Illini Coaching Staff

[MadSeason]

So to reiterate, it's not that Walker is some horrible unqualified coach. It's that failing to extract value from that resource has a cascading ripple of consequences on everything else.

It's possible that Underwood sees value that you don't in Walker outside Tilmon and Smith. It would be naive to argue that Walker's value wasn't in part tied to Tilmon and Smith but not inconceivable that Underwood valued Walker far beyond that. It's also possible that Underwood didn't value having the "system" guys from Ok St as much as you do.

It is not as if Underwood is some shrinking Violet that would allow Whitman and other influences to force him into a staff he's not comfortable with. I am confident that if Underwood thought Evans was essential, he would be here.

 

[Deleted member 10676]

Not one poster here would pass a polygraph saying that Walker would be on this staff if Tilmon had been released from his LOI before Underwood was hired. Not one, and you all full well know it, so I'm just gonna drop it.



Budgets are budgets. Evans is making well over half the $850K Underwood has to play with, and Walker is most likely making almost all of what would be left.

Sometimes budgets are fluid.

 

[sacraig]

Sometimes budgets are fluid.

By all accounts, budgets are fluid here as well. BU apparently asked for and received a larger budget cap than originally planned and it was reported just before the Antigua news started picking up steam.

 

[jmm]

I think the cruise/Grand Cayman thing was to throw jmm off. They were recruiting period.

Ha All I can tell you is that they flew into Ft Lauderdale and they all got off there. So I'm not sure who they would go see there. Does that help?

That is literally the extent of any minimal insider info I have or will probably ever have so I will just say now that the ride was fun! cool: love this board!

 

[ThreatLevelMidnight]

Ha All I can tell you is that they flew into Ft Lauderdale and they all got off there. So I'm not sure who they would go see there. Does that help?

That is literally the extent of any minimal insider info I have or will probably ever have so I will just say now that the ride was fun! cool: love this board!

Ok so probably going to see Frazier so he can meet the new staff. Wellington HS is right up the road from Ft Lauderdale

 

[HR217]

By all accounts, budgets are fluid here as well. BU apparently asked for and received a larger budget cap than originally planned and it was reported just before the Antigua news started picking up steam.

Apparently that news hadn't made it here yet. We have the largest staff budget in the B1G.

 

[MadSeason]

Not one poster here would pass a polygraph saying that Walker would be on this staff if Tilmon had been released from his LOI before Underwood was hired. Not one, and you all full well know it, so I'm just gonna drop it.Budgets are budgets. Evans is making well over half the $850K Underwood has to play with, and Walker is most likely making almost all of what would be left.

The point remains the same. Even if Walker was kept for Tilmon, Underwood decided Walker + Tilmon > Evans. If Evans was essential to Underwood, he would be here.

 

[sacraig]

Apparently that news hadn't made it here yet. We have the largest staff budget in the B1G.

People just like to willfully ignore information that doesn't fit their narrative.

 

[FatGreg]

Chuck Martin is a name beginning to surface in the twittersphere. Wouldn't be mad at that, though he's a New York/east coast guy primarily. Top recruiter at IU the last few years. Martin as third asst, Stephen Gentry on support staff? Sounds good to me.

 

[HR217]

$850K is the largest budget in the Big Ten, we knew this the day Underwood was hired. If we're going above that, great. But Evans is making $475K at OSU. Not hard to see how you run out of even a huge budget at those prices.

Sorry me actually knowing what I'm talking about doesn't fit your narrative.

Its now higher than 850k.

 

[VictoryIllinois77]

Remember, before Antigua became a reality, there was a lot of skepticism about BU bringing in the right assistants.

He kept Walker which we were all begging him to do, and then went out and got a guy nobody thought we would be capable of getting.

I think so far so good... let's see what else he has up his sleeve. Could be an exciting week ahead.

 

[sacraig]

$850K is the largest budget in the Big Ten, we knew this the day Underwood was hired. If we're going above that, great. But Evans is making $475K at OSU. Not hard to see how you run out of even a huge budget at those prices.

Sorry me actually knowing what I'm talking about doesn't fit your narrative.

Except for the fact that Underwood reportedly asked for an received permission to increase that $850k to $1M just before hiring Antigua. In other words, if Evans was a do or die hire and money was the issue, it seems an awful lot like the budget could have been adjusted within reason to do it, just like it was to land Antigua.

No need to get snippy about it.

 

[HR217]

Chuck Martin is a name beginning to surface in the twittersphere. Wouldn't be mad at that, though he's a New York/east coast guy primarily. Top recruiter at IU the last few years. Martin as third asst, Stephen Gentry on support staff? Sounds good to me.

:thumb:

 

[MadSeason]

He wanted both and thought he was getting both. Then OSU swooped in with an insane offer, after Walker was already signed and sealed.

To say Underwood chose Walker over Evans for one spot is patently false.

That isn't what I'm saying at all. You seem to be contending that they ran out of money for Evans in part at least because of Walker. My point simply is that if Evans was as important to Underwood as you feel he should be , then Underwood would have locked him in as priority #1. That didn't happen. If Evans was that important, we would have beaten OSU's offer. Underwood chose Walker, Antigua (who won't be cheap either) and a yet to be named 3rd assistant.

 

[HR217]

That isn't what I'm saying at all. You seem to be contending that they ran out of money for Evans in part at least because of Walker. My point simply is that if Evans was as important to Underwood as you feel he should be , then Underwood would have locked him in as priority #1. That didn't happen. If Evans was that important, we would have beaten OSU's offer. Underwood chose Walker, Antigua (who won't be cheap either) and a yet to be named 3rd assistant.

Beating Evans offer wasnt really option. He got like 500k I think to be associate head coach. If he was just a regular assistant with a regular assistant salary then maybe we couldve. Ill take our new staff regardless.

 

[MadSeason]

Beating Evans offer wasnt really option. He got like 500k I think to be associate head coach.

If it was a priority to Underwood we certainly could have.

 

[DrCS01]

Chuck Martin is a name beginning to surface in the twittersphere. Wouldn't be mad at that, though he's a New York/east coast guy primarily. Top recruiter at IU the last few years. Martin as third asst, Stephen Gentry on support staff? Sounds good to me.

Don't know much about him, can you provide more info about him? Saw on wiki that he was with Cal at Memphis, coached DRose and some others.

 

[Sal Iacuzzo]

Chuck Martin is rumored to be a candidate for the LIU job.

 

[PlayAZ]

Chuck Martin is rumored to be a candidate for the LIU job.

Bad Head Coach (record wise) Miami of Ohio lineage, and Crean assistant during a couple of years other than Bryant, not so good. Does have some defensive chops however? Meh, next?

 

[FatGreg]

:thumb:

Nice! Excellent staff. We'll be able to recruit with anyone. Should have especially strong ties in St Louis, Florida, Texas, and New York/New Jersey. Looking forward to seeing some unexpected names pop up within a few weeks.

Names that won't surprise me: Carlton Bragg (transfer), Tremont Waters (2017), Moses Brown, Emmit Williams, Jahvon Quinerly (all 2018).

 

[WesterveltVictoryCigar]

Let me try and clarify what I'm saying.

I agree that if we had perceived Lamont Evans as the Matt Campbell to Underwood's Beckman, the totally irreplaceable lynchpin between success and failure, money existed to make that hire happen, and it didn't happen because at a certain point in the bidding, other alternatives became a more sensible use of that money to Whitman and Underwood.

My frustration is that it appears that the alternative chosen has been "recruit our way out of it and figure out the coaching side when we get there". I believed that was doomed to failure before Tilmon decommitted, and it is even moreso now.

Jeremiah Tilmon will not be an Illini. Mark Smith will not be an Illini. Ayo Dosunmu will not be an Illini. Mayan Kiir will not be an Illini. No uncommitted 2017 5-star will be an Illini. Sadly, it will take over a year and buckets of credibility for these existing truths to become established realities.

We have decided to tilt at windmills yet again. We will fail spectacularly. Brad Underwood's future in this job will be determined by how quickly he realizes the futility of desperate begging for 5-stars, and how well he adjusts. He is a far more capable coach than his two predecessors, with far more raw coaching horsepower, but he can't do it alone.

Time off didn't help, eh?

 

[mattcoldagelli]

Martin as third asst, Stephen Gentry on support staff? Sounds good to me.

 

[sacraig]

My frustration is that it appears that the alternative chosen has been "recruit our way out of it and figure out the coaching side when we get there". I believed that was doomed to failure before Tilmon decommitted, and it is even moreso now.

That's not what we appear to be doing, though. That is what Mizzou appears to be doing. We appear to be taking the opposite approach. We hired Underwood, who had success without Evans previously and who is known more for his coaching than his recruiting. He is now filling his assistant staff with recruiters so far.

Mizzou is taking the approach you seem to be fearing, where they hired a guy known for recruiting who is filling his staff with recruiters and recruits' parents and figures he can sort the coaching out later.

Those are two different approaches. Tilmon or no Tilmon, I am willing to bet our approach works a lot better in the long run.

Jeremiah Tilmon will not be an Illini. Mark Smith will not be an Illini. Ayo Dosunmu will not be an Illini. Mayan Kiir will not be an Illini. No uncommitted 2017 5-star will be an Illini. Sadly, it will take over a year and buckets of credibility for these existing truths to become established realities.

Holy crap, dude. Put down the bottle of Jack and take a time out.

 

[Sal Iacuzzo]

You'd have to be nuts to hire him after his Marist tenure.

(As a head coach I mean)

A lot easier to win at LIU than Marist.

 

[sacraig]

No question.

The only difference being, they're doing it successfully, and in the case of the Porter thing, making guaranteed moves rather than speculative moves.

They'll be very good next year (which means more for them than it would have for us, for a number of reasons). They'll get worse from there. I'm not scared of them long-term. That's the wrong way to build it.

I wouldn't call what they are doing a success until they have a Final Four under their belt from it.