I feel like Hartline having a decent NFL career is worth more than Sheelhause being an assistant to an assistant for one more year
The Illinois Football Coaching Search
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I think that’s what I was agreeing to? Unless I read the original comment wrong. Both are ridiculous at this stage in their careers.
I like what Clawson has done there. However, 14th ranked class in the ACC this year. Not a good sign with that many years of being there and being fairly successful.
I still like Leipold a lot. Reminds me of Jerry Kill with the staff loyalty. That’s huge.
Let’s just be real here. We all love Nate but if you think he brings more to the table than Hartline, I’ve got nothing for you.
I’m not saying Hartline is a home run hire, but his upside is more than anyone we’re legitimately considering.
Clausen has been held back at Wake for 2 reasons:
1. Small private Baptist college in the middle of the bible belt that is very fond of telling people about their standards, both academic and uppitiness. This has significantly limited his recruiting pool there, but he nevertheless has recruited & DEVELOPED incredibly for his system.
2. COVID/opt-outs/Transfers – That offense this year was going to be NASTYYYYYYYY (and I hate Wake, trust me). But when you have Jaimie Newman transfer to Georgia before opting out, all-world WR Sage Surratt opt (bc NFL...), and their best RB opt out midway through the season, it is going to be rough.
Honestly speaking, getting a coach like Clawson would be a huge coup for JW & the Illini, you would just need to give him 3-4 yrs of time. His extended meshpoint would dive defenses nuts.
Perhaps Hartline knows that to be a candidate for HC at OSU down the road someday, he's got to go get HC experience elsewhere first. From his perspective, maybe grab a spot now, and get started.
I hadn't thought of Hartline, but I think it's a great name to have in the mix.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
A couple thoughts
- I have two words for any Illini fans pining for a young Ohio State assistant whose amazing recruiting exploits have brought him national renown: John. Groce.
- Neither Nate Scheelhaase nor Aaron Moorehead is the best qualified ex-Illini player for the job. That would have to be George McDonald-Ashford (now just George McDonald) who was a WR/KR spanning Tepper and Turner (and Whitman teammate) who is now the Assistant Head Coach/Co-OC at NC State, regarded as an excellent recruiter and program guy for the kind of project we should aspire to. We can do better and I wouldn't like the hire, but he bleeds the same orange Scheelhaase and Moorehead do, with a stronger resume.
- I cannot wrap my head around someone watching a Kent State game and an Army game and coming to the conclusion that it's Jeff Monken rather than Sean Lewis who runs a system that wouldn't work in the Big Ten.
- Jim Leonhard reminds me a lot of Tom Herman when he was Ohio State's OC. His intelligence really comes across.
- Two coordinators whose names I am surprised I have not heard are Alex Grinch, DC, Oklahoma and Graham Harrell, OC, USC. Both will be HC's somewhere soon.
- People are starting to wake up that Marcus Freeman might very well be a better candidate than Luke Fickell (inevitably minus Freeman), aren't they?
- Fun Fact: Josh Whitman's first ever football game as an AD was a 24-0 shutout of his UW-La Crosse by Lance Leipold's UW-Whitewater juggernaut.
- I have two words for any Illini fans pining for a young Ohio State assistant whose amazing recruiting exploits have brought him national renown: John. Groce.
- Neither Nate Scheelhaase nor Aaron Moorehead is the best qualified ex-Illini player for the job. That would have to be George McDonald-Ashford (now just George McDonald) who was a WR/KR spanning Tepper and Turner (and Whitman teammate) who is now the Assistant Head Coach/Co-OC at NC State, regarded as an excellent recruiter and program guy for the kind of project we should aspire to. We can do better and I wouldn't like the hire, but he bleeds the same orange Scheelhaase and Moorehead do, with a stronger resume.
- I cannot wrap my head around someone watching a Kent State game and an Army game and coming to the conclusion that it's Jeff Monken rather than Sean Lewis who runs a system that wouldn't work in the Big Ten.
- Jim Leonhard reminds me a lot of Tom Herman when he was Ohio State's OC. His intelligence really comes across.
- Two coordinators whose names I am surprised I have not heard are Alex Grinch, DC, Oklahoma and Graham Harrell, OC, USC. Both will be HC's somewhere soon.
- People are starting to wake up that Marcus Freeman might very well be a better candidate than Luke Fickell (inevitably minus Freeman), aren't they?
- Fun Fact: Josh Whitman's first ever football game as an AD was a 24-0 shutout of his UW-La Crosse by Lance Leipold's UW-Whitewater juggernaut.
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mhuml32
- Cincinnati, OH
This "upside" argument is comical. Let's just hire an 8-year old because their upside blows everyone else out of the water. Inexperience isn't upside. The dude has a handful of years as a WR coach. He's recruiting at a place that takes minimal skills. The top recruiter title on 247 and the ilk is really just a "this coach is young and has very little to no play-calling or weekly game planning responsibilities because we put them on the road and glue a phone to their ear 24/7".
Going back to 2012 when Illinois hired Beckman, we hired a guy a lot like Hartline to be co-OC. Billy Gonzales was a great recruiter from Florida. He was young and also was their WR coach; followed Urban through a number of his stops. Illinois had to offer him the co-OC title and a serious pay bump for him to be willing to give up his cushy WR coach job at UF. Gonzales was a massive failure at Illinois and was gone after one year. Gonzales was easily more experienced than Hartline (more years coaching + successful at numerous programs) but he also didn't have experience calling plays and only proved to be a big-time recruiter at a big-time program. Hartline is qualified for a promotion at OSU (if someone leaves) or a program of a lower stature. Nothing more.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
As the Lovie era taught us harshly.
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Someone explain the Marcus Freeman > Luke Fickell thing to me. Both are defensive guys. Big ten players and coaches. Fickell was dc at osu. Freeman lb coach at Purdue. I have a hard time thinking Freeman is pulling the strings at cincy.
mhuml32
- Cincinnati, OH
He isn't my first choice but Chuck Martin would be higher on my list than a decent chunk of the names that have been mentioned in this thread. He hasn't quite crested at Miami (OH) but he took a program that was performing poorly and turned the corner to being a consistent MAC contender.
mhuml32
- Cincinnati, OH
A couple things, in order of importance:
(1) Fickell isn't going to be interested in our job opening. Freeman would be.
(2) A lot of folks in the coaching profession have hinted at Freeman might be the actual gem at UC. His defenses have been solid at UC. There were concerns from MSU folks on whether Freeman would follow Fickell to EL (didn't matter, Fickell turned them down). Similar to the concerns about Beckman/Campbell.
Has Martin turned the corner?
Let's be real, no one will give him 5 years to go 6-6...
mhuml32
- Cincinnati, OH
The turning of the corner was going from 2/3 win team to 6-8 win team. But like I said, he hasn't crested to reach that 8-10 win program that gets him a shot at a B1G head job (and the clock is working against him, people do not like waiting for success in the rat race of P5 head coaching jobs). Also hurts him that things were looking good for this year but, alas.
TMC999
- Not Iowa
Really interesting angle. This fits the bill of a Whitman hire. A reasonable, calculated risk. Color me intrigued.
@mhuml32 I agree it is a good turn around, but you have to also consider how long it took him to make a 4 game turnaround.
Someone brought up Doeren at NCSU a while ago. He inherited a terrible situation from Tom O'Brien in 2013 (to the point of having to use a WR as QB) and went +5 in the win column the next year. I know Miami (OH) doesnt have P5 resources, but 5 years is a long time for .500 record.
Someone brought up Doeren at NCSU a while ago. He inherited a terrible situation from Tom O'Brien in 2013 (to the point of having to use a WR as QB) and went +5 in the win column the next year. I know Miami (OH) doesnt have P5 resources, but 5 years is a long time for .500 record.
Ubermensch
BOOM! Feed my ego.
Conference record is all that matters with those mid-major coaches. Martin is 24-11 since the rough start of 4-12 his first two seasons.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
And unlike Beckman/Campbell where it came as a genuine surprise that a then-32 year old Campbell got the head job, everybody knows Freeman is Fickell's successor at UC, unless he wants a seven-figure DC job elsewhere in college or the NFL. So you know you're getting Fickell minus Freeman, and Freeman's defenses have been what makes those teams so special.
In fairness to Fickell, he hired Freeman, and has in general constructed and maintained Big Ten-level staffing at an AAC school. That's impressive.
Why not someone who has won and learned from the best? Was an assistant coach at Alabama from 2013--17. Also assist coach and offensive coordinator at both Clemson and ASU. Was a winning head coach and Sun Belt conference head coachh of the year in 2019 and possibly this year and his teams score points. I loved Mike White at Illinois and i want someone that learned from the best like he did and puts points on the board and people in the stands.
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mhuml32
- Cincinnati, OH
Completely agree.
Agreed. Hartline played 7 years in the league and broke 1000 yards twice. We are not talking about a journeyman. That’s a lot of cred compared with Scheelhaase. Don’t get me wrong, I love Scheelhaase and hope to see him in the orange and blue again, but I think Hartline has the bona fides between the two.
TMC999
- Not Iowa
Assuming an “oh my gosh package” for the Campbells and Fickells falls through, this is the kind of profile we’ll be looking at. Lots of upside but some noticeable holes in the resume. We are still Illinois. It’s just the reality... short of giving someone $10M/yr. Which we won’t.
TMC999
- Not Iowa
I’d love him on staff... but objectively speaking, while I think he can do it, being an OC is a pretty big step up. Come play that OC role in Champaign.
Clausen would be something.
Doeren would be amazing.
Doeren has a lot of ties back to IL in general, and I believe he'd be a great fit here. He's the kind of unexpected candidate I expect JW will try to go for. Proven winner, splashy stealing him away from another P5, and likely he'd end his career at IL too if he wanted. I think he's probably at the top of my realistic wishlist. (Since Campbell won't consider us due to Lasagna and Fickell is too wishy washy).
Hartline is interesting, but I agree with previous posters, too much risk. He's never called plays. I really want to see experience in the OC/DC roles, and fill up the assistants with half recruiters and half teachers.
Doeren would be amazing.
Doeren has a lot of ties back to IL in general, and I believe he'd be a great fit here. He's the kind of unexpected candidate I expect JW will try to go for. Proven winner, splashy stealing him away from another P5, and likely he'd end his career at IL too if he wanted. I think he's probably at the top of my realistic wishlist. (Since Campbell won't consider us due to Lasagna and Fickell is too wishy washy).
Hartline is interesting, but I agree with previous posters, too much risk. He's never called plays. I really want to see experience in the OC/DC roles, and fill up the assistants with half recruiters and half teachers.
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