All I really want is for our team to be able to pass and rebound again.
Wanna win
All I really want is for our team to be able to pass and rebound again.
Wanna win
Yeah we actually had a decent ppg under Groce. We just had a terrible ppg on the defensive side of things under Groce.
How do you feel about immoral victories?
Yup, Groce teams were just flat out ridiculous on defense. The '015-'016 team was one of the worst in the last 40+ years. A lot of the bad defense was just poor individual effort. The kind of things that get coach's fired.
How do you feel about immoral victories?
Yup, Groce teams were just flat out ridiculous on defense. The '015-'016 team was one of the worst in the last 40+ years. A lot of the bad defense was just poor individual effort. The kind of things that get coach's fired.
I always thought if we kept Weber's D and Groce's O, we could've had very good teams. One reason we played as well as we did in the 12-13 season was cause the players had the defensive fundamentals from Weber and the offensive sets from Groce. Also change tends to ignite effort. That team did have a lot of good/great players.
Groce's offense? His Offense is only unwatchable if he has a point guard who can single-handedly destroy the opponent on pick and roll. Other than that one weapon, his team has no other ways of efficient scoring.
The quality of screening and off the ball movement from Groce's team is atrocious. How often could you see a cut and dunk from Groce's team? How often could you see a unguarded 3 point shots from our shooters off the screen (Hill, Nunn, Cosby, Starks, JCL, Betrand are all capable shooters)?
His offense system is basically 4 guards passing the ball around perimeter and then someone throws a bad shot or forces a hero ball. On the other end, the 4 guards loses all the rebounds and gives the lane like christmas gifts to the opponents.
We were at that game at Rutgers and were dying in the stands because the team, for whatever reason, wouldn't play offense. I'll admit I'm not a basketball tactician, but I do know you don't try to sit out a two point lead for a minute or whatever it was. We were dying. :frustrated:I agree, why is Groce suddenly getting praised for his offensive sets? He was getting murdered on here for them during the season.
At least OSU scoring in 15-16 was fairly consistent. 10 games over 80 and 10 games under 60 goes to show how eratic we were last year. But if we were hot shooting 3p, we could compete with anyone. Looking fwd to more consistent offense under BU.Just wanted to point out, we averaged what 70.something ppg last year with Groce's offense? Just looked up Ok. St. games last year and their low on the season was 57 against Baylor, and scored 67+ points every other game, hit the 90 point mark 14 times (7 times vs. Power-5 schools+Wichita St),and the century mark 6 times with 3 other games over 97 points.
Groce's squad scored 80+ 10 times, only twice in conference, and failed to score 60 points in 10 games. Only time we hit 100+ was against a division 2 school. Plus we only had 1 game in the 90's. Not to mention only scoring 43 points against Wisconsin.
If we score on average anything less than 80 ppg this year I'll be shocked, we are going to be just as talented as the team Underwood adopted last season in a league that won't be able to run with us like the West Virginia's/Arkansas/Kansas/Iowa St's of the B12.
and just for reference Ok St in the 2015-16 season scored 80+ 4 times, and failed to score 60 7 times!
I agree, why is Groce suddenly getting praised for his offensive sets? He was getting murdered on here for them during the season.
Our offense was incredibly brutal to watch until TJL magically came in and saved the day.
You can say if he had a better PG things may have been different, but he never got one to fit his system, but at the end of the day, the good offense we saw at the end of the season was just too little too late
. But if we were hot shooting 3p, we could compete with anyone. Looking fwd to more consistent offense under BU.
Meh, I'm not impressed with Groce, period. He didn't have much of a resume when he was hired here, other than DJ Cooper, and he had PLENTY of time to show he could coach. Nice guy, yes. Great talker, yes Great recruiter, yes (although you could debate that I suppose, based on his inability to land a PG).
Could he coach his roster and succeed as a coach? Nope. One good season out of five doesn't cut it here. Maybe his recruiting ability can overcome some of his short-comings at a lower level, but I can't imagine he's gonna fix his inability to coach to a great extent.
I'll bet one beach chair that he's not able to repeat as HC what he did at Ohio (2 outta first 4 seasons going to the dance). And I'd bet another that he won't get another 29 win season by year 4.
No one praised his sets. We said his teams' offensive ppg stats weren't atrocious. That's not really high praise.
I'd be willing to bet a really nice set of beach chairs (but not the house) that he'll learn from the mistakes and craft a nice little spark plug of a program at Akron.
Alaska...dont understand last paragraph?You may be right. Lou had better talent and about the same record his first five years. Was a very poor in-game coach during that time - I can remember the consternation over his substitution timing similar to what drove people on here crazy with Groce. But he learned, adapted, and now has his name on the court.
Since it was a maybe, Whitman made a very understandable decision. Had we not been able to steal Underwood and ended up with Cuonzo, I don't know how confident I would be that Illinois basketball would be better off in five years than we would have been had we retained Groce.
Under the prior AD leadership, firing Groce would have been a far larger gamble and maybe not the right decision. Whitman's competence has changed that calculus.