Illinois 91, Rutgers 60 POSTGAME

#101      

RickBB

R
RickBB
I don't want to come across as a non-Mark Smith fan because I am one....the point I was trying to make by discussing his baseball career was he literally had none for his junior and senior year of high school. He was offerred and verballed because he was projectable as a pitcher at 6-3 or 6-4 and had lit up a radar gun when he was 15 years old.....as a baseball coach why wouldn't you offer early and if he grows an inch or two or just gets stronger now he's throwing 92-94. And I can't find any record anywhere of him being projected as anything but a pitcher, actually I can't find anything of him doing anything besides pitching. Most kids who have an arm injury as a pitcher are DHing or playing first base or something.....so I'd go so far to say he probably wasn't playing baseball all summer since the summer after sophomore year in high school. Maybe someone who lives in Suothern Illinois who actually knows can correct me, I'm just going off what I can find on the internet.

Maybe the Illini comp for him is Sergio McClain. Mr Basketball who excelled at the high school level because he was so much stronger than everyone else. Now that players are stronger, faster, taller, he'll still contribute, but he doesn't have the same advantages in every athletic category he did in high school. Heck, as a Central Illinois guy I love Sergio McClain.

I do think playing off the ball has been an adjustment for him. He's not real assertive when the ball finds its way into his hands as he just swings it around or reverses it or it gets stuck as the clock winds down and he takes a long range shot. I can't help but think that seeing Trent Frazier have a great year has been humbling for him, and he seems like a great kid but that has to be a blow to him a bit, just as a competitor.
 
#102      

illini62707

I
illini62707
Wow, great intensity on defense! Not easy to keep those guys in front of you when going to the basket, but Alstork, etc. did great job.
 
#103      

Peoria Illini

P
Peoria, IL
Peoria Illini
RickBB said:
I don't want to come across as a non-Mark Smith fan because I am one....the point I was trying to make by discussing his baseball career was he literally had none for his junior and senior year of high school. He was offerred and verballed because he was projectable as a pitcher at 6-3 or 6-4 and had lit up a radar gun when he was 15 years old.....as a baseball coach why wouldn't you offer early and if he grows an inch or two or just gets stronger now he's throwing 92-94. And I can't find any record anywhere of him being projected as anything but a pitcher, actually I can't find anything of him doing anything besides pitching. Most kids who have an arm injury as a pitcher are DHing or playing first base or something.....so I'd go so far to say he probably wasn't playing baseball all summer since the summer after sophomore year in high school. Maybe someone who lives in Suothern Illinois who actually knows can correct me, I'm just going off what I can find on the internet.

Maybe the Illini comp for him is Sergio McClain. Mr Basketball who excelled at the high school level because he was so much stronger than everyone else. Now that players are stronger, faster, taller, he'll still contribute, but he doesn't have the same advantages in every athletic category he did in high school. Heck, as a Central Illinois guy I love Sergio McClain.

I do think playing off the ball has been an adjustment for him. He's not real assertive when the ball finds its way into his hands as he just swings it around or reverses it or it gets stuck as the clock winds down and he takes a long range shot. I can't help but think that seeing Trent Frazier have a great year has been humbling for him, and he seems like a great kid but that has to be a blow to him a bit, just as a competitor.
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Sergio was a coach's son and had a very high bball IQ and was well taught on the defensive side of the ball, as most Manual HS players were. I think that MS has never been taught the proper man to man defensive principles. He seems to have no concept of it at all. Once he gets comfortable doing that, I think his offense will return. May take the offseason, but they've got to help him learn how to play defense, IMO.
 
#104      

TheGMan

TheGMan
TheGMan
Man, people are giving up way to early on, and I can't emphasize this enough, A TRUE FRESHMAN. Just because there are plenty of true freshman that immediately come in and excel, that doesn't mean all of them will. In fact, I'd say that those players are the exceptions. Give him some time to get better. It may never happen, but the people who are saying that he will never be a certain type of player are nuts. You literally cannot say that with any kind of certainty.
 
#105      

Illini_1979

Illini_1979
Oregon
Illini_1979
I DVR every Illini game that's on TV here on the left coast. This is the first game this year that I am going to keep for awhile and watch a few more times.
 
#106      

Eastside Pride

E
Eastside Pride
Peoria Illini said:
Sergio was a coach's son and had a very high bball IQ and was well taught on the defensive side of the ball, as most Manual HS players were. I think that MS has never been taught the proper man to man defensive principles. He seems to have no concept of it at all. Once he gets comfortable doing that, I think his offense will return. May take the offseason, but they've got to help him learn how to play defense, IMO.
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Mark is a coaches son as well. His parents were both very good college players. BU does not play a traditional man. Half court man is very tough up top and on the back end to execute. We really don't have the players for it.
 
#107      

FiveStar

F
FiveStar
Idk the edwardsville basketball coach, but something tells me it’s more of mark smith never learned or had to learn defense, not he was never taught. When you have a stud in high school basketball, he plays, no matter what. My high school pg has 3035 career points and doesn’t even try to guard, but we ain’t taking him out, so we work our defense around him. Something tells me a mr basketball ain’t coming out the game either.
 
#108      

Illini B-Ball Fan

Illini B-Ball Fan
Illini B-Ball Fan
FiveStar said:
Idk the edwardsville basketball coach, but something tells me it’s more of mark smith never learned or had to learn defense, not he was never taught. When you have a stud in high school basketball, he plays, no matter what. My high school pg has 3035 career points and doesn’t even try to guard, but we ain’t taking him out, so we work our defense around him. Something tells me a mr basketball ain’t coming out the game either.
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Please send your PG's background and other stats to BU to see if he wants to make a visit to Austin to link up for a potential verbal! :D
 
#109      

bigtiny

B
bigtiny
Wow, really surprised by all this early stuff on Smith. A "Lucas Johnson type" (!?) Give the kid some time in the program, I think he'll be a star yet.
 
#111      

SescIllini

SescIllini
SescIllini
Eastside Pride said:
This is one of the few intelligent posts I've seen in regards to Mark Smith. Not only is he playing out of position. He really doesn't touch the ball much. I don't see Mark staying at U of I. I watched him play a lot in high school and he's one of the better ball dominant guards I've seen at that level (I watch about 50 high school games a year live and have been doing that for twenty years). It is also worth pointing out that I don't think Mark is comfortable playing half court man defense. It is not the strongest part of his skill set. Frankly, I think it will be an issue for Ayo as well. He has never really played any man defense and Morgan Park is an offensive machine, they don't really get after it on the defensive end.
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So these players should go where they don't play defense or just zone? If they want to go to the league, they better learn man, switches, and help defenses. Biggest concern with MSmith is speed, but he will be ok.
 
#112      

SescIllini

SescIllini
SescIllini
Guys need to chill on MSmith. These 3 Illini freshmen guards averaged 0/pg, 4 pg, and 6 pg and were serious about transferring. They were Frank Williams(prop 48), Kendall Gill, and Deron Williams.
 
#113      

skyIdub

skyIdub
Winged Warrior
skyIdub
SescIllini said:
Guys need to chill on MSmith. These 3 Illini freshmen guards averaged 0/pg, 4 pg, and 6 pg and were serious about transferring. They were Frank Williams(prop 48), Kendall Gill, and Deron Williams.
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#114      

alexander58

A
alexander58
bigtiny said:
Wow, really surprised by all this early stuff on Smith. A "Lucas Johnson type" (!?) Give the kid some time in the program, I think he'll be a star yet.
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He is really struggling to figure things out right now on both ends of the court. Underwood doesn’t seem to be the most patient coach . It’s tough for a freshman that probably hasn’t struggled much before, but if he can stick it out he’ll be better for it.
 
#115      

Obelix

Obelix
Obelix
SescIllini said:
Guys need to chill on MSmith. These 3 Illini freshmen guards averaged 0/pg, 4 pg, and 6 pg and were serious about transferring. They were Frank Williams(prop 48), Kendall Gill, and Deron Williams.
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Nothing to do with Mark Smith, but you can't say that Frankie averaged 0 points in his freshman year while sitting as a prop 48. This is like saying that a RS freshman or transfer (in his sit-out year) averaged 0 points. Prop-48 was really an involuntary RS, with the only exception that you had to graduate in 4 years to get the 5th year back (Cory Bradford did).
 
#116      

Deleted member 4960

D
Guest
Deleted member 4960
Mark Smith didn't play a lot last night because he got popped in the nose and was bleeding for awhile. Otherwise he might have played and contributed more. He made some nice plays late in the 2nd half. Hopefully his defense will improve. I also hope he is not one of these kids that can't handle a little adversity and will run to somewhere different at seasons end. If he stays and works he'll be better for it in the end.
 
#118      

EllderIlliniFan

EllderIlliniFan
EllderIlliniFan
I saw Illinois play at Wisconsin when Malcolm and K Nunn were freshman. They were just getting minimum playing time and both struggled on defense especially Nunn. His man blew by him several times and this was Wisconsin - not exactly the most athletic team. Eventually they both became good defenders especially Malcolm. All of the freshman are getting more playing time than freshman did under Groce. They are also playing a defense that will eventually be more effective. Give them time and I believe they will be very good defenders.
 
#119      

yeahyeahyeah

Y
yeahyeahyeah
bigtiny said:
Wow, really surprised by all this early stuff on Smith. A "Lucas Johnson type" (!?) Give the kid some time in the program, I think he'll be a star yet.
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not surprised at all.... I'm glad BU has faith in him... how about that little oop to Finke for an easy bucket... I do remember the bunch who were anointing him FOY 9 months ago. Perhaps unreasonable expectations bring out the scorn in some... Mark's averaging about the same minutes and points as Kendrick Nunn did as a Freshman, who then averaged double figures the next two years. He'll be aight :thumb:
 
#120      

PlayAZ

P
PlayAZ
yeahyeahyeah said:
not surprised at all.... I'm glad BU has faith in him... how about that little oop to Finke for an easy bucket... I do remember the bunch who were anointing him FOY 9 months ago. Perhaps unreasonable expectations bring out the scorn in some... Mark's averaging about the same minutes and points as Kendrick Nunn did as a Freshman, who then averaged double figures the next two years. He'll be aight :thumb:
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I stated he would be alright as well...just not the bill of sale, and I wasn't one that thought the FOY was even/should even a conversation.

Good ball player, lack of experience, overwhelmed so far. Good career, not what everyone 9 months ago would have thought though.
 
#121      

Seagee

Seagee
Seagee
brillinian said:
Thing that worries me the most about Smith is his defense. I can buy the 'playing out of position on offense" is what has lead to his poor offensive showing in the big 10. But my gosh, who taught this kid how to play man to man defense? It's horrible. I've never seen anyone at this level play it the way he does. It's like he's either a step or two to far into the passing lane so he has to turn his head 90 degrees to keep his eye on the ball OR his man. OR he just has peripheral vision problems and has to turn his head to see both but can't see them both at the same time using his peripheral vision.
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THIS ! It really seems Mark has problems with peripheral vision and can only focus on one thing at a time. That then causes him to get burned on one side or the other. Not sure what the solution is if it is indeed the issue.
 
#122      

GortTheRobot

G
North Bethesda, Maryland
GortTheRobot
Just finally caught up with everything on this thread, I had to DVR the game and didn't see it until yesterday...I did a fantastic job staying away from the board so it didn't spoil it for me.

Anyway, I am in agreement with those who think Smith just needs some time. His defense is bad, he tends to pull his arms in and try to "block" like a lineman when someone tries to go around him.

I also think his offense is very affected by his inability to play solid D...it's a confidence thing. He will improve, on both ends, and IMO, he will be an integral part of our success next year.
 
#123      

SixthandWhite

SixthandWhite
SixthandWhite
EllderIlliniFan said:
I saw Illinois play at Wisconsin when Malcolm and K Nunn were freshman. They were just getting minimum playing time and both struggled on defense especially Nunn. His man blew by him several times and this was Wisconsin - not exactly the most athletic team. Eventually they both became good defenders especially Malcolm. All of the freshman are getting more playing time than freshman did under Groce. They are also playing a defense that will eventually be more effective. Give them time and I believe they will be very good defenders.
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Rich McBride was the best defender on the team by the time he was senior. Give MS some time to catch up to the speed of the game, he will be great for us.
 
#124      

PtownIllini8

P
PtownIllini8
SescIllini said:
Guys need to chill on MSmith. These 3 Illini freshmen guards averaged 0/pg, 4 pg, and 6 pg and were serious about transferring. They were Frank Williams(prop 48), Kendall Gill, and Deron Williams.
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Luther Head averaged in that same range as well. I never heard that Kendall Gill or Frank Williams was serious about transferring. I would seriously doubt that was ever the case with Frank Williams.
 
#125      

sdfidaho

sdfidaho
Boise, Idaho
sdfidaho
Chathamillini said:
Mark Smith didn't play a lot last night because he got popped in the nose and was bleeding for awhile. Otherwise he might have played and contributed more. He made some nice plays late in the 2nd half. Hopefully his defense will improve. I also hope he is not one of these kids that can't handle a little adversity and will run to somewhere different at seasons end. If he stays and works he'll be better for it in the end.
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I hope not as well.
He sure doesn't seem like that type of young man, so I'm really not too worried about it.