greatest basketball players. We have no idea whether Curbelo will become one of the greats. He had some sporadic - and erratic - great moments, but so have most of our players.
One of our proven "greats" is Trent Frazier. He stayed, he improved, he was unselfish. He was a better player when Curbelo was not on the court.
Don't get me wrong, I loved Curbelo when he played on the TEAM, but I also thought Giorgi was thoroughly delightful and wish he had stayed. Giorgi seemed happy to be an Illini. There are too many lingering mysteries when it comes to players - like WHY is Curbelo leaving? Why did Dee Brown lave the coaching staff? ... Etc. Guys we all thought we were in a mutually "loving" relationship with suddenly go away, leaving us shocked and wondering,"was it something we said? Was the farmland too boring?"
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If they knew how much $$$$$ that farmland was worth maybe it wouldn't be so boring!
 
#237      

Muskie2368

M
Muskie2368
I think it’s a great strategy like Adam Miller. Get the kinks and injuries out of the way for a year, then have them transfer back to the Illini. Called playing the Portal
 
#240      

GBIllini

G
GBIllini
the juiceman cometh said:
I don't think anyone on here has a problem with constructive criticism, but comments like these are not constructive:

"Looking forward to you getting an opportunity to play more minutes and set the ncaa record for most turnovers in a season!"

"I’m glad you’re leaving so you can carelessly turn the ball over for a new team and go 1/15 in FGs. Sheesh. You’re overrated. Adios hombre."

"Thank you. Our turnover ratio just improved +6 per game and our field goal % will increase by 10% as well. Best of luck with the Harlem Globetrotters."

"How did the transfer portal work out for Andre Miller; I’ll wait for your answer"

"Don’t let the door hit you in the !!! on the way out"

"Yeah we don’t fw quitters around here man."

"You won't be missed. Better without you. Feelings hurt because you turn the ball over too much. Too sensitive. Be gone. Ty!"

These were comments on his goodbye Twitter post. Nothing constructive here, just pure hate. To a guy saying bye. I love our fanbase overall. 99% of the comments were positive. But this 1% is toxic and loud and unfortunately, in this day and age, unavoidable. And I don't think just telling these guys to toughen up is the answer. I am sure the Athletic Dept has thought about how to help athletes tune out and deal with this type of "criticism" (it's online harrassment honestly), and hope that it's a priority going forward.
Click to expand...
Social media can be a double edged sword. The only thing I get on is this to keep up on Illini sports. Got off Facebook 8 months ago, don't miss it a bit.
 
#241      

STL Illini

S
STL Illini
IllinialuminAZ said:
This is insane. I generally wonder if these are, in fact, Illini fans though. I really can't fathom any "fan" doing this.
Click to expand...

If you are really wondering, I challenge you to scroll back in the Loyalty post game threads from the Marquette and Cincinnati games. These were games AC played in AFTER he was concussed, but PRIOR to his diagnosis.
Feel free to look at the vile, hate-filled, emotion driven comments from countless Loyalty members. Trust me, you’ll recognize many of the names.
It is reprehensible and embarrassing to be candid. A horrible look to these Loyalty members, to the University and it’s fan base, and to any people in a civilized country, that “fans” can become so critical and reprehensible to others over a basketball game.

If you really want to try to make a difference moving forward:
Condone these kinds of comments publicly when you read them.
Challenge these posters to be better.
Critique a play but admonish personal attacks.
Take childish and immature language out of the equation when things don’t turn out as planned.
Ask yourself if you would like these things said to your child, niece, nephew and act accordingly, and defend others accordingly.

Sorry, a soap box rant here…..of which I stand behind regardless of those that may be offended.
 
#242      

IllinialuminAZ

IllinialuminAZ
IllinialuminAZ
STL Illini said:
If you are really wondering, I challenge you to scroll back in the Loyalty post game threads from the Marquette and Cincinnati games. These were games AC played in AFTER he was concussed, but PRIOR to his diagnosis.
Feel free to look at the vile, hate-filled, emotion driven comments from countless Loyalty members. Trust me, you’ll recognize many of the names.
It is reprehensible and embarrassing to be candid. A horrible look to these Loyalty members, to the University and it’s fan base, and to any people in a civilized country, that “fans” can become so critical and reprehensible to others over a basketball game.

If you really want to try to make a difference moving forward:
Condone these kinds of comments publicly when you read them.
Challenge these posters to be better.
Critique a play but admonish personal attacks.
Take childish and immature language out of the equation when things don’t turn out as planned.
Ask yourself if you would like these things said to your child, niece, nephew and act accordingly, and defend others accordingly.

Sorry, a soap box rant here…..of which I stand behind regardless of those that may be offended.
Click to expand...
A really good point, honestly. The game threads, I think, are even worse than the post game threads in that regard. So maybe I can believe it. :confused:

That said, it takes it to an even greater level when speaking to the player directly on social media. I just don't understand the need to comment at them, especially with that kind of vitriol.
 
#244      

IllinoisssssssVarsity

I
IllinoisssssssVarsity
Illiniguy13 said:
Just remember that 99% of those posters couldn’t make their JV high school team in their wildest dreams.
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Bingo. And even people who know basketball aren’t in practice, the locker room, or on the bench. That makes our opinion on what’s going on in the Illini program 100% worthless. It makes our opinion on our players performance 100% worthless, because we lack context.

The problem is people who who comment or post negatively like that with the attitude of being right. Be real, none of us know sh*t.
 
#245      

trtl

T
trtl
STL Illini said:
If you are really wondering, I challenge you to scroll back in the Loyalty post game threads from the Marquette and Cincinnati games. These were games AC played in AFTER he was concussed, but PRIOR to his diagnosis.
Feel free to look at the vile, hate-filled, emotion driven comments from countless Loyalty members. Trust me, you’ll recognize many of the names.
It is reprehensible and embarrassing to be candid. A horrible look to these Loyalty members, to the University and it’s fan base, and to any people in a civilized country, that “fans” can become so critical and reprehensible to others over a basketball game.

If you really want to try to make a difference moving forward:
Condone these kinds of comments publicly when you read them.
Challenge these posters to be better.
Critique a play but admonish personal attacks.
Take childish and immature language out of the equation when things don’t turn out as planned.
Ask yourself if you would like these things said to your child, niece, nephew and act accordingly, and defend others accordingly.

Sorry, a soap box rant here…..of which I stand behind regardless of those that may be offended.
Click to expand...
I think “condone” should be “condemn,” and I agree with you wholeheartedly.
 
#246      

CT-55

C
CT-55
#247      

tcb13

T
tcb13
Spirit of the Prairie said:
Since so many here have cited Curbelo's injuries, especially the concussion, I have been curious about the "concussion protocol" that Underwood often mentioned. There have been players on other teams whose coaches said they had concussions - Michigan's DaVonte Jones is one - but they resumed playing fairly soon. (I think Jones only missed one game) In contrast, Curbelo and VerDonk were out for a long time. What accounts for the difference in the "protocol" if that comes from some authority like the BIG 10 or NCAA?

As a player, Curbelo brought both joy and heartbreak, and when he came onto the court during a game, the feeling of uncertainty always arose, "what's he going to do?" and I always suspected that his team mates had the same feeling, uncertainty, unpredictably. He had kind of a Dennis Rodman vibe about him.
Click to expand...

The difference in protocol and time spent in the protocol is mainly a difference in presentation of symptoms and difference in speed of recovery. The protocol is an established progression of levels of activity that can be tolerated without recurrence of symptoms (jog on a treadmill for 5 minutes...does dizziness or headache recur? If yes, sit out tomorrow and try treadmill again the day after. If no, move to the next step tomorrow) building towards full activity. I have not seen the B10 protocol, but the entry point of the protocol is sometimes dependent on level of initial symptoms (Was there loss of consciousness? If yes, 5 days with no activity. If no, begin step one of activity tomorrow). This is obviously a dramatic oversimplification, but just trying to give some insights as to why one player may take 3 days and another may take 3 months. At the D1 college level, I assume all sports do some sort of objective (not subjective) baseline testing for both cognitive and physical reactions that is repeated post injury and also factors into the timeline.
 
#249      

Spirit of the Prairie

S
Spirit of the Prairie
the juiceman cometh said:
I don't think anyone on here has a problem with constructive criticism, but comments like these are not constructive:

"Looking forward to you getting an opportunity to play more minutes and set the ncaa record for most turnovers in a season!"

"I’m glad you’re leaving so you can carelessly turn the ball over for a new team and go 1/15 in FGs. Sheesh. You’re overrated. Adios hombre."

"Thank you. Our turnover ratio just improved +6 per game and our field goal % will increase by 10% as well. Best of luck with the Harlem Globetrotters."

"How did the transfer portal work out for Andre Miller; I’ll wait for your answer"

"Don’t let the door hit you in the !!! on the way out"

"Yeah we don’t fw quitters around here man."

"You won't be missed. Better without you. Feelings hurt because you turn the ball over too much. Too sensitive. Be gone. Ty!"

These were comments on his goodbye Twitter post. Nothing constructive here, just pure hate. To a guy saying bye. I love our fanbase overall. 99% of the comments were positive. But this 1% is toxic and loud and unfortunately, in this day and age, unavoidable. And I don't think just telling these guys to toughen up is the answer. I am sure the Athletic Dept has thought about how to help athletes tune out and deal with this type of "criticism" (it's online harrassment honestly), and hope that it's a priority going forward.
Click to expand...
As you said, 99% of the comments were positive and even beyond positive, very loving and genuinely sad that he is leaving, wishing him well in his future, etc. Curbelo said something like "praise and shame, all the same," kind of like a "no skin off my nose" but in a better way. I hope his ability to deflect the online troglodytes is genuine. He seems to have a lot of self-confidence that I hope is also genuine but doesn't veer into arrogance. The other old saying that might be useful in these days of trying to ignore cruel bullies hiding behind online anonymity is "water off a duck's back."
 
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