Iowa 77, Illinois 65 POSTGAME

themudflap said:

I am starting to believe that Mav could have one of those senior years we remember next year. He really does have a low post game. Many !!!!! about his defense and rebounding, but, he has no help there. I think his numbers would be better if he had Black or Finke playing full time there and Hill was at SF. Next years team all comes down to pg play, assuming we are healthy. Another big is needed though and it needs to be somebody solid.

Also want to make one more point. I think TA will be much better for us next year than what we currently have. Couple of reasons. His soph year he led us to the tourney with a couple of seniors back there with him. His junior year, yeah, it was bad. But, so was that team. He will have more than a year of recovery when the season starts next fall. He will have a lot of help next year and he has sat for two years watching this team. It was not a question of talent his jr year but decision making and sitting back for two years should improve that watching what he has been watching. People forget that he has put this team on his back and won games for us. No way KL or JT do that. He should never have to do that next year, but, he has made game winning shots for us. Every one should hope he comes in ready to go and plays like a SR.

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Hope you're right about MM. I think paired with a quality 4 like MF or an improved LB would help a lot. Some guys (Chris Gandy) play with extra motivation their senior year, too, and bigs typically take longer to develop.

TA's biggest hurdle to overcome will be the physical effects of two severe knee injuries/surgeries/recoveries. I'd be pleasantly surprised if he returns next year with more than 80 percent of his quickness back. He'll also be rusty during the non-conf portion of the schedule. But he's a trooper, so you leave that door open for him to surprise you. If he could somehow play 20-25 mpg and TJL give 15-20 quality mpg off the bench we'd be much better off than we are this year.

WesterveltVictoryCigar said:

He was injured vs ISU. He played again vs IU, so it did not end his season. He is not getting a red shirt. He is not coming back next season.

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I agree with this. It seems pretty obvious that Thorne had no intention of coming back next year. He has plans for a pro career somewhere next year. I think he wants to make it back on the court this year so he can prove he is healthy so he can improve his pro chances.

WesterveltVictoryCigar said:

More DJW and AJ, please. Less Lewis and Tate.

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And more MM and MF together starting next weekend. Gotta do whatever it takes to shore up our interior D and defensive rebounding as well as have 5 guys on the floor who are a threat to score. We'll never fix all 3 areas this season due to the injuries, but it'd be nice to make improvements there while getting the frosh quality PT for next season.

Illini2018 said:

For this Illini Team, it doesn't matter who is and isn't playing it is all about the product on the court. If the team gives it their all and we lose, our fan base will be content that we left it all on the court. That said, today like many other games, were lackluster. No hustle from the team, not fighting for second chances, bonehead plays were all very prevalent today as they have been for the team the whole year.

Iowa is a very good team, but today they didn't set the world on fire. They just played an average game for them and beat us easily. If our team gave it their all today this would have been a much more competitive game and we would have actually had a chance. Our team didn't bring their "A game" for another countless time on the season. When will enough be enough?

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This comment is not specific to the Iowa game, but the Iowa game now becomes part of an ever increasing sample size. Excuses can be effective, and even valid, in a smaller sample size.

Unfortunately, the larger the sample size becomes, excuses become less valid/effective. Again, speaking about multiple seasons of data, not just one game or one season.

ski300 said:

I agree with this. It seems pretty obvious that Thorne had no intention of coming back next year. He has plans for a pro career somewhere next year. I think he wants to make it back on the court this year so he can prove he is healthy so he can improve his pro chances.

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+1. Can't blame him. Spending 6 years in college would mean 2 fewer seasons of potential pro earnings, and some big men only have so much shelf life left in their legs due to running the court carrying so much more weight. Going pro at age 24/25 isn't the wisest choice.

WesterveltVictoryCigar said:

He's played in the second half of the season, so he's not eligible for a medical RS.

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Loren Tate mentioned on the pre-game that if he didn't play another second, the team would appeal for a medical redshirt. The playing in that one game, actually might help their cause because it proves they were trying to get him back.

That being said, it appears he will be able to play soon.

Cubby Blue said:

Loren Tate mentioned on the pre-game that if he didn't play another second, the team would appeal for a medical redshirt. The playing in that one game, actually might help their cause because it proves they were trying to get him back.

That being said, it appears he will be able to play soon.

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Yeah, I think he will play again anyway. I know we had a lot of discussion on the board already about this topic, but it was all before that iu game if I recall. Just wondering if there had been any publicized talk from the staff/media since then. Thanks for the response.

Cubby Blue said:

Loren Tate mentioned on the pre-game that if he didn't play another second, the team would appeal for a medical redshirt. The playing in that one game, actually might help their cause because it proves they were trying to get him back.

That being said, it appears he will be able to play soon.

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Highly doubt if Loren has it right that a red-shirt would even be available for Thorne at this point since he had playing time during the regular season. Agree we should be seeing him on the court again for us soon prior to his way out the door for a European gig.

illini8507 said:

Yeah, I think he will play again anyway. I know we had a lot of discussion on the board already about this topic, but it was all before that iu game if I recall. Just wondering if there had been any publicized talk from the staff/media since then. Thanks for the response.

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I agree, he'll play at some point. Maybe having this week off will be enough. You could certainly appeal but it seems like a moot point to me.

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HeartofaChampion said:

Would have been a much closer game with MT and LB healthy and playing. Their inside presence was too much for us without those two on the floor; we just don't have enough talent to defend and rebound down low right now, and JG will have to find another fifth-year transfer for next year who can help provide those things. KN's off game didn't help, and our lack of a starting quality PG is frustrating. KL would be ideal as a 12-15 mpg guy off the bench but is being forced into a major role.

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bit of a side note, but beginning to wonder again if MT may be the 5th year next year...at what point do they give up on the comeback?

Illiniaaron said:

I didn't think Illinois would win this game but upsets happen quite often. If people are excited that the Illini kept it within twenty then I really don't get what the point of any of this is.

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If people expect Illinois (or anyone else) to upset top five teams with three starters missing, they aren't realistic. But, that's about half of the people on here it seems like.

Greensboro said:

bit of a side note, but beginning to wonder again if MT may be the 5th year next year...at what point do they give up on the comeback?

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Can Thorn come back next year? I thought after coming back for the Indiana game that took out next year as an option for him. But I don't know for sure.

Illinithad said:

If people expect Illinois (or anyone else) to upset top five teams with three starters missing, they aren't realistic. But, that's about half of the people on here it seems like.

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I don't think most would expect an upset even with the three missing starters. We just don't have the right mix of players, either way.

Happy with the effort and not giving up when down 20. Iowa not scoring for 5 or 6 minutes certainly helped. Iowa is a complete team and they play together. We are pieces and we played like pieces that don't fit together. Oh well. I don't see anything changing that so may as well get used to it. Hoping for lots of PT for they young guys that will pay off next year.

Illinithad said:

Can Thorn come back next year? I thought after coming back for the Indiana game that took out next year as an option for him. But I don't know for sure.

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As a lawyer, I want to answer that question by applying rules of statutory construction and looking for applicable precedent in prior medical redshirt and sixth year cases. When I look at it that way, I think there is a good faith argument to be made for a redshirt and a sixth year. It is not an overwhelming argument, given that he played in one game in the second half of the season, but neither is it a terrible argument. Were this purely a question of law, I'd say that if he is unable to play again this season (a huge if, as we all seem to agree), then he has perhaps a one in three chance of qualifying for a medical redshirt. Of course, if he does qualify for a medical redshirt, then (again assuming we try to apply principles of law here) he must also seek a sixth year waiver. I'd put his chances there as better than two out of three. Two medical redshirts (he got his first one as a freshman after playing about five minutes in one regular season game) are what the sixth year exception is all about, IMHO. Putting the two together, I'd say his chances would be about one in four if he is unable to play again this season.

But, again as a lawyer, I am realistic enough to know we are talking about the NCAA here, rather than strict adherence to the rule of law. I suspect the result could depend upon just who is making decisions for the NCAA at any particular point in time. On that more realistic level, I'd guess his chances are no better than one in ten.

Finally, I have the very strong gut impression that MT has no interest in being anyone's legal test case. He would much rather get back on the court this year than he would like to come back next year to finish his masters. And what he wants is a whole lot more important in the cosmic scheme of things than what I think would be best for the Illinois basketball program (i.e., to play for us next year, rather than in this lost season). And because that is the most important question, I'd have to say that the real world chance of him playing for Illinois next season is no better than one in a hundred.

Illinithad said:

Can Thorn come back next year? I thought after coming back for the Indiana game that took out next year as an option for him. But I don't know for sure.

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No.

themudflap said:

I am starting to believe that Mav could have one of those senior years we remember next year.

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Yeah..... I am thinking about buying those futures. Fletch will put him in the weight room and work with his feet and lateral movement. Looking for him to remold and change his body this summer.

I hope Mav really breaks out next year. Has definitely broke out on the offensive end. Between watching the game and looking at the box score. Nunn is really dragging us down lately. He took the most shots on the team and made two. If he and Lewis just shoot 40% it a much different ball game. I can't believe all of the bunnies Lewis missed.

Chathamillini said:

I hope Mav really breaks out next year. Has definitely broke out on the offensive end. Between watching the game and looking at the box score. Nunn is really dragging us down lately. He took the most shots on the team and made two. If he and Lewis just shoot 40% it a much different ball game. I can't believe all of the bunnies Lewis missed.

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Reminds me of all those Ekey missed tip dunks. If Lewis could just finish those it would be a huge lift for this team.

Without '9 observations' how the heck do I know how well we played?

1-5 at home in the B1G this year. Keep in mind we lost a TOTAL of four home games (B1G and non-conference) during seven seasons from 1999-2000 through 2005-2006! WTH

PerennIaLL said:

1-5 at home in the B1G this year. Keep in mind we lost a TOTAL of four home games (B1G and non-conference) during seven seasons from 1999-2000 through 2005-2006! WTH

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THAT's a sobering statistic even for those of us that desperately want to think the glass is half full...

CoalCity said:

THAT's a sobering statistic even for those of us that desperately want to think the glass is half full...

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Straight up depressing. Assembly Hall during that 99-06 period was like the Kohl Center during Ryan's peak years.

PerennIaLL said:

1-5 at home in the B1G this year. Keep in mind we lost a TOTAL of four home games (B1G and non-conference) during seven seasons from 1999-2000 through 2005-2006! WTH

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So your saying this bad year (injuries, recruiting misses and what not) don't live up to the best stretch in program history. Would have never guessed that.