Football Coaching Staff / Coaching Carousel Thread

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#2,129      

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BZuppke said:
And what coach do you think has come here with the stepping stone idea in mind? I can say Tepper, White, Zook, Turner, Beckman and Lovie (pretty much all but Mackovic) came here to be successful at Illinois. Now if they had sustained success would other offers have come along? Maybe but we don’t know Turner didn’t come here to burnish his credentials to return to the nfl. He was better placed to stay in the nfl. Same with Lovie. Zook would never have left if not pushed. Same with Tepper and most likely Beckman. Just as Brohm turned down Louisville. You are correct at that the coach with the intent to use a school to move on to something better is more the issue than the school itself. Urban Meyer, Gary Barnett and Saban are examples of coaches who use schools as stepping stones. Barry Alvarez (ND wanted him), Brohm, possibly Matt Campbell and many others are coaches that stick around to enjoy their success. Is West Virginia a stepping stone school because Holgerson left? MSU and LSU because Saban left? No it’s not the school. It is the person/coach.
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I agree that it is the person more than the actual school. However, I cannot see Illinois as a final destination for that many current coaches. Wisconsin was Alvarez's, I think IL is for JW. But Ron Zook, for example, is from Ohio, and played college football within the state. I cannot say that if OSU came calling, that he would not have made the move. If he would have, then IL was a stepping stone for him. Is West Virginia and MSU stepping stones? Yes. Purdue is also a stepping stone. Louisville tried to get a home discount on Brohm, and blew it. If they would have offered him his market price, he would be at Louisville. Turner hates recruiting, why would he come to IL if not to help him get a better job in the NFL.
Basically the number of coaches currently out there now, and in the foreseeable future, are not looking at IL as their dream job. There are way to many better situations, better programs, better weather, better history that will entice individuals to move on. Yes, IL stepping stone. Slippery ace one
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#2,130      

BZuppke

BZuppke
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BZuppke
Yes not many are looking at Illinois or most schools for that matter as their dream job unless they have an emotional attachment. Heck Urban Meyer wanted nothing to do with ND even though it is a blue blood school. It’s all circumstantial. Look at Cutcliffe at Duke. Former SEC guy at a basketball school. Some people in his situation would be using Duke to get back to the SEC. He seems content to ride things out there. I’m pretty confident Lovie, if he has some success will not be looking to move on. If this comes to pass, bringing in a younger successor to a solid Big Ten program can equate to Iowa and Wisconsin like sustained success. This is very achievable and I feel pretty good that for the first time in a very long time we have an AD who knows what he’s doing. To many, this has been what’s held us back - a competent AD. Remember, before Alvarez’ success, Richter was hired as AD.
 
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mhuml32 said:
I'm talking about, following their best seasons at Illinois, did a top tier school in college or NFL interview them or think about interviewing them? Such as, did Turner get a chance at a NFL head job after the 2001 season?
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No...
 
#2,132      

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Dude said:
I agree that it is the person more than the actual school. However, I cannot see Illinois as a final destination for that many current coaches. Wisconsin was Alvarez's, I think IL is for JW. But Ron Zook, for example, is from Ohio, and played college football within the state. I cannot say that if OSU came calling, that he would not have made the move. If he would have, then IL was a stepping stone for him. Is West Virginia and MSU stepping stones? Yes. Purdue is also a stepping stone. Louisville tried to get a home discount on Brohm, and blew it. If they would have offered him his market price, he would be at Louisville. Turner hates recruiting, why would he come to IL if not to help him get a better job in the NFL.
Basically the number of coaches currently out there now, and in the foreseeable future, are not looking at IL as their dream job. There are way to many better situations, better programs, better weather, better history that will entice individuals to move on. Yes, IL stepping stone. Slippery ace one
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IMHO.... Sad to say.... that the bolded part in your post is EXACTLY the reason Illinois is NOT a stepping stone school.... Every coach that has come here since Zuppke has either failed and been fired, or was part of some scandal and been fired, except Mac... And he only left because we wouldn't match the Texas money... Besides he preferred the NFL. One coach moving on to a 'better program, better weather, better whatever' in the past 50 years doesn't make you a stepping stone... It makes you a mill-stone... And I say that with tears in my heart and in my eyes...
 
#2,133      

ktal

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ktal
I think any school that isn't a destination program, (i.e. the blue bloods who can hire their next HC from nearly any other school), is inherently a stepping stone school. It isn't a permanent condition though, as Texas, Miami, USC, ND, and LSU have all shown with recent struggles getting their dream coach.

And I agree that it's an individual thing, for some coaches their alma is their dream job. I think AD at Illinois was JW's dream job, so for him, we're not a stepping stone. But how many football coaches can you name who view Illinois as their dream job?

I also believe that Guenther's coaching searches were largely driven by the hope of finding people who were unlikely to skip town with their first taste of success. That's why Turner and Zook; they'd been higher on the ladder and gotten burned, and he believed (and probably asked flat-out before hiring them) if they could be happy here for the long term if they were successful and well treated. I really do think his entire hiring strategy was driven by trying to avoid having to do another search three years later if they had success. Although my initial claim was intended to be football specific, the Kruger and Self departures illustrate what Guenther DIDN'T want to happen.

Obviously, to step up to the Pro's a la Kruger, or to the blue bloods a la Self, you gotta win. As everyone here knows, that's not something we've been afflicted with in football, for decades. Winning program I mean, not these out-of-the-blue 'OMG we're good this year' unexpected spikes in number of wins for one season, and then go bowless the next three seasons. So we haven't necessarily fit the MAC profile of a stepping stone more because 1) the coaches haven't proven their ability to build and sustain success, and 2) because Guenther's hiring strategy aggressively avoided the 'hot coach on the rise' profile.

How many of you think Sumlin would still be here if we'd been able to hire him and he was successful? Nobody? Well then yeah, we're probably a stepping stone. Honestly, I kind of assumed that was a given, at least for football. Hell, didn't we once lose a FB HC to another school in our own league? Not ideal.
 
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ktal said:
I think any school that isn't a destination program, (i.e. the blue bloods who can hire their next HC from nearly any other school), is inherently a stepping stone school. It isn't a permanent condition though, as Texas, Miami, USC, ND, and LSU have all shown with recent struggles getting their dream coach.

And I agree that it's an individual thing, for some coaches their alma is their dream job. I think AD at Illinois was JW's dream job, so for him, we're not a stepping stone. But how many football coaches can you name who view Illinois as their dream job?

I also believe that Guenther's coaching searches were largely driven by the hope of finding people who were unlikely to skip town with their first taste of success. That's why Turner and Zook; they'd been higher on the ladder and gotten burned, and he believed (and probably asked flat-out before hiring them) if they could be happy here for the long term if they were successful and well treated. I really do think his entire hiring strategy was driven by trying to avoid having to do another search three years later if they had success. Although my initial claim was intended to be football specific, the Kruger and Self departures illustrate what Guenther DIDN'T want to happen.

Obviously, to step up to the Pro's a la Kruger, or to the blue bloods a la Self, you gotta win. As everyone here knows, that's not something we've been afflicted with in football, for decades. Winning program I mean, not these out-of-the-blue 'OMG we're good this year' unexpected spikes in number of wins for one season, and then go bowless the next three seasons. So we haven't necessarily fit the MAC profile of a stepping stone more because 1) the coaches haven't proven their ability to build and sustain success, and 2) because Guenther's hiring strategy aggressively avoided the 'hot coach on the rise' profile.

How many of you think Sumlin would still be here if we'd been able to hire him and he was successful? Nobody? Well then yeah, we're probably a stepping stone. Honestly, I kind of assumed that was a given, at least for football. Hell, didn't we once lose a FB HC to another school in our own league? Not ideal.
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If you are referring to Gary Molface going to Michigan, I think we sent him and a high draft choice and got a bag of beans in return...we were on the winning end of that trade.😁
 
#2,135      

BZuppke

BZuppke
Plainfield
BZuppke
Again I think this is all so circumstantial. I’ll add Ray Eliot as another who retired here with a winning record and his dignity intact. Regardless we like many schools, are one Alvarez away from being where we want to be. There is nothing inherently wrong at Illinois.
 
#2,136      

ktal

ktal
ktal
BZuppke said:
Again I think this is all so circumstantial. I’ll add Ray Eliot as another who retired here with a winning record and his dignity intact. Regardless we like many schools, are one Alvarez away from being where we want to be. There is nothing inherently wrong at Illinois.
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In fact I think there's a lot at Illinois that makes the Alvarez scenario more achievable than it would be at many other schools, (e.g. recruiting base, B1G competition, enormous fan base, and C-U offers a higher quality of life at a lower price point than most places), who are trying to make the same leap. I sure hope Lovie is our Alvarez.
 
#2,140      

illinipioneer

illinipioneer
Richmond, VA
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ILL_INI said:
For what position? The Head Coach / Defensive Coordinator / Assistant Linebackers Coach position has already been filled.
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At this point I am totally expecting a defensive coach to be hired for the open offensive position.....It would just make sense....in that it makes no sense
 
#2,141      

breadman

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Herndon, VA
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ILL_INI said:
For what position? The Head Coach / Defensive Coordinator / Assistant Linebackers Coach position has already been filled.
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Under the dictate of never saying never. Maybe Associate Head Coach DC?
 
#2,144      

ILL_INI

ILL_INI
ILL_INI
illini0440 said:
If i were a betting man I would bet the spots are filled just waiting for logistics before announcing.;)
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OK, I'm betting the beach house on Garin Justice for OL Coach.

RB Coach? S&C Coach? Anyone with any guesses?
 
#2,146      

illiniwil

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illiniwil
I would be doing cartwheels in the street if we change direction and hired Jim Leavitt. Sadly
I fear I will not get that chance to break my hip on Main street.
 
#2,147      

illiniwil

I
illiniwil
I do however approve the O line coach if it is Garin Justice. A
certain big time program pedigree and apparently Rod Smith's
choice.

Correct me if I'm wrong but this wasn't the first time Coach Butkus
left after some internal turmoil?
 
#2,149      

Deleted member 654622

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BZuppke said:
Again I think this is all so circumstantial. I’ll add Ray Eliot as another who retired here with a winning record and his dignity intact. Regardless we like many schools, are one Alvarez away from being where we want to be. There is nothing inherently wrong at Illinois.
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I don't believe there is anything inherently wrong with Illinois either. I don't believe calling a school a stepping stone has a negative connotation.
 
#2,150      

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mossimo142 said:
Somewhat childish and scorned/jilted lover take on Miles as the hard working LB coach. The dude didn't even know it was one of his players Bday, while I saw coaches on the offensive side acknowledging it!

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1095841590818545664
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If it makes you feel better, you can say he is so focused on his job that a players b-day is insignificant to him.

Also to be fair, those other tweets by the Offensive coaches, were responses to Milo's birthday tweet as well. Miles just added in that he didn't know. Zero indication that Corey or Rod knew it was his birthday
 
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