This is a message board. Everyone has an opinion. Are former players immune to criticism and complaints? I couldn't care less if he never sees my comment. To support this awful coach is dumb. Plain and simple.
2017 Coaching Carousel
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I have a hard time seeing Frank Martin as Josh Whitman's guy. I could be wrong, he'd certainly be a terrific hire.
That's okay, you don't have to be a Scott Drew fan but if you're going to put Brad Underwood on a pedestal considering he hasn't proven himself on the big stage yet, then you cannot minimize Scott Drew's accomplishments at Baylor. That is simply taking a biased perspective. I am aware of what Underwood did at SFA but he has to prove it at a high major level program. That's why he's not on my Tier 1 or Tier 2. Our university should not be taking "chances" or "risks" based on future performance potential. This is not the NBA. We should be going with the sure-fire candidates.
How much longer for Coach K?
I say he coaches maybe 3 more seasons at the most? Collins may be their coach by 2021 season?
I suspect that Collins will be at Northwestern until Coach K retires at Duke...
Let's see, Coach K turns 70 on the 13th of this month. He's won ~1059 games...
What's your definition of "the long haul"?
I say he coaches maybe 3 more seasons at the most? Collins may be their coach by 2021 season?
I have seen many degrade Groce as an awful coach. I think that is a bit much. Clearly he isn't getting the job done and he would say as much. That doesn't really make him an awful coach or show he can't coach as some have said. There was a post/article a few days back talking about how Groce's philosophies are actually quite good but very difficult to understand and master. He is fairly respected in the coaching community for his basketball mind. None of that makes him successful in this job however. He has clearly failed to get his players to master his system and has failed to alter the system sufficiently to make it work with the players he has.
What I would correlate it to is a very intelligent good individual contributor in a company that is promoted to a manager position and falls flat on their face. It doesn't mean they were idiots all along just that they haven't quite learned what they need to be successful in the next step.
Groce will get another job just like Weber did and will likely have some success just like Weber. Maybe he parlays that success into another major opportunity and he will have learned his lesson on some things and be successful. He seems like a pretty good guy so I hope that is the case as long as it isn't at OSU.
Yeah that's my biggest fear is him learning, improving, and going to OSU and watching them rise again. :hurl:
People in the media can say whatever they like, I find it hard to agree that a coach is a brilliant hoops mind when his offenses consistently take this many deep 2s, and the coach is content with that (as based on lack of accountability for those shots AND comments to media). That's just ignoring simple analytics.
Groce just in wrong fit
I don't think anyone on this forum can really say that Groce can't coach at all when obviously he can or he wouldn't have gotten this far in his career? I like the analogy above I agree he just isn't in the right situation or the right school to be successful. I'm not sure Groce get's another job anytime soon he should go be an assistant maybe for Matta again and see if the can go back to the mid-major schools and see how he does. He is a good guy and I'm sure can have some success elsewhere down the road he is young too.
I don't think anyone on this forum can really say that Groce can't coach at all when obviously he can or he wouldn't have gotten this far in his career? I like the analogy above I agree he just isn't in the right situation or the right school to be successful. I'm not sure Groce get's another job anytime soon he should go be an assistant maybe for Matta again and see if the can go back to the mid-major schools and see how he does. He is a good guy and I'm sure can have some success elsewhere down the road he is young too.
If Groce ends up back at tOSU like I suspect he will, then this is probably the most important basketball hire in program history for UI, because I guarantee that tOSU will return to being the program they were from 2010-2013 with Groce being the lead recruiter.
There is nothing brilliant about Groce's in-game tactics or basketball mind. He got to this point, so he knows something about basketball. But, his in-game substitution patterns, inability to adapt at halftime as quickly as his opposition, strategic in-game decision-making is sub-par at best. I'm not sure which games you are watching but Groce has proven he doesn't consistently have it at this level to stay competitive. Most of the B10 coaches are better than him as it is besides for Richard Pitino. I'd even consider putting Tim Miles. Patrick Chambers and Steve Pikiell ahead of him as they know how to teach defense and rebounding. Beilein, Bo Ryan/now Greg Gard, Thad Matta have consistently out-coached Groce.
With Illinois just coming off abuse claims with Beckman, they are NOT going to consider Frank Martin. I can tell you that Kleats and Miller will be in JY top 3. I can also tell you with 100% confidence that Bennett is not coming here.
Lets just say the wheels have started to turn behind the scenes with Illinois basketball.
Lets just say the wheels have started to turn behind the scenes with Illinois basketball.
illynifan34
That's a winner!!
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That isn't the reason TJL played though, I read here that Groce played him due to message board pressure.
sacraig
- The desert
I feel like there would just be so much weirdness about hiring the guy that our former coach replaced, though...
Care to share how you know this? And it's pretty commonly known that Whitman has started the process of finding a new coach. His trip to Florida recently wasn't simply a vacation. And I can say with near-certainty that he'll reach for a bigger catch than Keatts and Archie. They're on his radar but not primary targets right now.
It would certainly be a funny little switcheroo. I would like the hire, because I like Martin.
OrangeAndBlues
- Indianapolis
Care to share a source on that?
His trip was a fundraiser/dinner meeting with Alums. They have this every year down there. Other members of the UI administration go as well.
Illwinsagain
- Cary, IL
Who are the "sure fire" candidates? I think the last of those we hired was Lon. Even he had difficulty with recruiting Chicago. There just happened to be a lot of talent outside the city at the time. Self was an up and comer, but not a sure thing.
Still curious who your source is about Bennett (and even Keatts and Archie). I've been told that he reached out to SEAN Miller last summer to gauge interest based on a particular dollar figure. So he's reaching higher than Lil Miller or Keatts.
I'm not going to go through the 100+ pages since I visited this last, but what would people think of Lon coming back? It seemed that he left on good terms, taking a job at the top level that didn't work out. His program kinda hides away at OU behind the football team, but it's usually solid. I think he would consider coming back if we came calling.
Obviously not the age of a coach we'd be interested in hiring, but it's a familiar name that might bring old fans back. Thoughts?
Obviously not the age of a coach we'd be interested in hiring, but it's a familiar name that might bring old fans back. Thoughts?
That would be funny yet sad. I highly doubt Groce has the time to even visit these boards.
Ransom Stoddard
Ordained Dudeist Priest
- Bloomington, IL
You may want to go back through the 100+ pages or do a search on Lon. That horse is glue.
Whitman is either going to get on the Keatts Hype Train or get run over by the Keatts Hype Train.
It's going to be moving full steam when UNCW is in the elite 8 this year.
To be clear, I'm not opposed to Keatts at all. But if Whitman can somehow land a Sean Miller or Tony Bennett, that's obviously the preference.
I'm going to start keeping a list, and Kajagoogoo is off the Keatts Hype Train. Don't choke on the dust or steam cloud or whatever trains expel
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