Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread (October 2016)

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#651      
Tevo
Obelix said:
The second aspect is that people confuse "players have not regressed" with "strong player development." Two different things. Illinois has only placed just one player on the second all-B1G team (Hill), and just one as a consensus third all-B1G team (Paul - DJ RIchardson was 3rd in one of the two polls). Combined with the positional recruiting gap, that will not be enough to elevate the team into the upper echelon in the B1G.
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This second part is my concern. I'm sure the vast majority of our players have improved, as we'd expect every athlete to do from age 18 to 22. The question is, are the players at Illinois improving more or more quickly than those at the competing schools? We can have player improvement each year, and still remain 10th or 11th in the league, if everyone else is improving too. We need to outpace the competition, in recruiting and/or development, if we expect to get back to the top of the B1G. This year's recruiting class looks like it's in line to do that, as it should end up in the Top 3 of the Big Ten when all is said and done (though the size of the class this year means that next year's class will likely fall back again, relative to the other Big Ten schools, based on simple numbers of recruits). But we also need to see some guys go farther, faster than anyone expecting, and more than the surprising guys at other schools.
 
#652      
Second and Chalmers
Tevo said:
This year's recruiting class looks like it's in line to do that, as it should end up in the Top 3 of the Big Ten when all is said and done (though the size of the class this year means that next year's class will likely fall back again, relative to the other Big Ten schools, based on simple numbers of recruits).
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This is why basketball team recruiting rankings are meaningless at best, deceptive at worst, and should be completely ignored in all cases whatsoever.
 
#653      
troym22
On a new note, what's everyone's opinion on where our recruiting class would rank in Illinois history for different scenarios?

If we land Wilkes? If we add Kiir or Kigab, or both? Epperson?

Just curious to see everyone's thoughts!:cool::chief:
 
#654      
aluma
Has there been any word on how Kiir's visit went? It was an incredibly quiet visit.
 
#655      
WesterveltVictoryCigar
troym22 said:
On a new note, what's everyone's opinion on where our recruiting class would rank in Illinois history for different scenarios?

If we land Wilkes? If we add Kiir or Kigab, or both? Epperson?

Just curious to see everyone's thoughts!:cool::chief:
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If we landed Wilkes, then you might have something to discuss as having 2 top 25/30 kids in one class is a rarity for Illinois.

The others mentioned wouldn't move the needle much. Right now we have 1 top 25 guy and a couple right around the top 100 mark. That's a decent class but would rank well below a number of classes just in the last 10-15 years, much less going back through the rest of the modern era.
 
#656      
IlliniOX08
troym22 said:
On a new note, what's everyone's opinion on where our recruiting class would rank in Illinois history for different scenarios?

If we land Wilkes? If we add Kiir or Kigab, or both? Epperson?

Just curious to see everyone's thoughts!:cool::chief:
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With the preface that 1) landing Wilkes looks to be a longshot for UI right now.. and 2) all of these are on paper rankings.. IF it did happen along with Kiir or Epperson it would probably be fair to view it on par with the 2002 class or a little ahead. Of course, if this class were to produce like 80-85% of what the '02 class did we would all take it and probably never think twice.

I think this class would be slightly ahead of a couple of the late 90's/early 00's classes that formed the core of the 2001 team. I don't think, on paper, it would quite live up to some of 80's classes.

So like, probably top 2-3 all time. Again, on paper.
 
#657      
Obelix
Second and Chalmers said:
This is why basketball team recruiting rankings are meaningless at best, deceptive at worst, and should be completely ignored in all cases whatsoever.
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They should not be ignored, but you need to also account for the noise of large classes vs. small by also looking at the rating of specific recruits, and avg. rating of recruits.
 
#658      
Second and Chalmers
Obelix said:
They should not be ignored, but you need to also account for the noise of large classes vs. small by also looking at the rating of specific recruits, and avg. rating of recruits.
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There is no accounting that can draw any signal out of the noise. There's just nothing there.

You could look at a 4-year combined total perhaps, but even that would present a more deceptive picture than looking at the past four years of individual year rankings does in football, for instance.

The alchemy of college basketball roster construction is more subtle and more based on individual players. It also makes for better message board fodder. Lucky us!
 
#659      
Illinithad
aluma said:
Has there been any word on how Kiir's visit went? It was an incredibly quiet visit.
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Usually Derek Piper has an article about it. I'm not an insider so he may have and I'm not aware of it. It's just weird how he was so pumped up coming in and calling out to Illini fans. The talk on the board all weekend was Kris Wilkes though, and not much on Kiir. So I don't know.
 
#660      
Obelix
Second and Chalmers said:
There is no accounting that can draw any signal out of the noise. There's just nothing there.
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Of course there is. If you look at individual rankings, and avg. ranking per recruit you will get a better feel of the class independent of size.
 
#662      
combes
Psycho 86 said:
Marcus Liberty was the # 1 player in the country. Maybe I expected more but I feel he never lived up to that ranking.
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I can see your point. But he only played two years at Illinois. He averaged about 8 ppg coming off the bench behind Kenny Battle and Nick Anderson, two all time greats on the Flying Illini.

In his only year as a starter, he averaged about 17 ppg and 8 rpg.

We might have expected more, but he was pretty darn good. Definitely not most overrated, IMO.

By the way, he was #1 in one rating. Larry Johnson and Dennis Scott were also #1 in other publications.

Far and away my biggest disappointment was juco Rodney Jones. He was supposed to be the best juco player and Nick Anderson said he was a great rebounder. Not only was he a mediocre player, he had a bad attitude. Only UI player I had trouble rooting for.
 
#667      
CAHALL15
aluma said:
Has there been any word on how Kiir's visit went? It was an incredibly quiet visit.
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Sure. He said the visit went well, he really liked the campus, the fans showed him a lot of love, and likes coach Groce.

Side note: you can insert that sentence for any recruit here for an official. Kiir finally did post something on Twitter to that effect, however.
 
#670      
uofi09
IlliniAttorney said:
I'm probably looking at this with orange tinted glasses, but the quotes in here actually give me some thought Wilkes may be leaning our way.

http://www.indystar.com/story/sport...all-star-kris-wilkes-nears-decision/91888416/
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If I read the article correctly, it looks like he will commit and sign in "early November".
If he committed soon after the IU OV, I can understand that IU would be the favorite. If he really does wait to early November to commit, is that an indication of where is going? Do the IU odds lessen the further the commitment date is from the IU OV?
 
#671      
IlliniMed
FiveStar said:
His quotes can certainly be taken to be unfavorable to iu. To be fair, I am always looking to make anything unfavorable to iu.
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Definitely a positive for Illinois and thats all you can hope. For me, it sounds like what the Illinois kids say before committing to a different out of state school. Hope it bodes well!
 
#672      
frozenrope9190
#674      
troym22
uofi09 said:
If I read the article correctly, it looks like he will commit and sign in "early November".
If he committed soon after the IU OV, I can understand that IU would be the favorite. If he really does wait to early November to commit, is that an indication of where is going? Do the IU odds lessen the further the commitment date is from the IU OV?
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No one knows whats really going on in his mind. He's a kid, and making the biggest decision of his life so far. Plus he has added pressure of IU fans begging and hoping that he will stay home. It's possible he really doesn't know; could be that IU doesn't feel right to him but the fear or worry of alienating or letting down his home fans is drawing out the process
 
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