Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread (January-February 2018)

[Actionjackson]

And for the heck of it, here's how many top-100 kids we've had in previous seasons. This doesn't factor in kids who were either redshirting or sitting out for transfer, but rather, just captures the total # of top-100 kids on the roster. It's obviously an imperfect measure of talent, but it's something:

2018: 4
2017: 6
2016: 7
2015: 6
2014: 5
2013: 6
2012: 8
2011: 6
2010: 5
2009: 4
2008: 7
2007: 7
2006: 7
2005: 10
2004: 10
2003: 8
2002: 5
2001: 5

A few observations.

This team is the least talented team this century, purely according to how many kids we have in the top-100.

The 2001 and 2002 teams had among the least # of top-100 kids, BUT......they also had several 5* kids (Frank, Cook, Marcus Griffin) and a TON of experienced kids like Bradford, Damir, Lucas Johnson, Arch, etc. Experience and size/toughness matters -- especially when blended with an elite 5* PG and a 5* PF.

The 2009 team was among the least talented, but was also very experienced. Senior guards in Trent Meacham and Chet Frazier to go along with experience and size in the front court in Davis and Tisdale.

2004-2005 was crazy talented, and it showed. Talent matters. All 5 starters were top-100 kids. 2012 was a team with a lot of talent, but clearly didn't perform. Then again, some of that top-100 talent turned out to be a total bust: Mike Shaw, Myke Henry, etc.

2018 suffers from the worst combination of talent and experience this century.

This is an epic post. Mind-blowing and really illustrates how talent translates to success on the court

 

[Illini Beer 4 All]

This is an epic post. Mind-blowing and really illustrates how talent translates to success on the court

Did we need anyone to tell us talent wins? Have you seen which teams constantly win conference titles and makes final fours.

Every time I see people talk about recruits being underrated and developing low rated guys, I just laugh. That is not how you won. You win with talent. Talent and experience is key.

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[Dan]

Illinois has offered 2020 Rivals50 Seton Hall Prep wing Jabri Abdur-Rahim
https://twitter.com/coreyevans_10/status/950038583276199936

 

[Obelix]

Name sounds like he's Michigan bound

California, not Michigan.

 

[TCTORNADO]

I think we generally have a B1G-quality roster, but by no means the sort of roster to finish in the upper half of the conference.

I remember having this debate with S&C about how "talented" we really are. It's not about how many top-100 kids you have on the roster (although we only have 4). It's about whether that talent is distributed properly, whether it's experienced, and how talented that talent really is.

We don't have a single top-100 kid above 6'7. We don't have a single top-100 guard older than 19 years old. And our top-100 wing is really limited in what he can do athletically.

And let's be honest. None of our kids are major impact players. We don't have a single kid in the B1G's top-15 in scoring, rebounding, assists, or blocks. Think about that for a second.

We have nobody on par with KBD, Jordan Murphy, Ethan Happ, Juwan Morgan, or Charles Matthews. And those are just the players from the other middle-of-the-pack teams.

We have nobody who is within a year or two of being an NBA draft pick. Nobody who will even sniff All-American this season. Nobody who fans outside of the B1G know anything about.

That begins to change next year with Ayo (and the maturation of guys like Mark Smith). But we need more of it -- and at more positions.

VI,

What rating service did you use for your lists??

 

[Deleted member 631370]

VI,

What rating service did you use for your lists??

I generally used Scout/247, though I used RSCI to fill in gaps from the early 2000s (like Nick Smith, Aaron Spears, etc.).

In fairness, I counted guys like Trent Frazier, Aaron Jordan, and Luther Head as top-100, even though they were really on the fringe. Frazier, for example, was #108 in the 247 rankings, and Jordan was ranked #118. However, they were also top-100 in other services. Thus, I gave them the top-100 nod.

(if you want to be a top-100 purist, then our current team only has 2 top-100 players -- Leron and Mark Smith)

There were a few other borderline ones. Richard Semrau, Warren Carter, etc. But I tried to be consistent over time, and was generous across the board to players who were "close enough" to the top-100.

 

[Deleted member 631370]

Did we need anyone to tell us talent wins? Have you seen which teams constantly win conference titles and makes final fours.

Every time I see people talk about recruits being underrated and developing low rated guys, I just laugh. That is not how you won. You win with talent. Talent and experience is key.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Yeah, it's the combination of talent, experience, and distribution of that talent, IMO.

If you have a bunch of top-100 guys in your front court, but no talent in your backcourt, you're going to struggle. Likewise, if you have talent but they're inexperienced and you don't have any senior leadership to help them along, you're going to struggle.

I just posted that list because I don't think people realize just how talent-deficient this roster is.

 

[PJD86]

Yeah, it's the combination of talent, experience, and distribution of that talent, IMO.

If you have a bunch of top-100 guys in your front court, but no talent in your backcourt, you're going to struggle. Likewise, if you have talent but they're inexperienced and you don't have any senior leadership to help them along, you're going to struggle.

I just posted that list because I don't think people realize just how talent-deficient this roster is.

distribution is such a key word, I think we all agree we have nice talent, but most of it does the same thing. Would be nice to distribute the good talent into other spots on the roster, to me that is where this program has failed. Roster and distribution of players/talent. Well said

 

[TCTORNADO]

Former Groce recruit and DePaul commit, Tyger Campbell, is on an OV to Maryland today.

 

[Love the Illini]

Looks like we will need a 5th year big for next year if hope to be a tournament contender. The catch is good 5th year bigs are really hard to get. If we find one hopefully that bridges us for a year and we get one or maybe two bigs in 19. The other thing we need is to see growth from the freshman as the season continues. It is ok for them to make mistakes but also need to see them learning from their mistakes and getting better as the season goes on. I am especially interested to see especially how Smith develops defensively and in his ball handling at times he has seemed over matched against better competition though I still think he has a very good upside

 

[EJ33]

And for the heck of it, here's how many top-100 kids we've had in previous seasons. This doesn't factor in kids who were either redshirting or sitting out for transfer, but rather, just captures the total # of top-100 kids on the roster. It's obviously an imperfect measure of talent, but it's something:

2018: 4
2017: 6
2016: 7
2015: 6
2014: 5
2013: 6
2012: 8
2011: 6
2010: 5
2009: 4
2008: 7
2007: 7
2006: 7
2005: 10
2004: 10
2003: 8
2002: 5
2001: 5

A few observations.

This team is the least talented team this century, purely according to how many kids we have in the top-100.

The 2001 and 2002 teams had among the least # of top-100 kids, BUT......they also had several 5* kids (Frank, Cook, Marcus Griffin) and a TON of experienced kids like Bradford, Damir, Lucas Johnson, Arch, etc. Experience and size/toughness matters -- especially when blended with an elite 5* PG and a 5* PF.

The 2009 team was among the least talented, but was also very experienced. Senior guards in Trent Meacham and Chet Frazier to go along with experience and size in the front court in Davis and Tisdale.

2004-2005 was crazy talented, and it showed. Talent matters. All 5 starters were top-100 kids. 2012 was a team with a lot of talent, but clearly didn't perform. Then again, some of that top-100 talent turned out to be a total bust: Mike Shaw, Myke Henry, etc.

2018 suffers from the worst combination of talent and experience this century.

Great post...and 2 of the 4 this year are freshmen, right?

I've been pleasantly surprised we've been competitive vs. being disappointed we've blown a few games.

If Underwood can improve the talent level we are going to be really, really good. And I'm not talking about 5 stars - just a collection of Top 100ish guards and wings along with a trio of developmental, athletic bigs is enough. If he lands Liddell, Okoro, and Miller watch out. That's the nucleus for a Final Four run.

 

[Obelix]

Yes, I know where he's from.... Look at the Michigan roster and see the name similarity.

I am not sure you do, he is (officially) from New Jersey where he goes to school, but his last name is pretty well known, not similar, the exact name of a famous basketball player who played at University of California and actually happens to be his father.

 

[BananaShampoo]

Saw a few Montverde Academy basketball players getting on the tram at the Orlando airport about an hour ago. Must have been coming from a tourney. Based on height they were all bigs. Anyone from there we're recruiting?

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[Deleted member 631370]

Great post...and 2 of the 4 this year are freshmen, right?

I've been pleasantly surprised we've been competitive vs. being disappointed we've blown a few games.

If Underwood can improve the talent level we are going to be really, really good. And I'm not talking about 5 stars - just a collection of Top 100ish guards and wings along with a trio of developmental, athletic bigs is enough. If he lands Liddell, Okoro, and Miller watch out. That's the nucleus for a Final Four run.

Expecting us to land that trio is a tall order, but we have a great chance in each recruitment. If we were to get that kind of haul, I agree -- that's a Final Four roster.

Give me one of Liddell/Okoro and then Miller in 2020, and we are in business. Imagine a roster with seniors Frazier, Smith, and Williams, Ayo as a junior, Liddell/Okoro as sophomore, and Miller as a freshman? Holy crap.

 

[EJ33]

Expecting us to land that trio is a tall order, but we have a great chance in each recruitment. If we were to get that kind of haul, I agree -- that's a Final Four roster.

Yeah it's possible, but unlikely.

Give me one of Liddell/Okoro and then Miller in 2020, and we are in business. Imagine a roster with seniors Frazier, Smith, and Williams, Ayo as a junior, Liddell/Okoro as sophomore, and Miller as a freshman? Holy crap.

Agreed, but I don't expect Ayo to be here as a junior.

 

[westcoastillini]

Yes I do but thanks for telling me what I do and don't know. Yes I realize who his father is and where he currently is getting his MBA (USC).

You just missed the joke entirely like you usually do... And to make it worse, you start to try to tell people what they do and don't know.

This simply was a statement that there is a player on Michigan's roster with a similar name... Thus the joke that he's Michigan bound. You simply missed that joke. Geesh. :tsk:

Well, I laughed.

 

[Obelix]

Yes I do but thanks for telling me what I do and don't know.

Relax... I told you California and you are the one who responded "Yes, I know where he's from," he is actually in prep in NJ (I actually know the kid BTW).

I do not think anyone missed your bad joke, that because his name is Abdur-Rahim his is Michigan bound because they have Abdur-Rahkman (brrrr... good joke), but you obviously missed the California response that had nothing to do with where the kid is from (as you responded), just that the name Abdur-Rahim screams California not Michigan.

 

[Obelix]

Yes I realize who his father is and where he currently is getting his MBA (USC).

And just to correct you again, since I know the kid and family, I am glad you had to research Jabri and his famous name/father on wikipedia (that is often a good but not accurate source), but Shareef graduated with his MBA from USC quite a long time ago, so he is not currently getting his MBA.

 

[2012]

Hey everybody.

I have some questions about Ayo Dosunmu that I am hoping people who know more about basketball than me can clear up. I am thrilled for his commitment and am really hoping he can be a player that can help turn this program around. However, when I watch some of his highlight tapes, I can't help but feel like nothing really immediately jumps out for me like I would expect of a consensus 5 star recruit like him.

Again, this is coming from a place of complete basketball ignorance and am hoping someobody could clear up for me as to what his strengths are and why he is so highly rated and what seperates him from so many other players in this class.

 

[Obelix]

I have some questions about Ayo Dosunmu that I am hoping people who know more about basketball than me can clear up. I am thrilled for his commitment and am really hoping he can be a player that can help turn this program around. However, when I watch some of his highlight tapes, I can't help but feel like nothing really immediately jumps out for me like I would expect of a consensus 5 star recruit like him.

Having watched a lot of Ayo, that is the beauty to him as a player. He makes things look easy. Don't expect a lot of high flying dunks or behind the back wild passes, Ayo is extremely efficient as a player.

 

[westcoastillini]

Hey everybody.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpsScO8Zugg

 

[SescIllini]

Having watched a lot of Ayo, that is the beauty to him as a player. He makes things look easy. Don't expect a lot of high flying dunks or behind the back wild passes, Ayo is extremely efficient as a player.

Concur, seen only highlights of Ayo and they are good but no high flying dunks. But then you realize that he is hitting lay-up after lay-up against top 30 talent. Just think about the Michigan game where are guards couldn't finish at the rim or under the basket. I think those will be 2 fore Ayo.

 

[tpbradley]

Gettin' chilly in here.

 

[Deleted member 654622]

One of my coworkers (played college ball at Delaware) went to the Highland classic this weekend. His takeaway was Adam Miller has a great shot and EJ played against weak competition. And of course that Nic Irvin was a real piece.

 

[TCTORNADO]

Saw a few Montverde Academy basketball players getting on the tram at the Orlando airport about an hour ago. Must have been coming from a tourney. Based on height they were all bigs. Anyone from there we're recruiting?

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They were @ tourney in Wheeling WV, and lost to LaLumiere. MV has Filip Petrusev who we wanted badly but ended up at Gonzaga.