NBA Draft

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#501      
FightinIllini30
I dunno, do you think we beat UConn simply by replacing Mirk with Morez? Because if not, we don't get a better result last season anyway, and our team is worse off this upcoming season with neither Mirk nor Morez.

I think that's all the original post was saying 2 years of Mirk > 1 year of Morez. I take that trade all day every day.
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Well the original post was saying that we won the Mirk vs Morez trade. They got a championship. I would take that over 100 seasons of Mirk without one
 
#503      
Second place is 1st loser
I don’t think Battle meant the winner of us vs. Michigan. I think he meant the winner of “us if we would have kept Morez” vs. “us with Mirk.” Obviously Morez was a big part of Michigan getting the Natty…but that doesn’t mean we would have won a Natty with him. Morez brings an awesome skill set, but he’s not a floor spacer like Mirk, and I doubt he would have brought the same unselfishness to the floor and locker room that really seemed to help our team thrive. And we’ll
get at least one more year with Mirk which we wouldn’t have had with Morez.
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I think there's a huge argument to be made that what this team was missing is Morez's physicality, athleticism, rim protection, etc. If we had a great rim protector, there's no way that some of those shifty PG's, that consistently torched us, would have attacked the rim as they did. Morez is a shot eraser.

Let's also not forget what he went Wemby on us when they came to Champaign. That was hard to watch. I wasn't feeling too keen on the trade whatsoever. He single handedly destroyed our entire frontcourt.

All of the above + a great combine makes him a lottery to mid round draft pick. I love Mirk, but saying he brought more value than a Sophomore Johnson would have is a hard sell.
 
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#504      
ImGonnaBeILL
If I'm an NBA contender and watching Wemby.....I'm damn well making it a priority to trade up for a cost controlled Mara to have the best shot of combating him.

And the most likely team to do it is OKC (who is currently experiencing Wembymania) and they hold the #12 & #17 picks, plus a war chest full of talent & future picks)
 
#505      
racinghoss
Give me Mirk over Morez. Morez is a beast, but is a misfit in the offense we ran last year. He has also proven to be a punk. Mirk bought in, has handles, and is a real 3 pt threat, vs a wannabe shooter like Morez.

I loved Morez and wish him well, but...
 
#507      
IlliniFaninHoosierLand
With NIL bringing over so many euros, are draft and stash guys going to be a thing anymore?
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Well it's not just Euros anymore that are draft and stash. They do have some of those players that go through the NBA academy in Africa and still end up playing for clubs in Europe because they're so young (usually 16 or 17) and then the teams check in on them and decide a few years down the line if they want to bring them over.
 
#508      
SCottm
I dunno, do you think we beat UConn simply by replacing Mirk with Morez? Because if not, we don't get a better result last season anyway, and our team is worse off this upcoming season with neither Mirk nor Morez.

I think that's all the original post was saying 2 years of Mirk > 1 year of Morez. I take that trade all day every day.
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And Mirk doesn't have the baggage that Johnson brought either.
 
#509      
mysterio2525
EmeraldCityIllini said:
Not everything has to be a win / loss. I think it’s quite possible if Illinois could choose the Morez decision over they wouldn’t change a thing, and Morez would say the same.
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what about the thought, had we not started Ben after the first month over morez we possibly could have both morez and mirk. according to the insiders, we had morez signed to come back. I don't know if he didn't feel like he was riding pine for a guy he was clearly better he may have never considered leaving at all. and my assumption was that mirk wasnt known by others this time last year. I certainly don't know what was going on behind the scenes, but feels like there is a world we're we could have had both had we managed playing time little differently.
 
#510      
Grandpa
Guys, of course Michigan had a better season than we had last year.

No one’s disputing that.

The question is: if we kept Morez and didn’t get Mirk, would our season have been any different? Would we have beat UConn in the F4 by simply replacing Mirk with Morez? Likely not.

Which means Morez would’ve given us the same season we had last year, but just one season vs Mirk for two.
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Compromise Shrug GIF
 
#511      
hoopsfan47
Just my two cents....but I really have no confidence that either Mirk of Morez would have been as successful had they co-existed on the same team. Mirk provided just a bit more versatility than Morez while Morez provided a bit more athleticism....not sure we could have achieved more trying to keep Morez happy and develop Mirk. Throw Z into the equation, a guy who needs to play more, and the minutes just were not there for all. Not an unfamiliar problem for NBA roster builders.
 
#513      
Brosky
It's hard for me to picture Morez in the NBA. He doesn't have a face up game and never will. And in the League, there are plenty of guards his height. Would he be able to guard them out on the floor? He just doesn't bring the package for a 6-9 guy.
 
#515      
thefalcon5
Battle89 said:
I really want to like this post, and I am exceedingly happy that Michigan will no longer have his services. But there is that pesky matter of them winning the national championship with him, so I don't know.

Let's circle back next April, if Mirk gets us a natty too then I'll concede.
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Maybe Michigan without morez doesn’t win the ship, but I don’t think replacing Mirk with morez last year wins us a ship.
 
#516      
ChiefGritty
illinitiger said:
Speaking of Michigan ...I've been hearing Mara has jumped up draft boards possibly to Clippers Nets or Hawks🤔
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Mara is not Wemby now and he won't be Wemby in the future.

HAVING SAID THAT, what teams are seeing in terms of what that combination of extremely tall rim protection on one end and a high skill level unusual for a 7-footer on the other end can do the physics and the strategy of basketball makes Mara a very appealing prospect.

Really wanted him for the Bulls but 4 is too high and he's never lasting to 15.
 
#517      
the juiceman cometh
mysterio2525 said:
what about the thought, had we not started Ben after the first month over morez we possibly could have both morez and mirk. according to the insiders, we had morez signed to come back. I don't know if he didn't feel like he was riding pine for a guy he was clearly better he may have never considered leaving at all. and my assumption was that mirk wasnt known by others this time last year. I certainly don't know what was going on behind the scenes, but feels like there is a world we're we could have had both had we managed playing time little differently.
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1. Surprised the BH hate still is a thing after the season he had. Morez did leave because of some Benjamins, but Ben Humrichous was not one of them.

2. The difference in avg mpg between freshman Morez and UM Morez was 7.5. With us he averaged 5.7 fouls per 40 minutes. That's a foul every 7 minutes. With UM he brought that down to 3.7 per 40. That's where the minutes difference comes from, not from BH playing.

3. Hard to imagine we pursue Mirk if we already have Morez for that role, harder to imagine Mirk comes here to back up Morez. Don't remember the timeline exactly but my recollection is that Mirk was more or less a direct result of Morez leaving and us needing to find a replacement.
 
#518      
Emerson Bigguns
ChiefGritty said:
Mara is not Wemby now and he won't be Wemby in the future.

HAVING SAID THAT, what teams are seeing in terms of what that combination of extremely tall rim protection on one end and a high skill level unusual for a 7-footer on the other end can do the physics and the strategy of basketball makes Mara a very appealing prospect.

Really wanted him for the Bulls but 4 is too high and he's never lasting to 15.
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Yeah, I think anyone who has watched the Spurs in the playoffs is asking themselves what they are going to do with this guy for the next 10 years... You certainly can't just let him catch lobs all day. Mara's ascension on the draft boards probably has more to do with his measurements than anything they saw on tape.

Mara is super tall, moves reasonably well, and can get his hands really high in the air. If you are going to win big in the next several years you're going to need a guy like that, and there just aren't very many.

Big Z's chances of of making the NBA have also increased during this playoffs, even if his role is a guy that sits on the bench until the Spurs roll into town... You're going to need a guy who is well over 7 feet and can move to even make Wemby think about how he is being guarded.

This must be how people felt when Wilt got to the league... He's like the 8th grader who shows up at a 5th grade pick up game...

If you are a Western Conference team, you have too consider Mara.... Dallas, GS,... if he gets to 12, you have t believe OKC will jump on him. They could use him tonight.
 
#520      
GrayGhost77
the juiceman cometh said:
1. Surprised the BH hate still is a thing after the season he had. Morez did leave because of some Benjamins, but Ben Humrichous was not one of them.

2. The difference in avg mpg between freshman Morez and UM Morez was 7.5. With us he averaged 5.7 fouls per 40 minutes. That's a foul every 7 minutes. With UM he brought that down to 3.7 per 40. That's where the minutes difference comes from, not from BH playing.

3. Hard to imagine we pursue Mirk if we already have Morez for that role, harder to imagine Mirk comes here to back up Morez. Don't remember the timeline exactly but my recollection is that Mirk was more or less a direct result of Morez leaving and us needing to find a replacement.
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Agree on the last point especially. And also, the team dynamic is completely different if we have Morez and not Mirk. What Mirk brought to the team transcends even what he brought on the court, and I really don't think we go as far as we did without that.
 
#521      
altgeld88
OlafB said:
View attachment 50338

Fears at the combine...
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I'm confused; is Fears the cat or the girl in this scenario?

The case for "girl": flopping and not ready for prime time; appealing immediately to the unseen official for a quick whistle.

The case for "cat": General first-class D-baggery. Though in the cat's defense, it didn't apply a sharp elbow to her neck or a donkey-kick in the groin. His premeditated tripping of her is positively sportsmanlike.

I can't wait to enjoy another season of deeply misunderstood Fears (and Izzo) enduring the outrageous slings and arrows of Big Ten fortune.
 
#523      
blackdog
Emerson Bigguns said:
Yeah, I think anyone who has watched the Spurs in the playoffs is asking themselves what they are going to do with this guy for the next 10 years... You certainly can't just let him catch lobs all day. Mara's ascension on the draft boards probably has more to do with his measurements than anything they saw on tape.

Mara is super tall, moves reasonably well, and can get his hands really high in the air. If you are going to win big in the next several years you're going to need a guy like that, and there just aren't very many.

Big Z's chances of of making the NBA have also increased during this playoffs, even if his role is a guy that sits on the bench until the Spurs roll into town... You're going to need a guy who is well over 7 feet and can move to even make Wemby think about how he is being guarded.

This must be how people felt when Wilt got to the league... He's like the 8th grader who shows up at a 5th grade pick up game...

If you are a Western Conference team, you have too consider Mara.... Dallas, GS,... if he gets to 12, you have t believe OKC will jump on him. They could use him tonight.
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All you have to do is look at what guys like Edey and Clingan have done for a blueprint for Mara. Both were thought of as outdated relics but they are so big and combine that with high IQ play to be pretty impact full players.
 
#524      
Birdus
the juiceman cometh said:
1. Surprised the BH hate still is a thing after the season he had. Morez did leave because of some Benjamins, but Ben Humrichous was not one of them.

2. The difference in avg mpg between freshman Morez and UM Morez was 7.5. With us he averaged 5.7 fouls per 40 minutes. That's a foul every 7 minutes. With UM he brought that down to 3.7 per 40. That's where the minutes difference comes from, not from BH playing.

3. Hard to imagine we pursue Mirk if we already have Morez for that role, harder to imagine Mirk comes here to back up Morez. Don't remember the timeline exactly but my recollection is that Mirk was more or less a direct result of Morez leaving and us needing to find a replacement.
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Morez DID struggle here with fouls. The hand injury also set him back. He will be a good NBA player. I think it worked out for everyone. His time here was very productive and he built on that at Michigan. Good luck to him. No animosity with the exception that he went to SCUM!
 
#525      
Birdus
altgeld88 said:
I'm confused; is Fears the cat or the girl in this scenario?

The case for "girl": flopping and not ready for prime time; appealing immediately to the unseen official for a quick whistle.

The case for "cat": General first-class D-baggery. Though in the cat's defense, it didn't apply a sharp elbow to her neck or a donkey-kick in the groin. His premeditated tripping of her is positively sportsmanlike.

I can't wait to enjoy another season of deeply misunderstood Fears (and Izzo) enduring the outrageous slings and arrows of Big Ten fortune.
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Ah, what would life be without IZZO?
 
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