The Illinois Football Coaching Search

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#1,901      

TwoElevenEastDaniel

TwoElevenEastDaniel
Cochrane's-Orchid-Tonic
TwoElevenEastDaniel
wma500 said:
I know the D3 landscape very well, so a couple thoughts....the very top of D3....talking like 5-7 programs....are run like FCS programs. They look more like EIU than St Norberts. Examples are Mount Union, Whitewater, St Johns, North Central and Mary Hardin Baylor. St Thomas is one of those programs as well, and they are actually moving directly from D3 to FCS in 2021 (they just signed their first D1 class this week, also no changes in the coaching staff either). What does that mean? It means full times coaching staffs, extensive film study, extensive recruiting and not just on a local basis, installation of offensive and defensive concepts that mirror what's being done at the D1 level, deep rosters of very talented players, etc.

Tops kids at these programs typically have FCS offers or even PWO at D1's. They're not Big 10 material, don't get me wrong, but they are very talented athletes who are just an inch or two shorter or a step slower.

I have zero issues w/ LL and his Buffalo staff...football translates at any level, and what he was doing at Whitewater was very impressive. If LL can make the move from Whitewater to Buffalo, he can certainly make the move from Buffalo to Illinois.
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I used to live right down Lake Street from St. Thomas. Great academic school (B-School in particular) and I had the pleasure of working with a few guys who played football there. Happy for them.
 
#1,902      

ChiefGritty

ChiefGritty
Chicago, IL
ChiefGritty
WINTer said:
Pretty sure they were in the Big East when Golden was there.
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Incorrect, they dropped out of the Big East and were independent for a couple years and then joined the MAC during Golden's tenure.

Everyone was amazed by Temple winning games, but they were in fact a more ambitious, better-resourced program than their competitors, and all Golden ever did was beat up on weaklings, the kind of teams Temple has already been beating.

Temple has had four straight coaches jump to Power Five jobs (five if you count Manny Diaz being there for like a week), and the guy who actually elevated the underlying quality of the program, Matt Rhule, proved to be the best of the bunch, no real surprise.

Stuff like that is what advanced stats are really good for.
 
#1,903      

wma500

wma500
wma500
FinalFour88 said:
Are you sure about this FCS comment? I played Division II football back in the '90s, and we were nationally ranked in D-II a couple of years, and no one on our team had FCS offers in high school. Maybe times have changed since the late 90s, but I can't see someone getting an FCS offer and going D-III instead.
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Remember, FCS includes schools like EIU, ISU, etc, who offer scholarships, but it also includes Pioneer League (no scholarships) and Patriot League (more limited scholarships). North Central's QB went to Indiana State his freshman year, loved the idea of being a D1 kid, but looked around after his freshman year and said this really isn't what he thought it'd be. He transferred to North Central, won a national championship his senior year and was invited to the 49ers camp. Many many stories like that at the very top of D3. The very top of D3 football is very attractive to high quality players.
 
#1,907      

ChiefGritty

ChiefGritty
Chicago, IL
ChiefGritty
IllinoisOKC said:
Hahaha I’m just sayin how i was onboard with that train that never even got rolling. I just want a recruiter to come here so bad! Figure the rest out later
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We can get a really elite recruiter to come here as an AHC/RC-type. And we should. It's really just a question of money.
 
#1,908      

Deleted member 29907

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SKane said:
On a scale of 1 - 10.

LL - 7 upside, 4 downside

BB - 8 upside, 2 downside.

Up and coming P5 coordinator - 9 upside, 2 downside.
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Sign me up for stability in this scenario (LL). We can shoot for winning the Big Ten and taking bigger risks (or attracting a higher upside coach) after we've proven we can get to bowl games consistently.
 
#1,909      

champaignchris

C
champaignchris
illinihawk16 said:
Thanks for putting that together. It's interesting that 6 of the 15 hires went on to have winning records at their P5 programs (Pinkel, Meyer, Golden, Doeren, Campbell, Fleck)
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I think it's more nuanced than that.

Kill went .500 at Minnesota, but we all know that had his health problems not interfered he'd have a winning record there. They were 9-4 the year after he retired with the interim coach at the helm.

Similarly, Hoeppner only got two recruiting classes in before he passed away. Indiana's only bowl appearance in a 22 year stretch was the next season with the roster he put together.

Clawson at WF was 6-18 in his first two seasons and has been 34-26 since. This might be his fifth straight bowl season, but I don't know what's going on with COVID and the ACC's bowl bids.

Jim Grobe didn't have a winning record, but Wake was a lot better during his tenure than Illinois was over the same period. Same can be said for Baber's time at Syracuse.
 
#1,910      

IllinoisOKC

IllinoisOKC
IllinoisOKC
Mike55 said:
I've always thought recruiting for Ohio State was like selling snow cones for 5 cents to a wealthy person in the desert. (sorry illinoisOKC, too much caffeine today)
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No ur good. Think my brain is becoming fried from all the research and names going through my head. Even my wife says Illinois needs to hurry and make a decision so I can stop reading everything like its a clue of some sort
 
#1,917      

FollowMeDontFollowMe

F
FollowMeDontFollowMe
Checking out the Todd Monken bio - the guy has been on 9 teams in 20 years. I wonder what drives him to move around so much.

He was head coach at Southern Miss, and took them from 1-11 to 9-5 in 3 years, and then parlayed that into the TB Buccaneers OC job. Seems like he could've done better than that at the time at least financially staying in NCAA as a HC. But maybe college game wasn't for him, except he's back in NCAA at Georgia as their OC.
 
#1,919      

illini0440

illini0440
illini0440
TheGMan said:
Is that a possibility?
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Sesame Street Idk GIF
 
#1,920      

WeWillWhen

WeWillWhen
WeWillWhen
champaignchris said:
Here are the MAC coaches hired directly by P5 programs since 2000:

2001: Jim Grobe – Ohio 33-33-1 > Wake Forest 77-82
2001: Gary Pinkel – Toledo 73-37-3 > Missouri 118-73
2003: Urban Meyer – Bowling Green 17-6 > Utah 22-2
2005: Terry Hoeppner – Miami, OH 48-25 > Indiana 9-14 (passed away after 2 seasons)
2010: Turner Gill – Buffalo 20-30 > Kansas 5-19
2011: Al Golden – Temple 27-34 > Miami, FL 32-25
2011: Michael Haywood – Miami, OH 10-15 > Pittsburgh 0-0 (arrested and fired before ever coaching a game)
2011: Jerry Kill – Northern Illinois 23-16 > Minnesota 29-29
2012: Tim Beckman – Toledo 21-16 > Illinois 12-25
2013: Dave Doeren – Northern Illinois 23-4 > North Carolina St 55-45
2013: Darrell Hazell – Kent St 16-10 > Purdue 9-33
2014: Dave Clawson – Bowling Green 32-32 > Wake Forest 40-44
2016: Dino Babers – Bowling Green 18-9 > 24-36 Syracuse
2016: Matt Campbell – Toledo 35-15 > Iowa St 34-27
2017: PJ Fleck – Western Michigan 30-22 > Minnesota 26-18

I think this shows that Illinois fans shouldn't be using Tim Beckman as a frame of reference here. Turner Gill, Darrell Hazell and Michael Haywood are the only coaches on this list who had less successful tenures at their subsequent stops. Everyone else - even guys whose tenures are deemed disappointing like Dino Babers - have been better than Beckman was at Illinois.

Al Golden to Miami was the only instance of an elite program hiring a MAC coach, but Miami was under stiff NCAA penalties at the time. All the remainders are programs that we can consider to be Illinois' peers.
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Excellent research. MAC coaches generally have done better than I thought.
 
#1,921      

Deleted member 747671

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Deleted member 747671
FollowMeDontFollowMe said:
Checking out the Todd Monken bio - the guy has been on 9 teams in 20 years. I wonder what drives him to move around so much.

He was head coach at Southern Miss, and took them from 1-11 to 9-5 in 3 years, and then parlayed that into the TB Buccaneers OC job. Seems like he could've done better than that at the time at least financially staying in NCAA as a HC. But maybe college game wasn't for him, except he's back at Georgia as their OC.
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I kinda wrote it off as him wanting to be in the NFL but having bad luck finding stable situations. The Georgia OC thing kinda threw a wrench into my thinking. Maybe he wants a big college HC job now? That Monken article sure made it sound like Todd has 0 interest in the Illinois job.
 
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