Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread

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#77      

the juiceman cometh

T
the juiceman cometh
IlliniLiveOn said:
I find it very interesting that adding back Jacob Grandison puts us at # 16 (just two behind where Nance put us). Not that I believe it. They both spread the floor, but Pete Nance is a better rebounder and shooter and for what we currently need - defender too.
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I like Nance a lot but I think people here underrate Grandison. I think they're comparable shooters actually. Nance shot a higher % from 3 but significantly fewer attempts (3.1/game vs. 4.5/game), and shot a slightly lower percentage from 2 than Grandison. I note the difference in attempts because higher attempt numbers mean the player is typically having to take harder shots - for example I remember instances where Grandison had to shoot contested 3s near the end of the shot clock - so the shooting percentage can often suffer as attempt numbers go higher. Grandison also had a better FT%. I think Nance is better, but not by the wide margin some people do, and the #14 vs #16 difference seems reasonable to me.
 
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#78      

EyeoftheIllini

EyeoftheIllini
EyeoftheIllini
Joel Goodson said:
Adding Butz as a depth piece (a la BBV and Payne) is fine. Expecting him to thrive in a larger role is not so fine.
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I think he’d be more effective than Payne overall and more effective offensively than BBV (not sure about on D). I think he could give us more minutes than either of them did individually last year too. That said, I’m thinking 10-15 mpg and not 20-25.
 
#80      

One Man Fast Break

O
One Man Fast Break
the juiceman cometh said:
I like Nance a lot but I think people here underrate Grandison. I think they're comparable shooters actually. Nance shot a higher % from 3 but significantly fewer attempts (3.1/game vs. 4.5/game), and shot a slightly lower percentage from 2 than Grandison. I note the difference in attempts because higher attempt numbers mean the player is typically having to take harder shots - for example I remember instances where Grandison had to shoot contested 3s near the end of the shot clock - so the shooting percentage can often suffer as attempt numbers go higher. Grandison also had a better FT%. I think Nance is better, but not by the wide margin some people do, and the #14 vs #16 difference seems reasonable to me.
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Grandison would be a massive addition. High IQ, good shooter, doesn't do dumb things on the court and waste possessions. Have heard zero word on him or whether he's hired agent.
 
#81      

Noblesville Illini

Noblesville Illini
Nappanee, IN
Noblesville Illini
logjam said:
BU to his credit usually has a plan C and D...
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Fast And Furious GIF by The Fast Saga
Season 9 Dwight GIF by The Office
 
#83      

Soulberries

Soulberries
University of Illinois
Soulberries
One Man Fast Break said:
How do we know Payne got cut versus left on his own volition? Would be pretty bold to outright cut him unless Illinois was totally blindsided by Kofi.
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To be clear, Big Ten rules prohibit a school from "outright cutting" a player. When a player signs to a Big Ten school he is entitled to 4 years on scholarship (less whatever he's already received from a previous school). Granted they can make it really uncomfortable for him to stay, but I sincerely doubt that Underwood would do that or Whitman would allow it (call me naive if you will). More than likely they either had a very blunt "it's in your best interest to transfer to a school that can give you the minutes you need to showcase your talents" or he decided there were too many unknowns such as Kofi's decision and potential transfer-ins.
 
#84      

BretMyBeachHouse

B
BretMyBeachHouse
illini0440 said:
This is pretty accurate. He had to look out for himself….couldn’t wait for Kofi to make a decision or the portal.
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That doesn't seem correct. If he's looking for a school on the scale of Jacksonville State that would have been a lot of choices throughout the summer.
 
#86      

mydosburns

mydosburns
mydosburns
the juiceman cometh said:
I like Nance a lot but I think people here underrate Grandison. I think they're comparable shooters actually. Nance shot a higher % from 3 but significantly fewer attempts (3.1/game vs. 4.5/game), and shot a slightly lower percentage from 2 than Grandison. I note the difference in attempts because higher attempt numbers mean the player is typically having to take harder shots - for example I remember instances where Grandison had to shoot contested 3s near the end of the shot clock - so the shooting percentage can often suffer as attempt numbers go higher. Grandison also had a better FT%. I think Nance is better, but not by the wide margin some people do, and the #14 vs #16 difference seems reasonable to me.
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I agree with shooting. I think when you look at pure size and athleticism, it's the issue. Jake is a great player, but Nance is 4-5 inches taller. Has more bounce too. Nance would make it easier to match up with other teams. Jake really isn't a 4, we just played him as one, and got away with it since we had a behemoth of a man in the middle. I'd take Jake back in a heartbeat, but I think his girlfriend graduated already too. I'd say the chances of him coming back are SLIM....
 
#87      

IlliniLiveOn

IlliniLiveOn
Sierra Nevada
IlliniLiveOn
the juiceman cometh said:
I like Nance a lot but I think people here underrate Grandison. I think they're comparable shooters actually. Nance shot a higher % from 3 but significantly fewer attempts (3.1/game vs. 4.5/game), and shot a slightly lower percentage from 2 than Grandison. I note the difference in attempts because higher attempt numbers mean the player is typically having to take harder shots - for example I remember instances where Grandison had to shoot contested 3s near the end of the shot clock - so the shooting percentage can often suffer as attempt numbers go higher. Grandison also had a better FT%. I think Nance is better, but not by the wide margin some people do, and the #14 vs #16 difference seems reasonable to me.
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You are correct about the shooting percentages, but I'll take the extra 4 inches in height. Jake owes a lot of his shooting success to Kofi and the collapsing defense. Nance would pull a bigger guy away from the basket to defend with his 3 point shooting, and that is key. I really like Jake too. He just does not fill the #4 nearly as well as Nance would in general and cannot be a stretch 5. We are so wing heavy as it is. I cannot see him used as a #3 very often with his poor ball handling, given our current roster. But I'm sure BU would love the "problem" of yet another wing. Especially if paired with a good ball handler at the #4 like Ty or Mayer in select situations. His FT shooting is stellar, as you said, better than even Nance ... love a guy like that in at the end of a game with the lead.
 
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#90      

nichi

N
nichi
One Man Fast Break said:
Sounds like Jaylen Butz is Illinois's fallback option if Nance doesn't come. Not the most exciting but another frontcourt body in there.
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I am thinking he'd be more of a post depth piece. We could use someone like that for one season even if we add a rotation quality big.
 
#91      

jamarvelous31

J
jamarvelous31
Soulberries said:
To be clear, Big Ten rules prohibit a school from "outright cutting" a player. When a player signs to a Big Ten school he is entitled to 4 years on scholarship (less whatever he's already received from a previous school). Granted they can make it really uncomfortable for him to stay, but I sincerely doubt that Underwood would do that or Whitman would allow it (call me naive if you will). More than likely they either had a very blunt "it's in your best interest to transfer to a school that can give you the minutes you need to showcase your talents" or he decided there were too many unknowns such as Kofi's decision and potential transfer-ins.
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Nothing says that the coach has to play the player, or welcome them to practice. Doesn't have to be malicious, just a cold shoulder.

That said, the result was best for everyone involved and I hope we end up with another player looking for the right fit/opportunity.
 
#95      

One Man Fast Break

O
One Man Fast Break
I honestly doubt Payne got pushed out. I think it's just a case of a guy who came in with the expectation that he'd be the starter with Kofi in the draft a year ago, then Kofi came back unexpectedly so he wasn't the starter. Then he was pretty terrible so he ended up playing only 7.5 minutes per game. So the whole thing just didn't work out as he intended, and he's looking for a fresh start and where he will have something closer to a guarantee in terms of playing time. Then with a coach he's been with previously being the HC at an Atlantic Sun team that is not far from home, it just seemed like the right fit.

While Underwood couldn't guarantee him a certain amount of playing time, pushing him out the door when we need frontcourt bodies just for depth makes no sense. Just having a 6'10 shotblocking presence there if you need one is nice, those are more difficult to find than one could imagine at the collegiate level.
 
#100      

Ga65

G
Ga65
the juiceman cometh said:
I like Nance a lot but I think people here underrate Grandison. I think they're comparable shooters actually. Nance shot a higher % from 3 but significantly fewer attempts (3.1/game vs. 4.5/game), and shot a slightly lower percentage from 2 than Grandison. I note the difference in attempts because higher attempt numbers mean the player is typically having to take harder shots - for example I remember instances where Grandison had to shoot contested 3s near the end of the shot clock - so the shooting percentage can often suffer as attempt numbers go higher. Grandison also had a better FT%. I think Nance is better, but not by the wide margin some people do, and the #14 vs #16 difference seems reasonable to me.
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Forget offense, who going to guard a 5? Mayer or Grandison? We need someone big enough to guard the 5. Hawk and Dain are going to get into foul problems at the 5. That leaves a Goode or equivalent size.
 
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