Illini Basketball 2026-2027

#101      
AnnoyedWithGarza
RollChief said:
Yeah I'm not trying to be overly verbose but just trying to emphasize that he's great for our system but doesn't/won't fit the typical PG mold, which is the main hang up you're bringing up where people say he/KW aren't PGs.

Jeremy Fears, Braden Smith, and Donovan Dent, your prototypical great PGs, averaged 8.4, 8.8, and 7.6 assists/game and were ranked 1-3 in the stat. Keaton Wagler had 4.2 assists/game and was ranked 133 in the stat. Mihailo Petrovic, your prototypical PG, averaged 7.3 assists/game at Mega Superbet. KW fit very well into our system and how we initiate offense while Petro did not.

Vaaks had 3.2 assists per game. While he doesn't jump out as a traditional PG statistically or even when you watch him play, he plugs in really well to that role as initiator in a way that prototypical PGs don't.
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Is Steph Curry a PG? Averaged under 5 assists per game last year.

PG does not mean you have to pass the ball more than you shoot anymore. Some of you are just stuck in the idea of what a PG was and can only imagine a PG as the old-school version. The PG is the guy who makes the decisions within an offense. Some are pass-first (higher assist numbers); some are score-first (can then be categorized as more of a SG or CG). PG is not what it used to be. He is the person making the decisions within the offense most of the game.

Vaaks was a PG last year. Keaton was a PG last year. It doesn't matter what they will play at the next level. They are controlling the offense and therefore are the PG. I don't know (neither does anyone else), but I'm willing to believe that Vaaks will be our PG this year.

I would like a definition of PG from those of you who think Vaaks didn't play PG last year and Keaton didn't play PG last year.

I'll even go as far as to say that our offensive PG may not be our defensive PG. I would say that Boswell was the defensive PG and Keaton was the offensive PG.

It also doesn't need to be the guy who breaks a press or brings the ball up the floor. There were times last year when Mirk brought the ball up the floor to get pressure off, brought it, and immediately handed the ball to Keaton. Keaton was still playing PG.
 
#104      
March2TheArch
Love Kylan but he completely lost his shot after the injury down the stretch.

This year, however, we have 4 starters that can shoot 35%+ and Dre is one of the best finishers at the rim. And he’s backed up by Jake who’s a flamethrower. I imagine our first subs 6-7min into the game will be Jake for Dre and an Ivisic swap. Allows us to keep 4 shooters on the floor.

I think the wildcard is Lucas Morillo. If his back heals and can nudge his 3pt% into the lower 30s, he can give us the 10-15min we need to back up the guard spots. We need a secondary ball handler if/when one of Vaaks or Mirk are on the bench. I’d rather keep Quentin off ball to preserve his energy to be a two-way player.
 
#105      
RollChief
AnnoyedWithGarza said:
Is Steph Curry a PG? Averaged under 5 assists per game last year.

PG does not mean you have to pass the ball more than you shoot anymore. Some of you are just stuck in the idea of what a PG was and can only imagine a PG as the old-school version. The PG is the guy who makes the decisions within an offense. Some are pass-first (higher assist numbers); some are score-first (can then be categorized as more of a SG or CG). PG is not what it used to be. He is the person making the decisions within the offense most of the game.

Vaaks was a PG last year. Keaton was a PG last year. It doesn't matter what they will play at the next level. They are controlling the offense and therefore are the PG. I don't know (neither does anyone else), but I'm willing to believe that Vaaks will be our PG this year.

I would like a definition of PG from those of you who think Vaaks didn't play PG last year and Keaton didn't play PG last year.

I'll even go as far as to say that our offensive PG may not be our defensive PG. I would say that Boswell was the defensive PG and Keaton was the offensive PG.

It also doesn't need to be the guy who breaks a press or brings the ball up the floor. There were times last year when Mirk brought the ball up the floor to get pressure off, brought it, and immediately handed the ball to Keaton. Keaton was still playing PG.
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Hey man I agree with you, I think most other folks here do too, wasn't trying to start an argument. I was just pointing out that our scheme (like a lot of NBA schemes) no longer follows the prototype "6-1, quick guy with nifty handles with 8 assists a game" type PG, and the lines between our player positions are a lot more fluid now.

I think the people who disagree are guys like Raphael Davis who look at our roster and player stats and see "no clear PG" and say "Vaaks isn't a PG". I rewatched the highlights from 2025 Bragging Rights last night and one of the things I thought about is that when you have 3-5 on the floor that can shoot, dish it, and initiate offense off of offensive rebounds, the usefulness of your traditional PG (or other traditional roles) is less necessary.
 
#106      
RabidDawgClassic
This time last year we generally thought:

1) Tomi would be the best player.
2) Wagler would be a nice bench piece and perhaps an eventual starter as we’ve heard good things about him.
3) Mirk was a crazy hothead who’s gonna get a ton of technicals.
4) Petro’s a sure-fire starter point guard. Just hope his hamstring is okay.
5) Stojakovic is likely gone after the season, either to the NBA or the portal
6. We’ve never had a deeper bench!

I wonder what surprises are in store for us this coming season.
 
#110      
HoopsterMan
RabidDawgClassic said:
This time last year we generally thought:

1) Tomi would be the best player.
2) Wagler would be a nice bench piece and perhaps an eventual starter as we’ve heard good things about him.
3) Mirk was a crazy hothead who’s gonna get a ton of technicals.
4) Petro’s a sure-fire starter point guard. Just hope his hamstring is okay.
5) Stojakovic is likely gone after the season, either to the NBA or the portal
6. We’ve never had a deeper bench!

I wonder what surprises are in store for us this coming season.
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Give it to Brad, he's built great culture and has found guys that really like playing with each other.
 
#111      
Fly Illini Fly!
RollChief said:
I think one important 3rd variable to add here is Average 2-point attempt distance (Avg 2PA Dist, added to KenPom this year). We were 7th in the nation with an Avg 2PA Dist of 7 feet. While our rim% wasn't great, we were generally keeping teams away from the rim better than most.
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Fly Illini Fly! said:
That's likely a good point.

While we were 166th nationally in rim% defense, we were 38th in 2pt% defense.

The 2pt% defense was 13th amongst High Major teams (yes, actually amongst high majors. In the team stats section, that wasn't an issue.)
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Most “far twos” given up in the country last year, Illinois #4:

IMG_1529.jpeg


(which is good; what you don’t want to give up are the close twos)
 
#112      
OB positive
PleaseMakeABowlGame said:
We were the tallest team in the country. I don’t think 42nd in rim defense is something to feel ecstatic about.

I’d be willing to bet all of the recent national champs have had very good rim protection (including UConn with Clingan).
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In the tournament we ratcheted up our defense to another level. That contributed to our final four run. I don't know if that was an outlier or that we're turning the corner on having a better defense overall but it has me optimistic for this coming year. It reminds me of the NBA where most teams rely on their offense throughout the year but focus a lot more on defense in the playoffs.
 
#113      
Fly Illini Fly!
Fly Illini Fly! said:
Most “far twos” given up in the country last year, Illinois #4:

View attachment 51476

(which is good; what you don’t want to give up are the close twos)
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P.S. Illinois gave up the 4th most mid range shots in the country.

And Houston TOOK the most mid range shots in the country:

IMG_1530.jpeg


That game was just a situation of: allowing them to shoot the shots they love to take… because they were the shots we wanted them to take.

…..

In that Sweet 16 game:

Houston took 25 mid range shots. Illinois took 11.

Houston took just 7 shots at the rim. Illinois took 17.

There’s your ballgame.
 
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#115      
AnnoyedWithGarza
RollChief said:
Hey man I agree with you, I think most other folks here do too, wasn't trying to start an argument. I was just pointing out that our scheme (like a lot of NBA schemes) no longer follows the prototype "6-1, quick guy with nifty handles with 8 assists a game" type PG, and the lines between our player positions are a lot more fluid now.

I think the people who disagree are guys like Raphael Davis who look at our roster and player stats and see "no clear PG" and say "Vaaks isn't a PG". I rewatched the highlights from 2025 Bragging Rights last night and one of the things I thought about is that when you have 3-5 on the floor that can shoot, dish it, and initiate offense off of offensive rebounds, the usefulness of your traditional PG (or other traditional roles) is less necessary.
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Sorry if I came off as combative. I wasn't trying to argue with you either; I was using your words to get all of my thoughts out about this whole thread.
 
#116      
Fly Illini Fly!
"Point guard" means primary ball handler.

If a player is our primary ball handler, then yes I'd call them our point guard. It's too complicated to want to refer to them as anything else, because that's literally what the term means.

Casual, low-intellectual minds have chosen to make the definition "smallest guy on the court." (But in reality, it's not)
 
#117      
Fly Illini Fly!
RollChief said:
Jeremy Fears, Braden Smith, and Donovan Dent, your prototypical great PGs, averaged 8.4, 8.8, and 7.6 assists/game and were ranked 1-3 in the stat. Keaton Wagler had 4.2 assists/game and was ranked 133 in the stat. Mihailo Petrovic, your prototypical PG, averaged 7.3 assists/game at Mega Superbet. KW fit very well into our system and how we initiate offense while Petro did not.
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Ohio State's point guard, Bruce Thornton, was 6"2 and had a 21.9% assist rate.

St. John’s point guard, Dylan Darling, was 6"1 and had a 20.6% assist rate.

Auburn's point guard, Tahaad Pettiford, was 6"1 and had a 22.5% assist rate.

Illinois's point guard, Keaton Wagler, was 6"6 and had a 23.2% assist rate.

No certainty that just because your more "prototypical" by being smaller, that you'll have more assists or be a better facilitator.
 
#118      
Fly Illini Fly!
Big Z's rim protector numbers are very similar to Mara.

Big Z block rate: 12.9%
Mara block rate: 12.0%

• Opponents shot 54.7% at the rim when Mara was on the court, versus 60.6% at the rim when he was off the court.

• Opponents shot 55.2% at the rim when Z was on the court, versus 60.2% at the rim when he was off the court.
 
#119      
PleaseMakeABowlGame
Fly Illini Fly! said:
P.S. Illinois gave up the 4th most mid range shots in the country.

And Houston TOOK the most mid range shots in the country:

View attachment 51479

That game was just a situation of: allowing them to shoot the shots they love to take… because they were the shots we wanted them to take.

…..

In that Sweet 16 game:

Houston took 25 mid range shots. Illinois took 11.

Houston took just 7 shots at the rim. Illinois took 17.

There’s your ballgame.
Click to expand...
Usually when they have a bad offensive game, they try to play really good defense and squeeze the light out of the other team. But, Illinois was too good for that.

I think Illinois matched up better with Houston than Florida.

I think Houston matched up better with Florida than Illinois.

Florida was a poor shooting team, so Houston might've been able to hold them to an equally bad offensive output.
 
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#120      
WhereDoWeStandWithStorr?
Fly Illini Fly! said:
P.S. Illinois gave up the 4th most mid range shots in the country.

And Houston TOOK the most mid range shots in the country:

View attachment 51479

That game was just a situation of: allowing them to shoot the shots they love to take… because they were the shots we wanted them to take.

…..

In that Sweet 16 game:

Houston took 25 mid range shots. Illinois took 11.

Houston took just 7 shots at the rim. Illinois took 17.

There’s your ballgame.
Click to expand...
Holding any high major opponent to 7 shots at the rim is incredibly, incredibly rare. Let alone a 2 seed in the Sweet 16.
 
#121      
RichardKeenesCousin
Fly Illini Fly! said:
"Point guard" means primary ball handler.

If a player is our primary ball handler, then yes I'd call them our point guard. It's too complicated to want to refer to them as anything else, because that's literally what the term means.

Casual, low-intellectual minds have chosen to make the definition "smallest guy on the court." (But in reality, it's not)
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I wouldn't call myself a casual Illini fan, but I do identify as low-intellectual.
 
#122      
wc_illini
OB positive said:
In the tournament we ratcheted up our defense to another level. That contributed to our final four run. I don't know if that was an outlier or that we're turning the corner on having a better defense overall but it has me optimistic for this coming year. It reminds me of the NBA where most teams rely on their offense throughout the year but focus a lot more on defense in the playoffs.
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I really hope so. I got excited after the first three games (6.6pts/100 better than our season avg), but the last two were a letdown (1.8pts/100 worse than our season avg). The tournament as a whole was still an improvement (3.3pts/100 better) and would've put us at #12 if that had been our season avg.

These are all tiny sample sizes of course.
 
#124      
Combo
RabidDawgClassic said:
This time last year we generally thought:

1) Tomi would be the best player.
2) Wagler would be a nice bench piece and perhaps an eventual starter as we’ve heard good things about him.
3) Mirk was a crazy hothead who’s gonna get a ton of technicals.
4) Petro’s a sure-fire starter point guard. Just hope his hamstring is okay.
5) Stojakovic is likely gone after the season, either to the NBA or the portal
6. We’ve never had a deeper bench!

I wonder what surprises are in store for us this coming season.
Click to expand...
#6 is every year since I can remember.
 
#125      
Fly Illini Fly!
wc_illini said:
I really hope so. I got excited after the first three games (6.6pts/100 better than our season avg), but the last two were a letdown (1.8pts/100 worse than our season avg). The tournament as a whole was still an improvement (3.3pts/100 better) and would've put us at #12 if that had been our season avg.

These are all tiny sample sizes of course.
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Graph of all our High Major games, compared to our season average for points per possession given up against High Major opponents:

IMG_1532.jpeg
 
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