The Illinois AD Search

IlliniOX08 · Feb 9, 2016

Genesis said:
I'll wager that the majority of people criticizing Whitman on here haven't accomplished 1/10th of the things he has and really have no idea of what he's capable of doing. Wash U has one of the largest endowments in the country so Whitman likely has experience talking with big money donors and corporations in trying to get them to direct more money to athletics at an academic institution. While he isn't who I originally thought we'd get, I think he'll make a great AD because of the orange and blue in his blood, his NFL connections and his ability to excel at whatever he puts his mind to. It may be wishful thinking, but I think he'll be confident enough to tell our administration what needs to be done to right the ship.

The debate isn't whether Whitman has accomplished more than people on this board. The debate is is whether or not Whitman is a better candidate that someone else the "search committee" and/or Korn Ferry could have produced assuming George/Tiley are a no. With Whitman, you're right we don't know what he's capable of. That's the point. We're pretty sure what George is capable of and Craig Tiley has true tangible evidence as to what he is capable of.

As I've said before, if it is Whitman, I'll disagree with the hire but will get over it and root for him to succeed as I hope most on here do. If he does succeed I'll be the first one back in line to eat crow.

Cubby Blue · Feb 9, 2016

IlliniOX08 said:
The debate isn't whether Whitman has accomplished more than people on this board. The debate is is whether or not Whitman is a better candidate that someone else the "search committee" and/or Korn Ferry could have produced assuming George/Tiley are a no. With Whitman, you're right we don't know what he's capable of. That's the point. We're pretty sure what George is capable of and Craig Tiley has true tangible evidence as to what he is capable of.

As I've said before, if it is Whitman, I'll disagree with the hire but will get over it and root for him to succeed as I hope most on here do. If he does succeed I'll be the first one back in line to eat crow.

Do you still disagree with it if you know that George and Tiley both said no way, no how?

coryfor3 · Feb 9, 2016

Cubby Blue said:
Do you still disagree with it if you know that George and Tiley both said no way, no how?

I would still disagree with it. He's just not ready or experienced enough. I'm sure Washington is a great place. It isn't Big 10. I know he's smart and accomplished at only 37. His justification would seem to be that he's an Illini guy and works in athletics administration. Not that he is the best candidate to be able to run the DIA.

Second and Chalmers · Feb 9, 2016

mattcoldagelli said:
You mean.....Dick Whitman?

ChainsawRevItUp · Feb 9, 2016

If they are indeed in talks with Tiley, let's keep in mind that it is only 6:40 A.M. in Australia. Probably won't be much discussion (if any) until later this afternoon/evening.

WesterveltVictoryCigar · Feb 9, 2016

ChainsawRevItUp said:
If they are indeed in talks with Tiley, let's keep in mind that it is only 6:40 A.M. in Australia. Probably won't be much discussion (if any) until later this afternoon/evening.

Well actually it's tomorrow afternoon.

Cubby Blue · Feb 9, 2016

coryfor3 said:
I would still disagree with it. He's just not ready or experienced enough. I'm sure Washington is a great place. It isn't Big 10. I know he's smart and accomplished at only 37. His justification would seem to be that he's an Illini guy and works in athletics administration. Not that he is the best candidate to be able to run the DIA.

There's that catch 22 again. You wait till he's older and he will be hired out from under you and too entrenched to move.

I get your point, and his. I wish we would have went balls out on Phillips five years ago...

IlliniOX08 · Feb 9, 2016

Cubby Blue said:
Do you still disagree with it if you know that George and Tiley both said no way, no how?

I would disagree with it based on the appearance that Korn Ferry hasn't been able to actually run a real national search. I mean.. the AD's for CMU and Fla Atlantic? Kelly Merhtens who had a scandal that rivaled if not exceeded Beckman's? These aren't real candidates. Sean Frazier was a real candidate but they hardly discovered him - every Illinois message board on the internet pegged him as a candidate within two hours of Thomas' firing.

Korn Ferry is a legit executive search firm and that's the list they came up with? It just smells of window dressing so our admin could court Tiley with either Whitman or Michael as fall backs while Shad Khan continued with George.

hermie1985 · Feb 9, 2016

BananaShampoo said:
Whitman was #3 on my own personal list - after George and then Tiley, but it won't upset me if he is the guy. I'll be more like "intrigued". I think in time he could be really great, but that they key - give him time. He'll have a lot of learning to do on the job and it might take a year or two to get up to speed. He seems like a smart enough guy that he'd be well up to the task.

But still, the thing that nags me is that if he IS the guy, we could have had him lined up months ago, and we wouldn't have been dealing with the program damaging media perceptions and the revenue program uncertainty we are dealing with now.

So your top 3 all had Illini ties. It is hard for me to believe that of all eligible candidates, the top 3 would all be previously connected to us.

I would hope Korn Ferry gave us other highly qualified individuals. Of those people, I would desire someone with many football contacts. It is going to take someone with clout to pull in a quality football staff.

Second and Chalmers · Feb 9, 2016

coryfor3 said:
I would still disagree with it. He's just not ready or experienced enough. I'm sure Washington is a great place. It isn't Big 10. I know he's smart and accomplished at only 37. His justification would seem to be that he's an Illini guy and works in athletics administration. Not that he is the best candidate to be able to run the DIA.

To the extent there is any unity of belief between the donor base and administration on this, the idea that having experience with the Illinois beast and knowing where some of the bodies are buried institutionally is valuable seems to be it.

The AAC or Big East darling AD is going to face a steeper learning curve than Whitman will. That seems counterintuitive, but it's reality.

Second and Chalmers · Feb 9, 2016

IlliniOX08 said:
Korn Ferry is a legit executive search firm and that's the list they came up with? It just smells of window dressing so our admin could court Tiley with either Whitman or Michael as fall backs while Shad Khan continued with George.

Window dressing is exactly what we paid for. This process was out of the administration's hands throughout.

Second and Chalmers · Feb 9, 2016

Warning: the Brunson-Evans comparison with George and Tiley was inapt. George was like Chris Paul or Steve Nash or something. Tiley and Whitman are Brunson and Evans.

It's time to get this horse in the barn - or else.

ChainsawRevItUp · Feb 9, 2016

Second and Chalmers said:
Warning: the Brunson-Evans comparison with George and Tiley was inapt. George was like Chris Paul or Steve Nash or something. Tiley and Whitman are Brunson and Evans.

It's time to get this horse in the barn - or else.

We are going to end up with this guy as our AD:

IlliniOX08 · Feb 9, 2016

Second and Chalmers said:
Warning: the Brunson-Evans comparison with George and Tiley was inapt. George was like Jamal Murray. Tiley and Whitman are Brunson and Evans.

It's time to get this horse in the barn - or else.

FIFY.

Shuttlesworth · Feb 9, 2016

Second and Chalmers said:
Warning: the Brunson-Evans comparison with George and Tiley was inapt. George was like Chris Paul or Steve Nash or something. Tiley and Whitman are Brunson and Evans.

It's time to get this horse in the barn - or else.

No. Tiley is a better hire than George, although either would be home runs. Oversees a much larger operation and has been incredibly successful at that, breaking records every year. Not sure why Tiley would be on the same level as a d3 athletic director. Tiley is taking a definite major step down if he takes the Illinois job. It's really a matter if he wants to make the big move.

IlliniBubba · Feb 9, 2016

IlliniOX08 said:
I would disagree with it based on the appearance that Korn Ferry hasn't been able to actually run a real national search. I mean.. the AD's for CMU and Fla Atlantic? Kelly Merhtens who had a scandal that rivaled if not exceeded Beckman's? These aren't real candidates. Sean Frazier was a real candidate but they hardly discovered him - every Illinois message board on the internet pegged him as a candidate within two hours of Thomas' firing.

Korn Ferry is a legit executive search firm and that's the list they came up with? It just smells of window dressing so our admin could court Tiley with either Whitman or Michael as fall backs while Shad Khan continued with George.

This is a good point. The list of candidates was definitely odd and smelled like just going through the motions. Which is fine if you're landing either George or Tiley, two experienced executives.

But if Whitman is the guy, I'd still feel a lot better if the other candidates were much more competitive. What about the Memphis AD that supposedly got vetted? Other rising star ADs from MVC, AAC, MAC, etc? If you look at a bunch of those candidates and still decide that an Illini guy is best for this particular situation, that's perfectly fine and I understand Whitman's appeal.

It's one thing to look at all available candidates and decide that someone with Illini ties is a differentiator. But it looks like we didn't even seriously consider any non-Illini candidates - if nothing else as a comparison for Whitman.

mattcoldagelli · Feb 9, 2016

IlliniBubba said:
It's one thing to look at all available candidates and decide that someone with Illini ties is a differentiator. But it looks like we didn't even seriously consider any non-Illini candidates - if nothing else as a comparison for Whitman.

Yep.

Illinois ties = a great tiebreaker, but a terrible prerequisite

Second and Chalmers · Feb 9, 2016

Shuttlesworth said:
No. Tiley is a better hire than George, although either would be home runs. Oversees a much larger operation and has been incredibly successful at that, breaking records every year. Not sure why Tiley would be on the same level as a d3 athletic director. Tiley is taking a definite major step down if he takes the Illinois job. It's really a matter if he wants to make the big move.

Regardless, if Tiley isn't on the next flight to O'Hare, there is absolutely no choice but to get Whitman on the dotted line, now.

ChainsawRevItUp · Feb 9, 2016

Second and Chalmers said:
Regardless, if Tiley isn't on the next flight to O'Hare, there is absolutely no choice but to get Whitman on the dotted line, now.

Yep. This is not about Whitman still being around to take the job if we wait on Tiley. It's about getting someone who is actually in charge to start fixing this mess.

Second and Chalmers · Feb 9, 2016

IlliniBubba said:
Other rising star ADs from MVC, AAC, MAC, etc?

I still say people are over-analogizing between hiring a coach and hiring an AD.

And the key difference: coaches get to recruit their own players and run whatever system they want. AD's, for the most part, don't get to recruit their own major donors and must exist within the system they find themselves.

Illinois' donor base have made clear that they will reject someone they don't know. The administration lacks the stability, credibility and courage to impose an outsider on the DIA and bulwark them against insurrection. Does that suck? Yeah. But taking a clear-eyed view of the situation is better than pretending it doesn't exist.

Whitman is a killer. He'll do fine. He'll roll the coaching dice and if they hit, he'll be a legend, if he craps out, so be it, Johnny Midmajor would hardly have had better odds. This is still no way to run an athletic department, but until the fire is put out, we don't have much of a choice.

EJ33 · Feb 9, 2016

Whitman does lack experience, but so do Tiley and George. I think they have zero D1 football or basketball coach hires between them. That's what sank Thomas and that's the biggest unknown with this group. Thomas was about as good an AD on paper as you could find (2 time AD of the Year, hired Butch Jones, Brian Kelly, Mick Cronin) and look what happened. Any AD at U of I is risky because the job is risky / hard.

EJ33 · Feb 9, 2016

Second and Chalmers said:
Whitman is a killer. He'll do fine. He'll roll the coaching dice and if they hit, he'll be a legend, if he craps out, so be it, Johnny Midmajor would hardly have had better odds. This is still no way to run an athletic department, but until the fire is put out, we don't have much of a choice.

Unfortunately he's gonna be playing a very weak hand for his first coaching hire. We should be prepared to give him a mulligan on that one. I'm hoping he can make the job look better in a few years by getting the money and making the facilities more competitive. That should be at or near the top of his list.

Second and Chalmers · Feb 9, 2016

EJ33 said:
Unfortunately he's gonna be playing a very weak hand for his first coaching hire. We should be prepared to give him a mulligan on that one. I'm hoping he can make the job look better in a few years by getting the money and making the facilities more competitive. That should be at or near the top of his list.

No question. But job #1 will be developing a vision and a plan for a football facility to sell to our next coach in December. The work starts now.

STLINI · Feb 9, 2016

mattcoldagelli said:
Yep.

Illinois ties = a great tiebreaker, but a terrible prerequisite

Very good way to put it.

AutoPoster 3000 · Feb 9, 2016

IlliniBubba said:
This is a good point. The list of candidates was definitely odd and smelled like just going through the motions. Which is fine if you're landing either George or Tiley, two experienced executives.

But if Whitman is the guy, I'd still feel a lot better if the other candidates were much more competitive. What about the Memphis AD that supposedly got vetted? Other rising star ADs from MVC, AAC, MAC, etc? If you look at a bunch of those candidates and still decide that an Illini guy is best for this particular situation, that's perfectly fine and I understand Whitman's appeal.

It's one thing to look at all available candidates and decide that someone with Illini ties is a differentiator. But it looks like we didn't even seriously consider any non-Illini candidates - if nothing else as a comparison for Whitman.

If you examine what was actually said and done (to the extent we know), it's apparent that the process here was never about locating the best available athletic director for the University of Illinois. The process was about polling the "stakeholders" to determine the characteristics of the ideal athletic director, and then seeing who out there best fit the description they created.

Maybe that sounds like semantics, but there's a difference. The former is like ordering the most popular item on the restaurant's menu, even if some people won't like it. The later is like asking everyone at the table to name their favorite ingredient, and then ordering a dish that contains as many of them as possible.