IKR! Tony Bennett is the very definition of a home-run hire.
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IKR! Tony Bennett is the very definition of a home-run hire.
Cheez
- Sun Prairie WI
I'm sorry that I have high expectations for Illini basketball?
Obviously Illinois needs to go out and get the best available. I'm not going to sit here and make excuses for our current head coach. Groce needs to go, period.
My point is that, unlike the last time the Illini needed a coach, there really aren't any big names available - i.e. "Plan A" guys. I was agreeing with the poster I quoted who believes that Martin shouldn't be considered as a "Plan A" coach unless Whitman can pull a rabbit out of his hat like he did with the Lovie hire.
I would love one of those, but I just don't see them out there this year.
I'm not accusing you of wanting to keep John Groce, I'm accusing you of having absolutely unrealistic expectations such that Tony Bennett wouldn't be an absolute grand slam. If you don't like his style aesthetically, fine, but that resume is about as good as you'll find at a non-blue blood.
Cheez
- Sun Prairie WI
I'll fully admit bias against Bennett because of his coaching style. That might truly be the only thing - I dont know. What I do know is that Virginia games are torturous to watch.
And that's entirely fair, I just think resume-wise, he's literally one of the best coaches who is not entirely untouchable by virtue of being at a blue blood. Personally I don't mind his style at all, but obviously that's a subjective point. All that said, this conversation feels a little moot because (1) I STILL don't know where the idea he'd even be a little bit in play came from and related, (2) I don't think he's in play at all. But I'd be beyond ecstatic to be wrong.
Cheez
- Sun Prairie WI
To your point #1: I think it stems from him being rumored for the Wisconsin job last year. He was "available" then, so in theory he could still be "available" now.
Like you, though, I dont really think he's in play. Bringing me back to my original point: There are no "plan A" coaches available this year. Illinois will need to hire someone, but if we're expecting it to be someone to completely reinvigorate the fanbase we might be disappointed.
I think that depends on your perception of "Plan A" tier guys, but if they're coming from a P6 school, the public perception will likely be 'unavailable' until we find out elsewise, and I don't think that's entirely different from any other year. i.e. Gregg Marshall qualifies as a Plan A, imo, he's probably available to the right offer, but we're not a job that would get his services.
I doubt Bennett is a real option, but if he is interested, I say bring on the pain and the number one tournament seeds.
mattcoldagelli
- The Transfer Portal with Do Not Contact Tag
I can think of another team that wears orange and blue that is way more torturous to watch.
Also of note, is that Shaka isn't setting the world on fire at Texas right now. There is risk there when you hire a mid major guy to a P5 school.
Most Lou Henson teams were hard on the eyes.Many Bo Ryan teams were.Gimme some.
Especially at a school like TX. I'm not close to the situation, but my sense is that you take a guy with a very focused approach, and put him in a place where there are a ton of constituencies, strong boosters, etc., and it's easy for him to get away from what got him there.
And how does it feel watching Illinois basketball?
My concern with the Bennett rumors is that part of the reasoning is that he's underpaid relative to his performance. Which makes me think the perceived interest may in fact be him leveraging our interest for a nice raise from UVa.
FeelYourPaign
- So Cal
That's a legit concern.
And I don't think that anyone is considering him to be much more than a pipe dream. Wishful thinking and all of that. But what a great pipe dream !
haasi
- New York
He would be a coup. Barring a huge salary, I just don't know what we offer better than UVa at this point for him. He has UVa exactly where he wants them in what is now the best basketball conference in America. Charlottesville is a really nice town. I'm sure his salary goes quite far there.
Could see him leaving for Wisconsin given his ties or for a blue blood, but not for another pretty good job in a major conference where that program is in much worse shape than his, unless he's getting megabucks more than at Virginia.
This is spot on WVC. The same probably applies to Martin. Most people don't understand the concept. Matt Painter pulled it off masterfully, using Missouri as leverage.
The same doesn't apply to Martin. He's genuinely interested in the Illinois gig.
I'm in the "time to move on from Groce" camp, but it's a little unfair to say he hasn't developed anyone. Maybe we would have liked to see more development, and you can argue whether their development is because of Groce or just them getting more experience and more minutes, but Morgan has certainly developed as has Malcolm Hill. Finke and Black's stats have risen and I think both have made strides. JCL's stats are for the most part down a bit from last year, but I like that he is willing to put the ball on the floor and drive this year. DJ and AJ have certainly not shown much development and many would argue that them not getting consistent minutes is a problem. But I haven't really seen them do all that much with the minutes they've had.
I just don't think this team is as talented as we all thought. Sure some of that is on Groce for either not developing them more or not evaluating them well enough when recruiting them, but I think some of that is us fans looking at the recruiting rankings and assuming these players are really talented. I'm not sure that's the case. But my big problem with the team is it has no identity. Groce has had all these players except for TJL in his system for 1 to 4 years and they have not developed any kind of identity or anything they can hang their hat on when things get tough. That's why they're inconsistent and sometimes just look plain bad, and that's why I think it is time to move on from Groce.
What win total keep Groce here
I think nothing short of 9 wins in the Big Ten and at least one BTT win keeps Groce here. The B1G is down this year this should be an easier target to hit with teams like MSU and OSU down this year. You have senior leaders and you still can't win games? If they lose tomorrow night isn't it all over with or is it over already? Is there any hope for this team?
I think nothing short of 9 wins in the Big Ten and at least one BTT win keeps Groce here. The B1G is down this year this should be an easier target to hit with teams like MSU and OSU down this year. You have senior leaders and you still can't win games? If they lose tomorrow night isn't it all over with or is it over already? Is there any hope for this team?
OrangeAndBlues
- Indianapolis
I don't like this line of thinking.
We've had five years to see what a Groce program looks like. I think it's pretty obvious that it is lacking.
Getting hot and falling into some luck when the Big Ten is having a down year just so we can have the chance to lose the play-in game isn't enough to justify keeping him around in my book. That's not the blueprint for sustainable success.
Ransom Stoddard
Ordained Dudeist Priest
- Bloomington, IL
There are already a lot of posts on that in this thread (not saying you didn't read them, but...there are).
My personal opinion is that the number of wins is irrelevant. He has a body of work to base a decision on, and I don't see anything at all in the body of work that says he's capable of coaching a team into the upper half of the B1G. Unless he somehow miraculously helps this team get to the S16, I'd like to see a change made rather than kick the can down the road another year.
Foggy Notion
- San Francisco
You mean like Groce did in his first year at Illinois?
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