If you can't see why he was in the conversation for the NBA draft, im not sure I can help you. His physical talents and versatility are just as glaringly obvious as his struggles with decision making. His decision making makes his shot look bad, makes it look like he can't create, and he ends up forcing bad passes. He's absolutely shown the ability to do everything, but he's not looking for his points. He's actually a lot more under control this year than in the past, but his refusal to take advantage of his scoring opportunities leaves your head scratching and makes him look lost sometimes. Yes, his 3pt% is deceiving, just as anybody will look like a bad shooter when they take dumb shots. Its not hard to tell the difference between somebody that just stinks and somebody who is constantly putting themselves in bad positions. That's also on the coaching staff as well. Hawkins is our most versatile player and physically the most gifted player on the court almost every game. Don't let his decision making fool you.
Illinois 85, Bethune-Cookman 52 Postgame
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Lol. You are trying too hard.
Is this what you tell teachers when your kid gets a D in a class at school?Let's translate; he is more talented than every player on the court but after playing basketball for only 15 years he still just doesn't quite know what to do or when to do it in an actual basketball game yet, and it is the staff's job to fix that.
Let me try and help you. The team with the players who help their team score more points and stop the other team from doing so win. He either actually does those things for us or he doesn't.
It isn't going to matter that he looks better than anybody else in warmups (I would debate that) in Evanston if we walk out of there 0 and 3 in some part due to him throwing outlet passes to the cheerleaders and missing more shots than he made.
It's been obvious since he got here that he has some talent but is usually in his own way.
At some point he just needs to produce consistently.
I agree with bavanga3 wholeheartedly on this...Lol. You are trying too hard.
Let's translate; he is more talented than every player on the court but after playing basketball for only 15 years he still just doesn't quite know what to do or when to do it in an actual basketball game yet, and it is the staff's job to fix that.
Let me try and help you. The team with the players who help their team score more points and stop the other team from doing so win. He either actually does those things for us or he doesn't.
It isn't going to matter that he looks better than anybody else in warmups (I would debate that) in Evanston if we walk out of there 0 and 3 in some part due to him throwing outlet passes to the cheerleaders and missing more shots than he made.
It's been obvious since he got here that he has some talent but is usually in his own way.
At some point he just needs to produce consistently.
"He's actually a lot more under control this year than in the past, but his refusal to take advantage of his scoring opportunities leaves your head scratching and makes him look lost sometimes."
Excluding scoring there are 4 positive and one negative stats for an individual In a game. Positive being blocks, rebounds, assists, and steals. The negative stat is turnovers. Hawkins positives average for a game is12.8 versus negative average of 3.2. The difference is 9.6, the next best difference for any player is 7.1.
I also have watched some video of the 1988 team recently. I had the same thought in terms of their focus on taking the ball inside. The offensive would be totally foreign to what most teams are doing today: - an offense that features 2 post players with 3 perimeter players.
The NBA often drafts players based on potential so in that sense I agree with you Hawkins has some. That said if we take off our orange shades is he really on a list of the top 30 or so players? Regardless of some article. I don't see that. Some had Kofi and others being drafted or going higher than they did.
As far as being the most gifted on our team. I am not sure that's obvious. TSJ it s good. Mayer has far better handles, good size, can create is shot better due to his ability to dribble, and shoots open on and contested shots much better rate. Coleman may have a higher potential but Mayer and TSJ are better players right now and who we look to for our scoring most nights for a reason.
InDaAZ
- Eugene, Oregon
Notes on Coleman’s shooting…
His shooting pct needs to get better, but he’s pretty much on par with the rest of the team on that stat. (Dain’s 75% is just
) I imagine if he starts scoring more in the paint instead of passing out of it, his pct will climb up toward the top of the list.Threes: I could be way off base here, but my guess is that BU is demanding that Coleman take more threes. He’s probably draining them in practice, but for some reason, his confidence isn’t there in the heat of the game. So, what we’re seeing him do lately is take a couple of out-of-rhythm long bombs to satisfy that coach’s directive (but certainly not the way Brad wants). Just a guess on what’s going on…
My man just needs to relax a bit and play with more confidence, simply put.
Side note on turnovers: Virtually anyone put in Coleman’s role in the offense - “trigger” or whatever you call it - is going to have volume touches with quick decision-making… all leading to more turnovers than players in other roles. That said, he does need to improve in taking care of the ball, obviously.
I trust BU to make the adjustments to elevate team play, Coleman, et al.
I'm not bashing Hawkins but this is not how you evaluate players using stats
LOL. Lets create a new RAP47 metric where scoring and shooting percentage do not count in assessing a player effectiveness.
You missed my earlier comment that the team with the most points at the end wins in a basketball game.
Underwood's post game interview basically stated that they decided to get the ball inside to DD more for more scoring efficiency.
The Illini are one of the most efficient teams in the country in 2 point FG percentage (12th).
Do more of what works. We are a not a good 3 point shooting team right now when we do not attack or go inside out.
The threes are contested (yes, they keep track of that stat, too), and we also get to the line less when you shoot too many.
45% of our shots are threes. We are selling out.
Would be fine of we were hitting 38% like PSU.
We are not.
When a guy like Hawkins takes them it is basically a TO 4 out of 5 times.
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Notes on Coleman’s shooting…
His shooting pct needs to get better, but he’s pretty much on par with the rest of the team on that stat. (Dain’s 75% is just
Threes: I could be way off base here, but my guess is that BU is demanding that Coleman take more threes. He’s probably draining them in practice, but for some reason, his confidence isn’t there in the heat of the game. So, what we’re seeing him do lately is take a couple of out-of-rhythm long bombs to satisfy that coach’s directive (but certainly not the way Brad wants). Just a guess on what’s going on…
My man just needs to relax a bit and play with more confidence, simply put.
Side note on turnovers: Virtually anyone put in Coleman’s role in the offense - “trigger” or whatever you call it - is going to have volume touches with quick decision-making… all leading to more turnovers than players in other roles. That said, he does need to improve in taking care of the ball, obviously.
I trust BU to make the adjustments to elevate team play, Coleman, et al.
We agree he needs to shoot more in the paint. He is 6'10". Shoot shots he can make and draw the defense and kick out and draw more fouls.
I highly doubt BU is telling him to shoot more threes. I could put Hawkins in an empty gym and he would not make 50% of his threes.
Watch Goode in warmups when he comes back taking threes. He doesn't miss much.
There is nothing in history or present, or his form, that says Hawkins is a reliable perimeter shooter.
If DD becomes option A or B and teams start to drop off of Hawkins to cover DD- then he has to shoot those threes.
Other than an open three in his range- he needs to forget it.
Physically most gifted. In terms of length and athleticism that translates to the NBA. Mayer is nowhere close. I'd say Shannon and Sencire have that athleticism, but they are smaller and need to be better shooters. Hawkins needs better shot selection so we can find out if he's actually a consistent shooter or not.
For the record, I don't believe Hawkins is anywhere close to the too 100 players in college, my point is simply that he has the skillset and physicality that draws the attention of NBA scouts. Since he has gotten here, he has been out of control and a very bad decision maker. He's played much better defensively this year, but offensively he's completely lost from a mental standpoint. It hasn't clicked with him yet and sometimes it never does.
Well Brad Underwood has said multiple times on tape that he needs Coleman to stop passing up all those threes. So we know he wants Coleman to look for his shot more.
Retro62
- North Bethesda, Maryland
I would like to see pull up jumpers in the lane from many more of our players…especially Hawkins, who tends to penetrate too deeply only to pass it back out.
InDaAZ
- Eugene, Oregon
This is what I’m sayin’…But those two 25-footers last game are not what he means, clearly.
My biggest knock on Coleman isn’t turnovers, it’s that he seems to have developed an allergy to scoring in all its forms. It’s got to be a confidence thing. Get your teammares involved in the offense = Good. Pass up uncontested shots, whether in the lane or at the arc = Bad.
Even so, my argument is that he is a net-positive, and undeserving of vitriol some here are spreading…
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Physically Hawkins is an inch or two taller. Other than that physical advantage I am not sure Hawkins possesses superior athletic traits compared to Mayer. They are likely very close is strength, stamina, agility, coordination, speed, balance, mobility, jumping and quickness. Hawkins may be or may not be a little stronger. I do not know. Mayer has superior hand eye coordination, uses both hands more effectively seems more agile when he has the ball. One reason I feel some guys perform better dribbling and shooting from 3 and the line better is hand coordination. Mayer has that. Hawkins is a good athlete, so are those you mentioned but hand eye coordination and using both hands is huge in playing basketball that is often over looked when discussing athletic traits. IMO I agree our best athlete is TSJ like you said but he is still working on his right hand.
Skyy has traits other guards can't match in many areas. Compared to other guards he is much stronger, can out jump them, he has dunked in traffic a few times already. He is agile with the ball due to his coordination, he has elite coordination, can use both hands well and while others may get him in some specific traits he checks more boxes athletically than Harris or Epps. One of the main reason he was rated so high. Especailly prior to his injury. Either way our team is more athletic and has more length due to these players than in recent years and hopefully they all can put it together soon and equate to more wins!
Yeah the idea that CoHawk is a net negative is crazy talk. And he should be starting. As I’ve said previously, I don’t think he should be initiating the offense. I believe that would benefit him and the team.
As far as whether he’s a first round NBA pick, he may well be. But that doesn’t erase the deficiencies that we’re seeing that are hurting the team. Kofi didn’t get drafted. Doesn’t take anything away from how important he was to the team last year. And getting picked in first round means money but it doesn’t guarantee success.
Telling a guy who is a a career 28% three point shooter to keep shooting threes is a great way to lose games.
Nobody wants Hawkins to shoot more threes except opposing coaches.
CoHawk isn't a poor shooter from 3.
He is a poor shooter -off the bounce- from 3, rather than catch and shoot. This is where the pump faking on nearly every catch behind the arc drives me nuts, because those are the in-rhythm shots that he looks NBA destined.
Mayer, on the other hand, is extremely comfortable getting his step back jumper off.
Both guys can shoot, one is just playing within himself on offense right now and the other one isn't.
He is a poor shooter -off the bounce- from 3, rather than catch and shoot. This is where the pump faking on nearly every catch behind the arc drives me nuts, because those are the in-rhythm shots that he looks NBA destined.
Mayer, on the other hand, is extremely comfortable getting his step back jumper off.
Both guys can shoot, one is just playing within himself on offense right now and the other one isn't.
Hawkins has goof shooting form. I bet he would make a high percentage I a normal practice setting. There’s more to shooting well than just form, like confidence to produce under stress.
Why are you blaming Hawkins only for the whole team shooting threes poorly.
Dee_4_Three_83
- Mahomet, IL
This game was my first game to watch in person in a few years. One thing that really stood out to me was the warmups. I remember watching every warm up from the 04-05 team and marvelling at the high percentage of 3s made during warmups from our 3 guards. When I watched our current team, there was only one guy that looked like a pure shooter, and that was Epps. He had a method similar to what Dee used to do. He would start by shooting the ball from 8-10 feet, visualize the ball going in several times from the same angle, then he backed himself up a few feet each time. He was making it at a 90% clip while everyone else was AT BEST 50%. Epps was impressive and I think he will be a high ranking scorer in illini history, based on more than just warmups of course.
Obviously it's a small sample size, so if anyone can comment on what they have seen in other warm ups, please let me know if this was an aberration. Otherwise, I would say that there may be some correlation between the poor shooting in warmups and what is happening in games.
Obviously it's a small sample size, so if anyone can comment on what they have seen in other warm ups, please let me know if this was an aberration. Otherwise, I would say that there may be some correlation between the poor shooting in warmups and what is happening in games.
He brings a lot to the team, I think he should be rolling to the basket and attacking the offensive boards more. Seems he made more of an effort to do that in the second half. Get the ball in the hoop on dunks and put backs, and the three percentage will go up. That said, please get rid of the two obligatory WTF was that passes.
You are right.
Epps has very good form. He has a consistent quick rhythm dip into his shot, good feet, and a smooth one motion shot from deep which is what most good modern shooters have.
He needs to shoot early and often when he gets a look.
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