IlliniKat91
- Chicago, IL
Dain wasn't playing bully ball though. He was tentative and dribbling too much, which led to turnovers. He was sat to try to OSU from getting easy points off those.
Ohio State 72, Illinois 60 Postgame
- Status
We have remained a collection of individuals rather than a team.
I'm not sure this is anyone's fault players or coaches
With the transfer portal, and players leaving early to pursue professional careers, the coaches try to put assemble a group with the most taleent they can.
It is perhaps not surprising that when you have a collection of players, most of whom,him anin an people know him him who have not played together for an extended period of time, that they will remain the collection of individuals rather than a team.
Could a skilled point guard helped toovercome this situation, perhaps.
The Sprouting Divot
Invisible and Bulletproof
- Miracle Mile
We haven't won six games in a row all season.
Anyone who thinks that we'll do it for the first time in March and April lacks common sense.
Anyone who thinks that we'll do it for the first time in March and April lacks common sense.
I agree, playing him too long in the first half led to turnovers and poor offensive sets. We got onto a hole early and gave them confidence. When they are bringing the double he needs to attack immediately, or pass it back out. There were times he wasn't doubled and dribbled until the double came and turned over the ball.
ChampaignLou
- Chicago
Brad Underwood teams are historically not good in the morning. It's pretty significant.
I wasn't confident seeing the last 2 NCAA tourney schedules (both Loyola and Houston had start times of 11:10 am).
I'd rather a lower seed and an afternoon slot.
I wasn't confident seeing the last 2 NCAA tourney schedules (both Loyola and Houston had start times of 11:10 am).
I'd rather a lower seed and an afternoon slot.
Maybe this isn’t the right place for this question that I’ve asked before. But why did Underwood’s teams win at SFA? Were his teams in better condition and wore down the opponents? Did he have talent advantage because he had a high major player or two that were playing at that level for some reason? (Think Rolan Roberts at SIU with Bruce Weber.) Was it his spread offense or some other X and O’s thing that was hard to beat.
danielb927
Orange Krush Class of 2013
- Rochester, MN
Thanks for digging up those stats, that's really interesting. Any way to dig up the opponents and/or their average ranking for each "bucket"? I can imagine early tips are more likely "marquee" B1G matchups or tournament games, which could be a contributing factor. I'm pretty sure we've never played a cupcake in the morning.
I feel like we've never played well at noon or before, even pre-Underwood...
The Sprouting Divot
Invisible and Bulletproof
- Miracle Mile
Well, yesterday we had a morning tip against a team that hadn't won a game in something like 56 days.
ChampaignLou
- Chicago
| Time | Type | Opponent | Conf | |
| 1:00p | REG | N | Missouri | SEC |
| 1:00p | REG | @ | Iowa (18) | Big Ten |
| 1:00p | REG | Ohio | MAC | |
| 1:00p | REG | @ | Rutgers (19) | Big Ten |
| 1:00p | REG | Saint Francis (PA) | NEC | |
| 1:15p | NCAA | N | Drexel | CAA |
| 1:30p | REG | Wisconsin (14) | Big Ten | |
| 11:30a | CTOURN | N | Indiana | Big Ten |
| 12:00p | REG | Rutgers | Big Ten | |
| 12:00p | REG | @ | Michigan | Big Ten |
| 12:00p | REG | Chicago State | WAC | |
| 12:00p | REG | Ohio State (21) | Big Ten | |
| 12:00p | REG | Purdue (4) | Big Ten | |
| 12:00p | REG | @ | Indiana | Big Ten |
| 12:00p | REG | @ | Michigan State (19) | Big Ten |
| 12:00p | REG | Penn State | Big Ten | |
| 12:00p | REG | @ | Indiana (14) | Big Ten |
| 12:00p | REG | @ | Ohio State | Big Ten |
| 12:10p | NCAA | N | Loyola (IL) (17) | MVC |
| 12:10p | NCAA | N | Houston (15) | AAC |
Plenty of B10 games. The afternoon games looked like more Premier matchups.
ChampaignLou
- Chicago
Here is a breakdown of ranked opponents.
Still mirrors the win percentage. I'm using the NCAA reference site.
Still mirrors the win percentage. I'm using the NCAA reference site.
| Day | Ranked | W | L | Pct |
| 1 - Morning | Y | 2 | 6 | 0.250 |
| 2 - Afternoon | Y | 5 | 3 | 0.625 |
| 3 - Evening | Y | 12 | 8 | 0.600 |
Illinois has played 29 games this year. And poor shot selection from behind the arc is still a hot topic.
Wonder if a champ has ever done this. UConn is my best guess.
I think we were always a dark horse candidate at best this season. Frankly we had a lot go against us. Not saying we shouldn’t have been better given the circumstances but this OSU game just buts an underlining on the whole “we can beat anybody and lose to anybody on any given day” tagline that has become more of a motto at this point.
Mayer aside, I think most of the guys have become way better (and I’m mostly talking about Hawkins).
I think the real issue is we just aren’t a good 3 pt shooting team. It’s really that simple.
We have laid 6 turds this year, both losses to PSU (esp the blow-out at home, both double digits), Mizzou, IU (1st game blow out), NW (double digit loss), and now OSU. I cannot remember a season when we had so many games that we simply didn't show up to play.
Fair point, but Coach Underwood adressed the issue head on in his after game press conference yesterday.
And it's not just those games, but also the halves, or more, in other games. The 3 most exciting wins, Texas UCLA and NW, were all games in which they were awful for a large portion of the game but then caught fire from 3 in the 2nd half.
There is a lot more to it than that. We had 8 assists yesterday, and unfortunately that's not an unusual stat. We can't make FT's. We commit too many turnovers. And we have a disturbing tendency to not figure out how to shut down the other team's hot hand.
Hawkins, Shannon and Mayer are all NBA prospects - we have legit Sweet 16 talent on this team and at this point we are lucky to be in consideration to make the tournament.
illiniswish09
- Northwest Suburbs
FWIW, and I know no one wants to hear this but I'm going to say it anyways... Ohio State is WAY better than their record indicates... They could go on a run here to close out the season... We may have just given them some life. Not justifying that performance yesterday whatsoever but could see them knocking off Maryland now. Probably lose in East Lansing but they have the capability to do damage in BTT.
Regarding 3-pt shooting, the splits aren't terribly skewed in wins and losses:
Wins: 157-487 (.322)
Losses: 70-245 (.286)
We actually average more 3-pt attempts in wins (25.6 / gm) than we do in losses (24.5 / gm).
We've been able to overcome poor shot selection* in many games with defense. However, when that defense isn't there we are unable to overcome the poor shot selection* we tend to lose by double digits (and its odd that sometimes we look great defensively, and other times look totally lost... that is all effort and focus).
*I'm using the term shot selection and not shooting for a reason. I think these guys are mostly all passable shooters, but they take too many bad shots.
This team has other very glaring deficiencies:
FT% (11th in conf)
Assists (10th in conf)
Turnovers (last in conf)
Personal Fouls (next to last in conf)
All in all, the 3-pt shooting is one thing but I think the reason we lose games is when we are off on the defensive side. Which, for this group, is far too often. The athleticism, length and overall talent level on defense should have rendered better results this year imo. We've only won one game all season when our opponent scored more than 70 points. That being UCLA who scored exactly 70 and we needed a huge comeback and like 9 threes from our best scorer to do it. You look at the PSU games, IU at home, Missouri game, Iowa game, and even OSU yesterday shot 54% for the game. I feel like we'd have 24, 25 wins if these guys just brought effort and focus every game.
I'm still hopeful for some positive regression with these guys' focus, effort level and readiness to play. But after nearly 30 games, I feel this is the team we have. I'm still gonna throw on my Illini gear every game day and root these guys on, but a lot of games have been downright frustrating and hard to watch. Even ones in which we have come out on top.
Wins: 157-487 (.322)
Losses: 70-245 (.286)
We actually average more 3-pt attempts in wins (25.6 / gm) than we do in losses (24.5 / gm).
We've been able to overcome poor shot selection* in many games with defense. However, when that defense isn't there we are unable to overcome the poor shot selection* we tend to lose by double digits (and its odd that sometimes we look great defensively, and other times look totally lost... that is all effort and focus).
*I'm using the term shot selection and not shooting for a reason. I think these guys are mostly all passable shooters, but they take too many bad shots.
This team has other very glaring deficiencies:
FT% (11th in conf)
Assists (10th in conf)
Turnovers (last in conf)
Personal Fouls (next to last in conf)
All in all, the 3-pt shooting is one thing but I think the reason we lose games is when we are off on the defensive side. Which, for this group, is far too often. The athleticism, length and overall talent level on defense should have rendered better results this year imo. We've only won one game all season when our opponent scored more than 70 points. That being UCLA who scored exactly 70 and we needed a huge comeback and like 9 threes from our best scorer to do it. You look at the PSU games, IU at home, Missouri game, Iowa game, and even OSU yesterday shot 54% for the game. I feel like we'd have 24, 25 wins if these guys just brought effort and focus every game.
I'm still hopeful for some positive regression with these guys' focus, effort level and readiness to play. But after nearly 30 games, I feel this is the team we have. I'm still gonna throw on my Illini gear every game day and root these guys on, but a lot of games have been downright frustrating and hard to watch. Even ones in which we have come out on top.
In fairness to Brad, it could of been reasonably assumed that Sky would be a competent point guard, when he did not pan out that left a pretty significant void.
With the inabilitty tto stop dribble drive penetration in numerous games it's not surprising that opponents often shot for a high percentage
The statistics you posted are pretty eye-opening and telling.
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Season -12.49 assists/game
L Ohio State - 8
W Northwestern -6
W Minnesota - 8
L Indiana - 9
L Penn State - 13 (head scratcher)
W Rutgers - 8
L Iowa - 12
W Nebraska - 14
W Wisconsin - 7
W Ohio state - 12
L Indiana - 7
(Great ball movement Minnesota through Wisconsin)
W Minnesota - 17
W Michigan state - 11
W Nebraska - 15
W Wisconsin - 14
L Northwestern - 13 (7 by TSJ)
First of all small sample size, second of all early morning games are skewed towards matchups against better teams.
This is a great point that has gotten overshadowed by the three point shooting discussion. Don't get me wrong, we shoot too many threes for a poor shooting team. But when we easily beat OSU back in January we actually shot slightly worse from three (5-28 vs 6-29 yesterday) and still won comfortably 69-60. But the defense was much better in that game so it didn't matter.
I think the defense in the second half was good enough yesterday, but the first half lapses gave them enough cushion to withstand our run.
The offense is more of a concern for sure because the defense has been solid more often than not, but when the defense doesn't show up we basically have no chance. 10-0 in the Big Ten when allowing fewer than 70 but 0-8 when allowing 70 or more. And only the @Iowa, @IU and @Maryland losses have been close in games we allowed more than 70 so when we allow that many points, we usually struggle to keep up offensively too.
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