Illini Basketball 2023-2024

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#152      

Fighter of the Nightman

Fighter of the Nightman
Chicago, IL
Fighter of the Nightman
illini0440 said:
I am so sick of the point guard narrative....we have the number 2 offense in the nation. Show me a PG who has the ball in his hands as much as Marcus does and I bet he has a higher turnover %.
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Yeah, I have never been that concerned about that. My main concerns have been the following:

1. Our defense ... but we really stepped up vs. Purdue. If we play D like that with our offense, we have a high ceiling.

2. Late game "composure" vs. big-time opponents. Don't get me wrong, we have definitely closed some teams out, and I actually sometimes think it is a weakness of a team if someone like Ayo is 110% for sure going one on one for that final shot to tie/win. However, I feel like I should be a little more confident with studs like Marcus or TSJ in the final minute when we need a bucket badly. Just a very uninformed opinion as a fan who has watched every game on the edge of his seat!
 
#154      

abchew2

A
abchew2
Fighter of the Nightman said:
I agree, but man ... it just sucks we have come up just short in all of our biggest tests. I initially thought we at least got FAU in the bag, but they have really fallen apart. As I posted in the Bracketology thread, we have a winning record against teams currently projected in the Tournament ... but we are 0-3 vs. #1 seeds (Purdue x2 and Kentucky) and 0-1 vs. #2 seeds (Marquette). Those are the opponents we will play if we get past the Second Round - something identified by many as a sort of bare minimum expectation for a group this talented. While the Sweet Sixteen is the ultimate goal right now and therefore a clear success, it would be devastating to come up short of an Elite Eight run that was there for the taking because we just can't hit the late shots. TSJ, Coleman and Domask are starting down the end of their college careers ... let's hope one of them catches Deron Williams Fever and hits the huge shots we need this March!
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I’m hoping they are able to get over that hump in the tournament. Those top ten victories during the year generally fade quick if you can’t get them when it matters most.
 
#156      

Chad Fleck

Chad Fleck
Eureka, IL
Chad Fleck
I haven't been on about the PG problem. But I will say I'm jealous of a slick handling PG that can square up and knock down a shot late in a game. Marcus hasn't really shown what I'm thinking of. Terrance can, but it's not quite what I'm thinking either.
 
#157      

danielb927

danielb927
Orange Krush Class of 2013
Rochester, MN
danielb927
abchew2 said:
I’m hoping they are able to get over that hump in the tournament. Those top ten victories during the year generally fade quick if you can’t get them when it matters most.
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Good point. I would rather miss out on them now and get them in the tournament than vice-versa - we've been there too many times.
 
#158      

NarrowJ

NarrowJ
NarrowJ
Chad Fleck said:
I haven't been on about the PG problem. But I will say I'm jealous of a slick handling PG that can square up and knock down a shot late in a game. Marcus hasn't really shown what I'm thinking of. Terrance can, but it's not quite what I'm thinking either.
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Marcus doesn't settle for a pullup at the elbow, he takes it all the way to the cup
 
#159      

21ChampaignSt

21ChampaignSt
21ChampaignSt
NarrowJ said:
1000000% sick of it

Marcus turnover percentage is one of the tops in the country, and his passing/vision continues to improve as the season has progressed
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I don't think this is true.

But agree with the overall idea. The only time point guard play has been an issue is when the poor defensive play has left us with zero margin for error at the end of games.
 
#160      

NarrowJ

NarrowJ
NarrowJ
21ChampaignSt said:
I don't think this is true.

But agree with the overall idea. The only time point guard play has been an issue is when the poor defensive play has left us with zero margin for error at the end of games.
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It's true for guys with his usage percentage, lets put it that way. Then, its 100% true.

It would be correct that a guy playing SF who camps in the corner on offense and has a sub-12% usage rate probably has a lower turnover rate.
 
#161      

Second place is 1st loser

S
Second place is 1st loser
illini0440 said:
I am so sick of the point guard narrative....we have the number 2 offense in the nation. Show me a PG who has the ball in his hands as much as Marcus does and I bet he has a higher turnover %.
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It's not offensively, which is where people's minds immediately go to when they talk about that position.

It's defensively where the issue lies. No reasonable person can expect Domask, Goode, etc to stay in front of a quicker, shiftier guard for 40 minutes. They just don't have the foot speed or agility. Picking them up in transition has been an issue and chasing them off the three point line has proven to be difficult.

Offensively, Domask takes advantage. He's a huge part of our offense. Defensively....a good PG breaks our defense down and it continually puts Hawkins in a pick your poison spot.

To me, this is where we miss Harris badly. He could shut the water off. We don't have that and opposing coaching have continually exploited it.

JMO
 
#162      

NarrowJ

NarrowJ
NarrowJ
Second place is 1st loser said:
It's not offensively, which is where people's minds immediately go to when they talk about that position.

It's defensively where the issue lies. No reasonable person can expect Domask, Goode, etc to stay in front of a quicker, shiftier guard for 40 minutes. They just don't have the foot speed or agility. Picking them up in transition has been an issue and chasing them off the three point line has proven to be difficult.

Offensively, Domask takes advantage. He's a huge part of our offense. Defensively....a good PG breaks our defense down and it continually puts Hawkins in a pick your poison spot.

To me, this is where we miss Harris badly. He could shut the water off. We don't have that and opposing coaching have continually exploited it.

JMO
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TJ guards those guys for the most part, not Domask.

Wisconsin - TJ on Hepburn, Domask on Klesmit
Iowa - TJ on Perkins, Domask on Nix

Just for instance.
 
#163      

jumpingjack

J
jumpingjack
Guest said:
And BU had less to work with when he got here. UM and UW weren't the dumpster fires that the Illinois program was. Unfortunately, it is Coach of the Year, not "of the Last Five Years. I don't mean that to sound heartless or whatever but it is what it is. Maybe if they had a Coach of the Decade BU would win. I think Hoiberg will win it this year.
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Vomit Eww GIF by The Bachelor Australia
 
#164      

Second place is 1st loser

S
Second place is 1st loser
NarrowJ said:
TJ guards those guys for the most part, not Domask.

Wisconsin - TJ on Hepburn, Domask on Klesmit
Iowa - TJ on Perkins, Domask on Nix

Just for instance.
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TJ gets switched from half to half. At 6'6", it's unreasonable to expect him to shut down a smaller, shiftier guards.

Even at that, you're saying that he has to compensate for what we're lacking on the roster. In both games you noted, he was put on three separate guys.

Loyer AND Smith went off yesterday. Why?

Honest question....do you think that it's just bad luck that we're getting torched from beyond the stripe and our overall defensive rating is in the 100s?

What are you going to attribute that to? Obviously, our defense is a problem. That's just an undeniable fact. Where are the holes?
 
#165      

NarrowJ

NarrowJ
NarrowJ
Second place is 1st loser said:
TJ gets switched from half to half. At 6'6", it's unreasonable to expect him to shut down a smaller, shiftier guards.

Even at that, you're saying that he has to compensate for what we're lacking on the roster. In both games you noted, he was put on three separate guys.

Loyer AND Smith went off yesterday. Why?

Honest question....do you think that it's just bad luck that we're getting torched from beyond the stripe and our overall defensive rating is in the 100s?

What are you going to attribute that to? Obviously, our defense is a problem. That's just an undeniable fact. Where are the holes?
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I've harped on and on about our defense and how we need it to improve. We're in total agreement there.

I thought we were talking about the complaints about not having a PG to play defense on smaller, shiftier guards? Wasn't that what your original reply was? Answer is TJ and Ty guard them. Domask doesn't have the lateral quickness, so he gets a slower player on defense if at all possible.

TJ and Ty have the athleticism, quickness and length to guard these players, but for some reason have largely been unsuccessful. How's that MD's fault?
 
#166      

Fighter of the Nightman

Fighter of the Nightman
Chicago, IL
Fighter of the Nightman
abchew2 said:
I’m hoping they are able to get over that hump in the tournament. Those top ten victories during the year generally fade quick if you can’t get them when it matters most.
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Agreed. While I, as a fanatic, will have fond memories of the UCLA win in Vegas and upsetting Texas at MSG ... a fan like my dad will practically forget that season ever existed. And for a pretty good reason. This team has been a joy to watch, and I think they will be remembered fondly by the diehards like us, and they deserve to be. However, they have the chance to go down in Illini history right in front of them. Season starts over in just a couple days!
 
#167      

OrangeKrush1981

OrangeKrush1981
OrangeKrush1981
illini0440 said:
I am so sick of the point guard narrative....we have the number 2 offense in the nation. Show me a PG who has the ball in his hands as much as Marcus does and I bet he has a higher turnover %.
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That's a great point.

But I think the best overall measure is of a point guard -- both ends of the floor and everywhere in between (things like loose balls) -- is wins. This is kinda a dumb suggestion in some ways, I admit. I guess I think that a guy who finds every little way he can to win combined with elite (Bradism!) agility, speed, ballhandling, great hands on defense, and court awareness is often the guy that puts his team over the top in close games at the collegiate level.
 
#169      

Second place is 1st loser

S
Second place is 1st loser
NarrowJ said:
I've harped on and on about our defense and how we need it to improve. We're in total agreement there.

I thought we were talking about the complaints about not having a PG to play defense on smaller, shiftier guards? Wasn't that what your original reply was? Answer is TJ and Ty guard them. Domask doesn't have the lateral quickness, so he gets a slower player on defense if at all possible.

TJ and Ty have the athleticism, quickness and length to guard these players, but for some reason have largely been unsuccessful. How's that MD's fault?
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That's a fair response to the specific PG comment.

I have absolutely nothing negative to say about MD. He takes full advantage of his size offensively. He's incredible. My take is that it's that same size that's creating his issues defensively. He's out of position. That's not his fault.

My assumption is that we need shiftier and quicker to guard shiftier and quicker. Give the position on the opposing teams roster that's hurting us...I drew the parallel.

To be clear, I think that MD, TS, TR, LG are doing as much as humanly possible to depend the position. If SH was available...that assignment would fall on him.
 
#170      

derrick6

D
Illini Dawg
Seattle
derrick6
While I am team Domask at PG (doing amazing), I do think a faster tempo, dribble drive distributor that causes havoc on the defense would be extremely valuable.

Also, having Domask bring the ball up the court seems excessive for all the things he does for the team already.

Seems like a lot of effective alternatives exist.

Have to do something to save our guys for the last 10 minutes of the game.
 
#172      

NarrowJ

NarrowJ
NarrowJ
BRucks said:
His assist to turnover ratio is 13th best in the conference (1.6): https://bigten.org/stats.aspx?path=mbball&year=2023
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So... better than Jahmir Young. That's really really good for a guy who isn't a PG according to many. Also, he's more of a scorer than a passer, although his passing/vision has improved dramatically as the season has wore on.

His efficiency ratings and turnover rates are elite for a guy with his usage rate.

Marcus has a 13% turnover rate. For reference:

RayJ Dennis 22%
Zeke Zeigler 19%
Tyler Kolek 18%
Dajuan Harris 22%
Tristan Newton 16%
Braden Smith 20%

EDIT: Went back through game logs. Marcus Domask's assist to turnover ratio since Jan 1 is 88:34 or 2.6 ratio. Good enough for a tie with Braden Smith for #5 on the list you linked me.
 
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#173      

IlliniCub 16

IlliniCub 16
IlliniCub 16
samtheman10 said:
High praise for our NIL resources in Matt Norlander at CBS' weekly column (he relied on Trilly Donovan for the answer who was interviewed as part of the article.)

Link
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Who is considered number one in the Big Ten in terms of NIL funding? I feel like @Indy Illini Fan has alluded to it being Indiana? I can't think of anyone else who has brought in bigger names in terms of the portal and high school recruiting than them. Who are the top five?

I would guess Indiana, the Illini, Purdue and then Rutgers, Michigan, Michigan State or Ohio State right around the top five.

Rutgers has the incredible class next season but losing guys like Mulcahy and Cam Spencer to the portal shows they are still more limited than the top three schools.
 
#175      

blackdog

blackdog
Champaign
blackdog
NarrowJ said:
So... better than Jahmir Young. That's really really good for a guy who isn't a PG according to many. Also, he's more of a scorer than a passer, although his passing/vision has improved dramatically as the season has wore on.

His efficiency ratings and turnover rates are elite for a guy with his usage rate.

Marcus has a 13% turnover rate. For reference:

RayJ Dennis 22%
Zeke Zeigler 19%
Tyler Kolek 18%
Dajuan Harris 22%
Tristan Newton 16%
Braden Smith 20%

EDIT: Went back through game logs. Marcus Domask's assist to turnover ratio since Jan 1 is 88:34 or 2.6 ratio. Good enough for a tie with Braden Smith for #5 on the list you linked me.
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Which just further adds to how impressive he has been. How many guys get into B1G conference play and see their numbers go UP!
 
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