Take this with a grain of salt, but...
View attachment 12125
Take this with a grain of salt, but...
View attachment 12125
Harris?I was just looking at these and for those interested in the recruits we are heavily in on here are their updated ranks:
36) Whitmore
47) Shutt
57) Casey
82) Corhen
91) Oweh
96) Epps
Just for fun:
97) Storr
I don't put much weight into anything ESPN produces anymore though, so take it how you will.
I'm not sweating anything. Just honestly curious as to why. Could be there is an entirely idiotic reason his ranking dropped. I'm just curious as to what that reasoning is. I trust our staff and think if they like Epps he'll be great. Just also a believer in hearing opinions from the other side has value, even if you ultimately don't agree with them. Sorry I asked!Why are you guys sweating Epps dropping. You think that these services are better at talent evaluation than Bill Self?
As someone who...I'm not sweating anything. Just honestly curious as to why. Could be there is an entirely idiotic reason his ranking dropped. I'm just curious as to what that reasoning is. I trust our staff and think if they like Epps he'll be great. Just also a believer in hearing opinions from the other side has value, even if you ultimately don't agree with them. Sorry I asked!
This might be true. I don't know. But I will note that people on here have been saying Schutt is criminally underrated in the rankings for a while. Well, ESPN now has him at 47, Rivals at 82, and 247 at 108. So who is right in that instance?Did Epps tear it up, by and large, in AAU ball against VG or elite competition? Yes
Was his play consistent (no tail off)? Yes
Is there any evidence of faltering? Nope
ESPN's ratings have been a clown car show for a long time. Evidently, Rivals is tracking them down.
Diid Schutt all of a sudden become markedly better or did the services materially underrate him?This might be true. I don't know. But I will note that people on here have been saying Schutt is criminally underrated in the rankings for a while. Well, ESPN now has him at 47, Rivals at 82, and 247 at 108. So who is right in that instance?
I'm all for discounting ESPN and Rivals' recent changes to Epps' rankings, was just curious as to whether anyone had any insight as to where they were coming from. I highly doubt the scouts employed by either outlet are trying to intentionally ruffle feathers, or have an anti-Illini bias (as convenient as excuse as that would be). So if we accept the conceit that they are wrong, what exactly are they wrong about? What are they missing? I don't think these are ridiculous questions to try and understand. In fact, if you could understand the disconnect, to the extent one exists, between what a ranking service values and what actually matters, I think you'd have a major advantage in hitting on undervalued talent. This is essentially the point behind Moneyball - figuring out why certain players were undervalued and exploiting that.
TLDR; if you believe that Epps is undervalued by ESPN and Rivals, there is value in understanding why they came to the (wrong) conclusions they came to, and just dismissing them as "bad" misses that point.
Yes....Please!Thought the Traore ship had sailed, but evidently not:
FWIW, I love this kid. NBA potential, no doubt.
I love the inclusion of Big Tim and Rees Woodcock. (For the record, the former is far worse than the latter.)I only care about what BU and co think. They have far more on the line than we do. We'll be fine. Deep breaths y'all.
Chester’s done everything he could in this one. Not sure it’ll be enough, but he is a beast on the recruiting trail. Value the time we have with him!
He's just asking a question: why the drop in ranking? The answer 'ESPN's evaluators are crap' does not answer the why. The point is to understand what those evaluators might be seeing (or not seeing) that is causing him to drop in their mind, not to determine whether that drop is warranted.Diid Schutt all of a sudden become markedly better or did the services materially underrate him?
You are assigning far more value to the rating services than they deserve. These are subjective, and only as good as the raters doing the evaluating.
No you missed my point there. A lot of the same people that think Schutt has been underrated also think ESPN is bad at rating prospects. But ESPN has Schutt ranked way higher, and closer to the consensus on this board, than 247.Diid Schutt all of a sudden become markedly better or did the services materially underrate him?
You are assigning far more value to the rating services than they deserve. These are subjective, and only as good as the raters doing the evaluating.
I mean, while not answering it the way YOU wanted it answered, crappy evaluators does answer the question of why. It doesn’t answer why the crappy evaluators dropped him, but I think the implication there is that there is nothing of concern, just people making rankings on a bit of a whim and the rotating news and highlights. I’m sure most of these rankers are not steadfastly watching 150+ players of game tape.He's just asking a question: why the drop in ranking? The answer 'ESPN's evaluators are crap' does not answer the why. The point is to understand what those evaluators might be seeing (or not seeing) that is causing him to drop in their mind, not to determine whether that drop is warranted.
This. I think if you cornered these evaluators and had them explain what gives (w/Epps' rating) they'd give nonsensical answers. Only rational thing I can come up with is he's getting dinged because they don't think he's really a PG and he's relatively short. It certainly isn't based on his play.I mean, while not answering it the way YOU wanted it answered, crappy evaluators does answer the question of why. It doesn’t answer why the crappy evaluators dropped him, but I think the implication there is that there is nothing of concern, just people making rankings on a bit of a whim and the rotating news and highlights. I’m sure most of these rankers are not steadfastly watching 150+ players of game tape.
Diid Schutt all of a sudden become markedly better or did the services materially underrate him?
You are assigning far more value to the rating services than they deserve. These are subjective, and only as good as the raters doing the evaluating.
And all these ratings are moot as soon as they start their college careers.Probably less subjective than message board fans' ratings of their own recruits however.
And yet 4 of our top 6 players in terms of minutes and production last year were top 50 recruitsAnd all these ratings are moot as soon as they start their college careers.
Sorry guys...I want to get back to important stuff...like who is taller in the picture with Coleman and Payne.And yet 4 of our top 6 players in terms of minutes and production last year were top 50 recruits
Crappy evaluators does not answer why said supposedly crappy evaluators dropped Epps in ranking. That is a statement of the relative value that ranking -- any ranking by that evaluator, really -- provides in assessing the actual ability of a given player on the court, but the OP's original question was not "is this drop meaningful" but rather "what might be causing them to drop him?" Now, if the answer to why Epps dropped in ranking is b/c evaluator A picks numbers out of a hat, then that answers the original question and might also help us decide that evaluator A is crappy.I mean, while not answering it the way YOU wanted it answered, crappy evaluators does answer the question of why. It doesn’t answer why the crappy evaluators dropped him, but I think the implication there is that there is nothing of concern, just people making rankings on a bit of a whim and the rotating news and highlights. I’m sure most of these rankers are not steadfastly watching 150+ players of game tape.