Coaching Carousel (Basketball)

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#751      
Deacon05
If that's all true then why did they not charge him due to "lack of evidence". Even if she says yeah he didnt strangle me they would have plenty of evidence to charge him anyway?
 
#752      
Deacon05
No , some people just dont condem others without knowing the full story. Instead of the "sympathetic interpretation" , so.e of you take the most dramatic interpretation to cancel, condem, judge, and jury others with unknown facts, half truths, and misguided emotions. Goes both ways bubba.
 
#754      
the juiceman cometh
Yes, I will readily condemn a man who beats up an unarmed woman, even if she was the initial aggressor. I am proud to condemn such a man.

The only unknown facts are whether he strangled her or not. I will assume he did not, and still condemn him.

I have yet to see anyone post "Chris Beard beat up a woman and I am ok with that." Which is weird, because the fact that he beat up a woman is not even in dispute. He has never disputed it. You all just say vague things about "unknown facts" but this part is known. So if you are cool with that, just come out and say it.
 
#755      
lstewart53x3
If anyone’s read my posts over the past few days, you’ll know that I’m still positive towards Brad.

Overall, I’m happy with the on-the-court results Brad has delivered. He has lacked success in March (outside of the E8), but the regular season success has been about as good as we could hope for (over the past 5 years: top 10 in the nation in wins, top 2 in the B1G in wins, 2 regular season B1G championships, 2 B1G tournament championship).

But—I do not like the Brad Underwood off-seasons. I hate rebuilding our team each year. Not even because I don’t think we’ll be good. Brad built an entire roster from scratch this past year and we had a pretty decent season (6 seed with 4 of our top 6 players being freshman + we were without a starter in almost 40% of our games). So I’m still fairly confident with our resources, we’ll attract good players and have another decent to good season.

It’s just that it’s so hard to get emotionally invested into players you only get to watch play for one season. What made college basketball great was the player development. Watching guys like Trent and Ayo and Kofi and Coleman go from boys to men is what made the game so special. Seeing Trent go from playing on a terrible team to winning a B1G championship is unforgettable and I’ll root for that guy for the rest of his life.

I had fun watching KJ and Will play this year. Tre and Morez too. But I’ll barely even remember those guys in 10 years. KJ and Will played for the orange and blue, so I’ll root for them at the next level, but I’m not going to go out of my way to catch their games like I’ve done for Ayo and TJ.

Brad’s gotta figure out a culture that keeps kids around or I don’t see how his tenure can last a whole lot longer (and this is coming from a big BU fan).
 
#756      
RabidDawgClassic
lstewart53x3 said:
If anyone’s read my posts over the past few days, you’ll know that I’m still positive towards Brad.

Overall, I’m happy with the on-the-court results Brad has delivered. He has lacked success in March (outside of the E8), but the regular season success has been about as good as we could hope for (over the past 5 years: top 10 in the nation in wins, top 2 in the B1G in wins, 2 regular season B1G championships, 2 B1G tournament championship).

But—I do not like the Brad Underwood off-seasons. I hate rebuilding our team each year. Not even because I don’t think we’ll be good. Brad built an entire roster from scratch this past year and we had a pretty decent season (6 seed with 4 of our top 6 players being freshman + we were without a starter in almost 40% of our games). So I’m still fairly confident with our resources, we’ll attract good players and have another decent to good season.

It’s just that it’s so hard to get emotionally invested into players you only get to watch play for one season. What made college basketball great was the player development. Watching guys like Trent and Ayo and Kofi and Coleman go from boys to men is what made the game so special. Seeing Trent go from playing on a terrible team to winning a B1G championship is unforgettable and I’ll root for that guy for the rest of his life.

I had fun watching KJ and Will play this year. Tre and Morez too. But I’ll barely even remember those guys in 10 years. KJ and Will played for the orange and blue, so I’ll root for them at the next level, but I’m not going to go out of my way to catch their games like I’ve done for Ayo and TJ.

Brad’s gotta figure out a culture that keeps kids around or I don’t see how his tenure can last a whole lot longer (and this is coming from a big BU fan).
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Anyone thinking this is a Brad Underwood only type of offseason needs too look around at other programs. Just look at the sweet 16 alone — this graphic shows those teams and labels where each one’s starting five started out. As you can see, offseason roster reconstruction is a college basketball problem, not an Illinois problem.

IMG_1380.jpeg
 
#757      
RickF
An assistant coach to Illinois? Oh god. We wouldn’t get anybody. Fire Underwoods but get someone with a name
 
#760      
AZILL
Willard, lol. Yeah, let's throw a steel bar into the spokes/gears of the coaching carousel. Let it shake things up and deter us here at IL from imploding over the now-normal portal shenanigans.... I love it! I hate it! It is the NEW NORM!!! What's next?
 
#762      
illini011
If Buzz Williams goes to Maryland, will Illinois be in a bidding war with Texas A&M for Brad?
 
#763      
sacraig
RabidDawgClassic said:
Anyone thinking this is a Brad Underwood only type of offseason needs too look around at other programs. Just look at the sweet 16 alone — this graphic shows those teams and labels where each one’s starting five started out. As you can see, offseason roster reconstruction is a college basketball problem, not an Illinois problem.

View attachment 41015
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I'd be more interested in where they played the previous year.
 
#764      
lstewart53x3
RabidDawgClassic said:
Anyone thinking this is a Brad Underwood only type of offseason needs too look around at other programs. Just look at the sweet 16 alone — this graphic shows those teams and labels where each one’s starting five started out. As you can see, offseason roster reconstruction is a college basketball problem, not an Illinois problem.

View attachment 41015
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For sure, over time every team loses and gains guys through the portal.

But a portion of those guys aren’t just one year players. Like Bos and Tre, for example, they’re both transfers, but each arrived with multiple years of eligibility allowing us to build culture around them. But now Tre is gone and we’ll see what happens with Bos— hoping he comes back.

I don’t know enough about the roster management of other teams, but are a lot of other programs losing their entire team to the portal every year, including guys they want to keep?
 
#765      
grue2
Thanks. It does look like he had exactly one borderline NBA player on the team most of the time. It also looks like they were developed up. Several of them were 3* HS players.

01-04 Harris, NBA: 15yrs
02-07 Tucker, NBA: 2yrs, ~400 min court time in their career.
07-11 Leuer, NBA: ~8yrs (lesser rotation player)
12-15 Dekker, NBA: ~4yrs (1-2 games a few other seasons)
15-19 Kaminsky, NBA: ~8yrs (rotation player)
20-22 Davis, NBA: 3yrs (Currently in G-League.)

Wisconsin players currently in the NBA: None
 
#766      
ktal
DevILLDawg said:
Ole Miss is paying Chris more than Brad, although marginally. Im unaware of their facility situation/NIL etc. SEC is comparable with BIG in terms of prestige and competitiveness nationally.

What is the sell for him? Illinois has a better shot of winning in their conference IMO.

Certainly, the fanbase/donors care about winning and will do whatever it takes to achieve that.
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My response isn't to DevILLDawg specifically, I'm just using the bold to launch my rant. As I read this thread and the demands that Brad make changes or he's fired, I wonder why any coach would consider coming to a program with such an entitled and whiny fan base.

Maybe there's something rotten in the MBB program that Josh needs to address, but nobody on this board has made that case, and there's a lot of evidence that Josh takes action when needed.

Firing a person you hired is your failure, not theirs. People failing at their jobs is a leadership failure on your part, not theirs. Demanding a subordinate shake up their team is a failure on your part, not theirs. I get the sense a high percentage of this board views 'leadership' as yelling louder and escalating threats and demands. Pathetic.

Every leader needs a hammer in their tool belt, and needs to know how to use it. But if they ever have to reach for it, they already failed. Getting belligerent isn't masculine or macho, it means you screwed up, put yourself in a corner, and now need to fight your way out.

If you think Brad needs to be fired, you're saying Josh is failing and we should think about replacing him. That math don't add.
 
#768      
FrankNitty30
Ummmmm….. this is the most oversimplified BS I have ever heard.

JW is hired to put the best people in place to do the job. If he decides that person is not BU, then he moves on. It is his job. Period.
 
#769      
Illinicpa14
RabidDawgClassic said:
Anyone thinking this is a Brad Underwood only type of offseason needs too look around at other programs. Just look at the sweet 16 alone — this graphic shows those teams and labels where each one’s starting five started out. As you can see, offseason roster reconstruction is a college basketball problem, not an Illinois problem.

View attachment 41015
Click to expand...
While true - a lot of those transfers are staying in the program multiple years. For example, 3 of Auburns top 5 scorers are multiple year transfers.

Broome, Clayton, Sears, LJ cryer as top guys for their teams are 2-3 year guys at their new school. While they all were big gets, only Cryer was a P4 100% proven guy at the highest level.
 
#770      
OrangeBlue98
Not surprising at all. I would have major concerns if I were looking.
 
#771      
PepeSilvia
Im not at the point where I want Brad gone but I also don't think I'd bother getting in a bidding war if he wanted out. Take the buyout and invest it into the program/facilities.

It might be early since he hasn't had a head coaching job but I would legitimately be perfectly happy hiring Luke Murray before someone else does.

Also, would be fine with guys like Beard(I trust Whitman if he would decide to sign off on him), Chris Mack, or even a mid major guy like Alan Huss(born and coached in Decatur).

I'd also be ok with guys that haven't necessarily had a ton of success recently in Moser or Hoiberg but I think could if they were in situations with more resources(someone needs to get Fred some athletes).
 
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#772      
OrangeBlue98
Firing someone early in a tenure is a failure of the leader. If it’s after some time, then it absolutely can be the subordinate’s issue.

I 100% trust Josh Whitman to hire the coach to take Illinois to the next level.
 
#773      
OrangeBlue98
No bidding war for me. If Brad came in with that and demanded a raise, I’d tell him his raise is effective when he is. And player retention issues and staff mismanagement don’t scream “effective” to me.
 
#774      
wettsten
Illinicpa14 said:
While true - a lot of those transfers are staying in the program multiple years. For example, 3 of Auburns top 5 scorers are multiple year transfers.

Broome, Clayton, Sears, LJ cryer as top guys for their teams are 2-3 year guys at their new school. While they all were big gets, only Cryer was a P4 100% proven guy at the highest level.
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i think this is the real story. i'd like to see a graphic of where each starter played last year. i think we'd see a lot more continuity.
 
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