Many of Dee's shots were layups which is why he was known as "a one-man fast break". Layups really help the shooting percentage though he did become a better outside shooter his Junior and Senior years.
Illinois 88, Ohio State 80 Postgame
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Huh?
Dee was a 33% shooter on 5 attempts per game his freshman year. 35% on 6 attempts his soph year. 43% on 6 his junior year. And 32% on 7 attempts his senior year.
His freshman year he shot 17 more twos than threes. Every season after that he shot more threes than twos.
Dee was awesome.
I've said before but it's weird how some fans have retconned his time here, turning him into this like gimmicky second fiddle to Deron. There is an argument to be made that Dee was the best all around college player on that team despite not having the size to stick around in the NBA.
RabidDawgClassic
- Los Angeles, CA
This has probably also been mentioned in the past, but KJ tied Demetri McCamey's record last year for most turnovers in a season. Not necessarily great but not terrible considering his company:
View attachment 45622
Here's a link to other single season record holders. It's crazy how many records TSJ took in 2023-2024:
Illinois Men's Basketball Leaders & Records - Season | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com
Illinois Men's Basketball Leaders & Records - Seasonwww.sports-reference.com
This is probably an oversimplification, but Wagler seems to combine the best qualities of KJ and Riley without their worst. KJ was a pure, gifted point guard who seemed to play at a speed ahead of his teammates. That however led to a lot of turnovers, most mind numbingly when he was just dribbling the ball with a defender closely guarding him. Wagler isn’t quite as pure as KJ, but he’s not far off… and he seems to value each possession like it’s gold.
Riley was a gifted scorer with smooth moves to the basket. But he often played with an emotional immaturity that saw him disappear from the game for long stretches. That’s not uncommon with freshmen, even the five star type. Wagler has similar moves but always seems to have his head in the game, even when it’s not “his night.” That’s exemplified by the fact that Brad felt comfortable playing him 39 minutes last night. In fact, I don’t recall a moment this year where Brad’s given Wagler the quick hook.
Both of you guys made good posts and statements, IMO. Because of Dee's speed and ability to get steals and get to the rim, he got a lot of layups. Yes, he shot a lot of 3s also, but its kind of like modern basketball...3s and layups. I think your response took the OPs post as a dig at Dee maybe, but I doubt that was the intent.
Edit: I haven't looked at his shot chart, and if he shot a lot of midrange shots...then I'm wrong lol
Did you look at the foul/foul shooting differential? That decided the game. I'm sure OSU is viewing this as the refs costed them the game. Like you correctly stated, there were tough calls on both sides.
uiba99
I'd rather be at Allerton
Jeez man I'm scrolling through the postgame the morning after a win that I wasn't able to watch why you gotta trigger me like that.
Just thinking about that game still makes me slightly ill.
pruman91
- interviewing new NL's daily....I really really am
OMG, what if someone from Missouri had noticed, and he’s playing for them now? Nightmare stuff.
I assume the phantom foul call on Mirk in the 2nd half was because he thought Mirk was mocking him with his running style.
Here's the question that I have about him AND IT'S PURELY SPECULATION. I have absolutely no basis for this question outside of what we saw on TV and the current playing time.
It seems as if Petro has gotten into it a couple of times with the coaches in two separate games. I haven't a clue what practices look like. Is it possible that we have an attitude issue and he's just not meshing well with Brad, staff or other guys on the team?
From what Wagler said in the post game, this isn't an overly serious group. They like to have fun, joke around and enjoy themselves. With Petro being 24, having played pro ball and 5/6 years older than some of the guys on the roster....is it possible that he just doesn't fit in? There's just a different maturity level and a personality clash?
A situation like that is nobody's fault. Like any relationship, whether it be business or personal, sometimes things just don't work out.
Just want to post my view of Wagler. His biggest asset is that he is not impressed with himself but has the talent and skill to do whatever his coaches have told him to do. Over time, that leads to a pretty well rounded player. In addition, he has gifts that he has develop....specifically the hand-eye coordination of his shooting skill.
What he is doing is no big deal to him because he is doing what he has been taught and trained to do. The reason he has advanced skills is that he is not impressed by his own thoughts and success but is more respectful of his coaches. parents, and likely other adults who have guided him. Few talented young kids have that respect and will follow that mentoring as faithfully. To be a talented yet humble star is somewhat rare in today's world. This kid is special.
What is so impressive is he does not look for highlight plays, but is ready to make shots when needed, most of the time when he is open. He does create baskets in the lane, but does it with patience and deliberation while always looking to get the ball to open teammates when doubled.
I hope Keaton will stay for another year and become the player his promise indicates. There is a lot of physical maturation needed and no better place for that than Illinois. Can't wait to see him in more high-level B1G games as well as what he can do in another year.
What he is doing is no big deal to him because he is doing what he has been taught and trained to do. The reason he has advanced skills is that he is not impressed by his own thoughts and success but is more respectful of his coaches. parents, and likely other adults who have guided him. Few talented young kids have that respect and will follow that mentoring as faithfully. To be a talented yet humble star is somewhat rare in today's world. This kid is special.
What is so impressive is he does not look for highlight plays, but is ready to make shots when needed, most of the time when he is open. He does create baskets in the lane, but does it with patience and deliberation while always looking to get the ball to open teammates when doubled.
I hope Keaton will stay for another year and become the player his promise indicates. There is a lot of physical maturation needed and no better place for that than Illinois. Can't wait to see him in more high-level B1G games as well as what he can do in another year.
Apologies if I misinterpreted it, OP. I took it as, "Well, his shooting % isn't that impressive because he just shot fast break layups."
My point is that he was a good shooter on high volume from day one. So, while true that he did get a couple fast break layups per game, the fact that his 04-05 season ranks 6th all time in shooting percentage in the company of a bunch of big men is, in fact, pretty wild. In 04-05, he took 109 more threes than the other top 9 players in shooting % took in their careers, combined.
But yes, to the OP's point, his shot diet was basically fast break layups and threes. He'd thrive in today's game.
Attended my first Illini game last night since I left Champaign. Physical limitations make it difficult to go to big sporting events, but when friend called last minute saying he got two tickets from a client, I had to say yes.
Wags and Mirk are the real deal — especially the former. Great game for him and those two free throws late — come on.
The other thing that really stuck out is how much this was a team win. Tomi has a tough game, but hits a late 3. Kylan had a rough game but gets that offensive rebound late. AJ does next to nothing first half, but then he’s put on Thornton in second half and slows him down, which really seemed to ignite his offense. And Big Z hits shots in the first half and then helps close out the game with a steal and a block. Just a great win.
Wags and Mirk are the real deal — especially the former. Great game for him and those two free throws late — come on.
The other thing that really stuck out is how much this was a team win. Tomi has a tough game, but hits a late 3. Kylan had a rough game but gets that offensive rebound late. AJ does next to nothing first half, but then he’s put on Thornton in second half and slows him down, which really seemed to ignite his offense. And Big Z hits shots in the first half and then helps close out the game with a steal and a block. Just a great win.
lstewart53x3
- Scottsdale, Arizona
Yeah, I think the main issues with Petro are:
1. Wagler is better than anyone, including the staff, initially thought. Petro was likely coming in to be a playmaker and have the ball in his hands, but Wagler’s the better player.
2. Petro arrived on campus late, then dealt with the hamstring issue, so hasn’t had a lot of practice time with the team, which is tough for a playmaking guard. Chemistry’s important.
3. He’s small and doesn’t defend or rebound well. This team has enough offensive firepower that it doesn’t necessarily need to trade defense for offense. Wagler’s just as efficient offensively, but better in other areas.
4. One rumor I’ve seen circulating (no idea if it’s true or not so take it for what it’s worth) is Petro has a larger language barrier than the other Euro’s and communication has been challenging.
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Agreed. Some say that if Flagg came out this year because he stayed in school for an additional year, he'd be as low as the 6th pick. It is a stacked class. We need to see where Keaton is in February, when the schedule truly gets daunting. Will his game fall off? I obviously hope not, but he needs so much work physically.
He is extremely thin and needs a lot of time in the weight room. When I saw in live vs Bama and on the post game yesterday....you'd NEVER guess that he's a big time, high D1 player. It'll be fascinating to see his arc as we move along.
His need to strength and physical development is what would keep him out of the lottery. He's at least two(probably three) years from being ready for that type of physical play.
Again, let's see where we're at in a couple of months.
Bigtex
- DFW
1) keaton is good to great. Unexpected but happy
2) get concerned when Mirk & Andrej dribble more than 3-4 times. Sometimes good results but more likely NOT
3) Many times with Mirk at the 3 point line - NO NO NO - nice shot
In a recent interview he said he did play AAU ball.
Great info! 1 minute for Petro is borderline shocking. There's absolutely no chance, with that little time, to get lathered up and get into any sort of rhythm. I'm all for Wagler and Boswell sucking up 95% of the minutes at the guard position, but man....1 minute?
Again, great insight.
KJ had 12 turnovers in his last two games. He really hurt the Illini the second half of the year with his high turnover rate. I know he had some injuries so that may have affected his ball handling. Hopefully we can get two years out of Wagler. Will Michigan try and poach him after this year if he decides to play one more year of college ball?
I don't follow your logic. If each team member made 7 major (possession ending) mistakes per ~26m, that would be ~100% of our possessions. (And that isn't counting that Mirk spent some of those 26 minutes on the bench.)
I legitimately think Anderson saw Big T signal to review the out of bounds call (clearly off OSU, knew it would be overturned) and he decided to call a foul 3 seconds later.
It’s just madness.
It’s just madness.
That one minute consisted of him coming in and immediately trying to split two defenders and turning the ball over for a three pointer at the other end. I understand the missed time, language issues, etc. but he has to understand his role is to come in take care of the ball and distribute. Hopeful that he can settle in and start doing that because I believe he can add another dimension to the offense.
He is never going to earn BU's trust if he continues to try to force the issue resulting in bad turnovers.
I think Mirk would look good in some Terminator sunglasses, almost a dead ringer for Schwarzenegger
At around 1:45 a few teammates show up and start recording Mirk and he is laughing a little bit (enough that he was having issues actually answering questions). One of the reporters had to get all serious and tell them to knock it off, they're on a time limit, etcetera.
At around 2:45 someone asks him about an interaction he had with some Tennessee fans after the game. Paraphrasing: "There was a fan who was talking a little sh1t, I heard him in the first half, just winked at him. I was waiting for something, and I think that dagger three was the perfect opportunity to say something. I just said a short, Serbian word, can't repeat it here"
The reason he is so good is confidence. Period. He just plays. He didn’t think to hard. Does let negative thoughts into his head. Failure isn’t a word to him. Confidence! Learn it! Study it! The best in the world have it. The most successful across every part of life have great confidence
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