KBLEE
- Montgomery, IL
:thumb:
War Chant has been retired
:thumb:
Is that really so bad though? If 3 years from now I'm cheering on the University of Illinois Bobcats while they defeat USC in the Rose bowl or downing Kentucky in the National Championship, is that really hindering my experience of those events? Do you really think Syracuse fans in 2003 were thinking "yea that national championship was nice, but it would have been so much better if we were still the Saltine Warriors."
Winning creates memories and traditions. All I want for the University of Illinois is
1) For the sports teams to win and
2) The academics to stay strong so my degree continues to have merit.
Sure, I'd love for the Chief to still be dancing, and I will continue to say that the Chief logo is the greatest logo in the history of sports until the day I die, but that stuff all comes in a distant 3rd to those 2 things.
Syracuse wasn't the Saltine Warriors any more than we were the Chief Illiniweks. The change from "Orangemen / Orangewomen" to "Orange" was pretty silly, but they still kept the same basic name of the teams.
And of course I'd like to be successful, but we can be successful as the Fighting Illini. That's our name and identity. Remove the Native American imagery and return it to its original World War I meaning, fine, but the name shouldn't change.
So you'd be fine if your kids refused to acknowledged and even went as far as to disown your parents if coincidentally they won a state championship three years later?
Fair enough, point still stands. If North Dakota university wins (whatever level they are) championship, I'm sure their fans won't be kicking themselves because they won as the Fighting Hawks and not the Fighting Sioux.
And I agree, I would like to keep the name Fighting Illini, and I assume we will. It will be easier to keep if you tie it to a new mascot though, and distance it away from people associating it with American Indians (no matter how much people explain that it came from WWI solider students).
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That's... not a good analogy.
It would be like if I won a state championship for Pekin High School back in the 70s and my kids won a state championship for Pekin High School in the 00s.
Does theirs mean less because they're the Dragons now? No. Does mine mean less because they changed the mascot name? No.
And even that's not a great analogy for U of I's situation, because I would be shocked if we actually changed the name Fighting Illini. All I'm saying is that if the Illini were winning football and basketball games, I highly doubt anyone would care if we got rid of the war chant, and I'm sure the vast majority of fans wouldn't care if we were called the Prairie Dogs or something dumb if it was preceded by "The 2018 National Champion..."
Including you and the other whiners on this board who just can't handle losing the War Chant. Get over yourselves and suck it up buttercups. Some people are so sensitive that they'd stop supporting the U of I over a song. We don't need a song or dance to love our alma mater and our teams. Suck...it...up and stop your whining.
Ransom Stoddard
Ordained Dudeist Priest
- Bloomington, IL
FYI--I'm not whining and my posting history on this topic supports that. Not sure why you're taking so much offense, I guess that sort of proves my point.
LeinieGuy
Will work for bourbon
- Lexington, KY
Quick preface: Put me in the crowd of utterly disappointed at the demise of the Chief. This termination of "War Chant", on first hearing the news, made me do a huge eye roll, and feel like many -- "what's next??"
That aside, I would REALLY like a new musical piece / anthem that can fire up the crowd at football and basketball games. (War Chant is ingrained tradition, but it had to start somewhere. I also agree with many on here who said War Chant was a bit awkward in its timing and placement.) It would be cool to see the start of a new musical tradition, and kids 80 years from now will have no idea about the origin, but they get shivers whenever they hear it.
Calling all composers......
That aside, I would REALLY like a new musical piece / anthem that can fire up the crowd at football and basketball games. (War Chant is ingrained tradition, but it had to start somewhere. I also agree with many on here who said War Chant was a bit awkward in its timing and placement.) It would be cool to see the start of a new musical tradition, and kids 80 years from now will have no idea about the origin, but they get shivers whenever they hear it.
Calling all composers......
IMO, anyone who says that they're going to stop supporting the program and coming to games over this is full of crap. If they say that, they very likely weren't doing either of those anyways, so it's just hot air.
There were/are probably people who withheld support over the Chief, but for War Chant? We've been terrible at football for over 20 years now, bad at basketball for 10+, and THIS is the last straw? Not buying it.
However, some of us are upset over HOW it was done. We're both (multiple) points of view rally considered? Were alumni surveyed? Or was it just a matter of when after initial hurt feelings were expressed?
Novel Idea: Instead of a mascot, we have a group. One that includes a diverse set of individuals. Something like this wouldn't offend people right?
Illiini
- In the land of the Nittany Lion
No, this is not "the last straw." To the contrary, it's just the next straw. We were told "just the Chief," not the music. Well, they've opened that door now, haven't they. First the came for the War Chant...
But since we all haven't grown tired of discussing this--well, actually, I have, but that doesn't mean I'll stop--here's Jeremy Warner discussing it on his radio show with two, um, commentators: Link.
And if you're wondering where the War Chant came from, this might be the source...though it's quite possible the tune goes back even further. Link.
South Farms
- near Ogden & Rt 83
They will NEVER , EVER use a soldier or any reference to the military as a possible replacement for our Chief . These "people" loathe the military, about as much as they loathe colonialism, imperialism , and the concept of manifest destiny .
You need to think in the realm of inanimate objects like trees , the wind , prairie grass, the clouds , etc .
Why do you think Stanford picked a giant Redwood ?
Certainly hope its not 'The Wind' - i can just see the 'Break Wind!' signs from our opponents.
The University of Illinois Fighting South Farms Wind? :hand:
Article from the editor (a UofI alum) in today's Dekalb Daily Chronicle suggesting that a new name for sports teams needs to be found to replace "Fighting Illini". Mentions how he is disappointed with Whitman's signoff to his letter. Suggests "Prairie Fire" as an alternative.
I think there is a group that will not be satisfied until every reference to Native Americans is removed from our university. Since the French borrowed part of a Native American word to name the state I am not sure how they can accomplish this but, am sure it won't stop them from trying.
I think there is a group that will not be satisfied until every reference to Native Americans is removed from our university. Since the French borrowed part of a Native American word to name the state I am not sure how they can accomplish this but, am sure it won't stop them from trying.
ILLWKU
- Richmond, KY
Yes and no. Yes it is all about the memories that your teams create (especially when they win IE 2005) but I think that a mascot/song/whatever can carry a lot of meaning to a fanbase. I remember one of the last times I saw the Cheif (2004) and its a memory I will cherish. With my dad and nearly 14,000 (or whatever it was) fellow fans in orange singing the alma-mater. I haven't experienced many things like that. Its too bad that all of this is happening and its more of a sign of a changing culture. A lot of memories and values are starting to die out.
Stevegarbs
- Mokena, IL
And that poor school has yet to recover- terrible academics, bad sports teams, horrible reputation. Let us not repeat that mistake! SMH.
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Standford's motto: "The wind of freedom flows" . Perhaps we could use "The winds of the South Farms waft". :thumb:
Except Fighting Illini is not referencing Native Americans...
Illiini
- In the land of the Nittany Lion
University of Illinois students called themselves "Illini" well back into the early days of the school. For example, the original name for the student paper, starting in 1871, was The Student. the first University of Illinois student publication. It was renamed Daily Illini in 1874.
The sports teams were generally known as the "U of I football team," though when, I think it was about 1910, the sports writer for the DI could say "our Indians" and his readers know that he was talking about the U of I football team. Students were calling themselves "Illini" before the turn of the century.
The misconception that "Fighting Illini" refers to WW I soldiers comes from that fact that the sports teams gained "Fighting" as part of their name. It was "Illini" before the war, and "Fighting Illini" after the war. Already the American Indian/Native American imagery was so ingrained in the university psyche that when fund raising for Memorial Stadium, the profile of an Indian chief was used, this in the early '20s.
It is what it is, and you either defend it for what it is, work to make it acceptable to everyone (other than those who are steadfastly against anything), or you give it up.
LOL! this post is littered with so much misinformation that I'm not surprised that it was written by a person who uses the term snowflake unironically. As someone who has graduated in engineering from UI and whos immediate family are professors in agriculture and engineering at UI, I can tell you are misguided.
As an engineering school we are tied right behind MIT, Berkeley, Stanford, and Georgia Tech which in fact, is right where historically UI has always been ranked. To also act like being third ranked in the B10 (which we are NOT) is some kind of bottoming out of our engineering prowess is also trying to prove a point that doesn't exist, as Purdue and Michigan are both ranked in the top 10 nationally , ahead of schools such as Princeton , Johns Hopkins, Duke, and Cornell.
To think that discussions surrounding getting rid of the War Chant is a reason the UI has slipped academically (which it hasn't, at least in engineering and agriculture) is so hilariously out of left field that it shows me you really have no idea how university administration works. While there is always room to get better, through hiring better researchers, teachers, and encouraging student engagement there is certainly no "ship that needs to be righted."
(P.S. Your UI alum friend seems to have a better knowledge of these things as Iowa State and Purdue are very renowned programs for agriculture that are extremely well respected in the field. In fact Iowa State had the nation's first ever agricultural engineering department!)
Sorry for the rant, but even though the issue of the Chief and War Chant are clearly divisive with points on both sides, it really is sad that people will use it to peddle misinformation about our beloved university to make it look bad.
:tsk:
Agree 1000%, but don't think for one miute that that fact will stop some from trying to link it with Native Americans and thus attempt to eliminate the name.