The Illinois AD Search

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#576      

IlliniOX08

Bucktown, Chicago
Not to derail the thread, but now that George is out, who do people want to see hired? It is sounding like Whitman or Michaels is most likely. How do people feel about either one of those?

I'd be happy at this point with either. My wish list looks like this:

Tiley
Whitman
Michaels
Sean Frazier (NIU AD)

Any four of those would make me happy, short of our admins waking up and hitting a different unforeseen home run.
 
#577      
This is all hypothetical, but here's my take....

Wilson is an interim chancellor. She has extensive experience on the academic side and is well qualified for that role. She is not, contrary to what some posters on this board state, an idiot. However, she is not versed in the athletic side of a University. Why would she be? She has been in academic administration running the LAS school. And, apparently, doing a good job of it.

Since she is not familiar with that part of the business, she needs to turn to people who are. She wasn't involved in the decision to fire Beckman. Wise was Chancellor then and apparently intended to keep Thomas. The people she believed she could trust on the issue (probably influential boosters) probably convinced her that Thomas should be fired and that there was a superstar replacement who was ready to jump into the job. So she trusted those people and acted on it.

This is what the problem is though! If this was indeed the case, she NEEDS to reach out to this person (George, or whomever) and make sure there is a mutual interest there. I don't have a problem with her looking for advice from donors on who to hire, but If you don't contact that person beforehand to confirm they want the job before you axe the current guy, then there is a problem. That's not the case of someone who's not qualified to hire an AD- that's someone who's not qualified to hire ANYONE.

Don't beleive this one's on the donors at all. That's kind of like blaming the people on this board for:
-Suggesting we hire Nick Saban
-Firing the entire coaching staff (hypothetical scenario where we have an actual coach in place not named Cubit)
-THEN asking Saban to be our coach
-When he declines, looking around and scratching your head
 
#578      
This is what the problem is though! If this was indeed the case, she NEEDS to reach out to this person (George, or whomever) and make sure there is a mutual interest there. I don't have a problem with her looking for advice from donors on who to hire, but If you don't contact that person beforehand to confirm they want the job before you axe the current guy, then there is a problem. That's not the case of someone who's not qualified to hire an AD- that's someone who's not qualified to hire ANYONE.

Don't beleive this one's on the donors at all. That's kind of like blaming the people on this board for:
-Suggesting we hire Nick Saban
-Firing the entire coaching staff (hypothetical scenario where we have an actual coach in place not named Cubit)
-THEN asking Saban to be our coach
-When he declines, looking around and scratching your head

I don't disagree entirely, but if I'm Barb Wilson and I don't know a football from a hole in the ground and Shad Khan calls me up and says "I will bring Rick George to your doorstep, let me handle it", I would be inclined to give him a shot to execute the mission.

Doesn't mean I wouldn't be prepping plan B's. George's public "no thank you" happened November 19.
 
#579      

Deleted member 29907

D
Guest
This is all hypothetical, but here's my take....

...

Since she is not familiar with that part of the business, she needs to turn to people who are. She wasn't involved in the decision to fire Beckman. Wise was Chancellor then and apparently intended to keep Thomas. The people she believed she could trust on the issue (probably influential boosters) probably convinced her that Thomas should be fired and that there was a superstar replacement who was ready to jump into the job. So she trusted those people and acted on it.

Those people were wrong. (Those are the people to blame for this situation, by the way. They may be boosters or others at the University, but they are the ones who screwed this all up.)

Had those people been right, we would be in great shape. But they weren't. If Wise's plan had been stuck to, we would be OK. Thomas would still be AD and he would be hiring a new coach.

Sorry, but for a job this big she should have directly confirmed and 'signed' the heir apparent before making the cut. She may have been misled, but that's not an excuse.

Edit: looks like this was brought up above - yes Khan would be tough to push back on - but as always "Trust but verify".
 
#580      
Not to derail the thread, but now that George is out, who do people want to see hired? It is sounding like Whitman or Michaels is most likely. How do people feel about either one of those?

Whitman all the way. I'm tired of experienced retreads that other schools didn't want. With our situation, we're not going to get the top level AD's and coaches, but we certainly can get the up and coming superstars.

I'd look for a green candidate with tons of upside and let him learn on the job. What's the worst that could happen? It can't get much worse than the past 12 months (or even 20 years), but a guy like Whitman, allowed to get his feet wet, could be phenomenal eventually. I'd rather do this than bring in just another administrator who does a poor to average job.

Take the risk. I feel the same way on football and basketball coaches - let's go after top assistants, but let's do homework first and see which one(s) have the best leadership characteristics. It truly isn't that hard to see or figure out. It really is not. All of the coaches and leaders across all sports that we know of today were once early in their careers and with most of them, it was obvious to all around them that they just had "IT" to be successful. And then someone really smart took a chance on them.

Yeah, it won't always work but what we're doing today has been nothing but failure for years. Hire Josh Whitman!
 
#581      
Sorry, but for a job this big she should have directly confirmed and 'signed' the heir apparent before making the cut. She may have been misled, but that's not an excuse.

Edit: looks like this was brought up above - yes Khan would be tough to push back on - but as always "Trust but verify".

I'm not entirely sure that is a legal option.

I'm not sure that policy allows you to recruit for a position before it is opened. That's why I think while feelers may be put out, the contact is done by third parties not acting in an official capacity instead of directly.

You have to understand that this is not a private institution. The people in power can't just make up the rules as they go. Those who do, get into trouble...sometimes legal trouble.

Given what Wise got in trouble for, I don't think I would be bending any rules or having any off the record conversations.
 
#582      
Has anyone given any thought to that maybe they put some feelers out and realized extending Cubit was the best move for now, based on answers they had? I think it is just as plausible that George told them not now, but maybe next year. Let me finish this thing I have going on now and I will leave then. That is just as likely as anything anyone else has ranted on.
 
#583      
Given what Wise got in trouble for, I don't think I would be bending any rules or having any off the record conversations.

Well, considering the job has never been formally posted and there were multiple entreaties made to Rick George....you be the judge.

Lets be adults here. Phyllis Wise was fired because the Salaita situation was "damned if she does, damned if she doesn't", and it made her position untenable. The FOIA thing was just a pretext to kick her out without further touching the hornet's nest.
 
#584      
I think it is just as plausible that George told them not now, but maybe next year. Let me finish this thing I have going on now and I will leave then.

That seems wildly implausible, but whatever. If Rick George wants us to burn down the football program in order to take the job, I would say we can do a lot better than Rick George.
 
#585      

Illwinsagain

Cary, IL
Better said than I, and in considerably fewer words :thumb:

And again, if stable chain of command is so important, why is an interim AD firing Mike Thomas and hiring a new AD?

If Thomas or Kowalcyzk hires a new coach, you can easily kick the AD can down the road to a new chancellor who can make direct, empowered decisions about everyone below them in the hierarchy as they see fit. If you get it right, no one is going to care who hired our awesome coach, and if you get it wrong, 2018 is just as good as 2016 to get your ducks in a row, and you don't have to decimate the roster getting there.

I'm done belaboring this. People either want to see the truth or they don't.

I'm with you here. I just wish that they would have announced the beginning of the search process yesterday, including Cubit. You knew he would take it, if no one else better accepts, you say he was the best all along and everyone saves face. If you can get Mark Richt, Dino Babers or someone else that seems like a big upgrade, you hire him. It gives the new AD a couple years to settle in, evaluate all of the programs and get ready for the next big hire, regardless of sport.
 
#586      

Illwinsagain

Cary, IL
This was all absolutely rock-solid, dead-on what happened and an excellent analysis thereof, until you got to the bolded.

Paul Kowalczyk is an experienced pro who was and is extremely capable of advising Chancellor Wilson and if necessary making a hire. His public statements before and after this decision have made clear that he understands what a disaster this is, he would have done things very differently, and his voice was not heard in the process of making this decision.

You are dead right that Wilson and Killeen fell for a line of BS by radical, selfish donors who are ultimately the cause of all this. That's inexperience and naivete, not stupidity.

You are dead right that once the George gambit blew up, Wilson was trapped on an island with no good options.

But once put in that position, our leadership reacted like so many posters here who lack an understanding of the college coaching profession did. "Gee, can't we just bluff our way through another year and handle this when the house is in order?" It's an idea that sounds better and better the less you know about how the business works. Paul Kowalcyzk has spent a decade as a Division 1 athletic director at two different stops, he was entrusted with the role of interim AD, he knew what a terrible idea this was and he wasn't listened to.

THAT is what is so worthy of condemnation.

Honestly, I wish that they would have taken the interim off of Kowalcyck, and give him the college friendly buyout. AD's don't make what Head Football Coaches make. The other football coaches wouldn't have figured out that he really is the interim, unless if works well. He could have easily found someone more effective and appreciated than Cubit. And, recruiting would not be screwed for the next 2 years.
 
#587      
Mentors

If we hired Witman I'm sure people like Colangelo and Kahn and others would be glad to mentor and guide him through the getting established and contact making process. Plus this would be his dream job I'm assuming and would have more skin in the game because of his prior association as an athlete and desire to see our success because of an emotional connection. I also believe he would reestablish the relationships with former athletes that have felt a disconnect. In fact I just spoke with a former player and coach that agreed wholeheartedly and said he was just speaking with other former players and they were saying the same thing!
 
#588      

Illwinsagain

Cary, IL
If we hired Witman I'm sure people like Colangelo and Kahn and others would be glad to mentor and guide him through the getting established and contact making process. Plus this would be his dream job I'm assuming and would have more skin in the game because of his prior association as an athlete and desire to see our success because of an emotional connection. I also believe he would reestablish the relationships with former athletes that have felt a disconnect. In fact I just spoke with a former player and coach that agreed wholeheartedly and said he was just speaking with other former players and they were saying the same thing!

If we think we can pick coaches, I am certain he feels the same way.
 
#589      
Read up on Whitman some, because honestly, I knew little of him, but I am sold. Seems awfully dang smart (studied law), UI graduate, nfl experience, AD experience at smaller albeit successful schools, looks like he connects well with others(likable/raised quite a bit of money), and he is young.


http://www.uwlathletics.com/staff.aspx?staff=66

The WashU bio is pretty much the same.
 
#590      
I'd be happy at this point with either. My wish list looks like this:

Tiley
Whitman
Michaels
Sean Frazier (NIU AD)

Any four of those would make me happy, short of our admins waking up and hitting a different unforeseen home run.

The sad part about it, it's probably one of them and don't need to be drawn out
 
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#591      

Deleted member 569417

D
Guest
I've resigned myself that this school and its donors simply want "one of their own" installed in these jobs and competence, experience, and success don't matter at all to them. So, what I'd like to see won't ever happen...

With that said, since it's going to come down to Whitman and Michael, Whitman is easily #1 for me in that choice. I don't know if I'm actually a bit optimistic that he would be OK, or if I'm just telling myself that because I'm falling in love with my captor and it's my only option.

There is no number 2. If Tom Michael is hired, I will be totally done with my Alma Mater. I lived through 19 years of Ron Guenther. I don't need any more of it with his hand picked guy. I graduated in 1992, coming off of 4 straight bowl games in football, saw a Final Four, and Guenther killed it all. He murdered it. To think that we are still listening to the "boosters" that enabled, encouraged, and kept Ron Guenther around for 19 years makes my blood boil.
 
#592      
I've resigned myself that this school and its donors simply want "one of their own" installed in these jobs and competence, experience, and success don't matter at all to them. So, what I'd like to see won't ever happen...

With that said, since it's going to come down to Whitman and Michael, Whitman is easily #1 for me in that choice. I don't know if I'm actually a bit optimistic that he would be OK, or if I'm just telling myself that because I'm falling in love with my captor and it's my only option.

There is no number 2. If Tom Michael is hired, I will be totally done with my Alma Mater. I lived through 19 years of Ron Guenther. I don't need any more of it with his hand picked guy. I graduated in 1992, coming off of 4 straight bowl games in football, saw a Final Four, and Guenther killed it all. He murdered it. To think that we are still listening to the "boosters" that enabled, encouraged, and kept Ron Guenther around for 19 years makes my blood boil.

Whitman has at least as good of a claim to being RG's "hand picked guy" as Michael does. Shawn Wax would be #1 on that list, by the way.

Whatever happens, the fact is that the Guentherites have retaken control of the DIA and that's just the way it's going to be. You're wise to understand that those forces have every bit as much to do with where Illini athletics are as the University administration.
 
#593      

EJ33

San Francisco
With that said, since it's going to come down to Whitman and Michael, Whitman is easily #1 for me in that choice. I don't know if I'm actually a bit optimistic that he would be OK, or if I'm just telling myself that because I'm falling in love with my captor and it's my only option.

There is no number 2. If Tom Michael is hired, I will be totally done with my Alma Mater.

Whitman is a really, really impressive guy, but he needs to get a MAC-level AD job before we bring him back to the Alma Mater.

Listening to Tom Michael on WDWS several times over the years, I always viewd him as sort of a "Mike Thomas, Jr." A competent administrator perhaps, but not the dynamic guy that can get you to the next level.

We don't need a U of I guy. We need somebody good.
 
#595      
A few things from this article stood out for me.

First, that there is absolutely zero acknowledgement that there needs to be any urgency concerning any of these decisions, as if it's the norm to drag this out for months or even a year or more. And complete tone-deafness to the fact the fanbase is going to be highly displeased with this unnecessarily leisurely pace. Do any of these people get that 16 months is not an acceptable waiting period for them to get around to naming the real permanent head coach? Yet it's all shrugged off with, "Meh, this is how this kind of stuff unfolds." Uh, actilually, no. Weeks typically. Not years.

Second, Wilson's comment that they "haven't worked out the details yet" of the buyout or if there will even be one. That's the whole point of their asinine two-year contract. How was that not the first thing worked out?

Third, that Killeen describes the Cubit decision as "well thought out" when meanwhile, they never even explored the option of looking to Kowalczyk to find a head coach, haven't even decided on forming the search committee that will "get [them] a short list of people that will be phenomenal" for the AD, and can't set any kind of time table for accomplishing anything. What indications are there that any of this was thought out at all?

Fourth, Killeen's curious comment that the team under Cubit "has been competitive in all the games that I've watched." Huh? We were blown out in four of our seven losses, literally a third of the games we played in this year.

Fifth, Killeen's utterly clueless statements that he Is "very much looking forward to next season and the recruitment that coach Cubit will be able to undertake next year," and also his statement that "This is a time of rebuilding ..." You just committed the program to at least 12 more months of interim head coaching. By necessity you've postponed the start of any rebuilding for at least a year. Dude, what are you talking about?

Lastly, Wilson's rather sorry comments about her process of learning what the criteria for a good AD should be, like she's trying to find a quality caterer for her daughter's wedding.

There's more embedded in there, I could go on. But I just hope the folks who thus far have viewed this a reasonable decision made by informed people who understand the world of major college football are taking note of this stuff. There is nothing about these comments that give you any confidence these decision makers have any clue what to do here. It comes off as amateur hour in the worst way and confirms all of our worst fears.

Love this post. So true...
 
#596      
Whitman has at least as good of a claim to being RG's "hand picked guy" as Michael does. Shawn Wax would be #1 on that list, by the way.

Whatever happens, the fact is that the Guentherites have retaken control of the DIA and that's just the way it's going to be. You're wise to understand that those forces have every bit as much to do with where Illini athletics are as the University administration.

For those of us too young to remember - I take it what made the Guenther years so bad was that he let the donors run the show?
 
#597      
Tom Michael would be an epic failure. I'm not a fan of his AD abilities. Although he did tell me once that Dino Babers would be the next Illini football coach. On second thought, bring on Tom Michael AND Dino Babers!!
 
#598      

BZuppke

Plainfield
I guess I fail to see what Tommy Michael and other inexperienced alums add to the mix. If they weren't alums we wouldn't consider them. I think we need an experience AD with connections to the right places and people. The NIU AD? Maybe he could lure Dave Aranda or Dave Doeren here. George is still first choice.
 
#600      
For those of us too young to remember - I take it what made the Guenther years so bad was that he let the donors run the show?

To sum it up briefly: Guenther treated his job as if he were managing a little private club made up of the athletes, their families, the coaches, his inner circle of high-dollar donors and no one else. He didn't see himself as the head of a public brand in a competitive marketplace.
 
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