2021 NBA Draft

Status
Not open for further replies.
#151      

QCtoKC

QCtoKC
QCtoKC
pruman91 said:
I was addicted to the NBA wayyyyyyyyyyy back when Oscar Robertson , Elgin Baylor, the Celtics dynasty teams through to Bird, Magic etc.....
Not a fan now as team play has been replaced with 3pters and no D........
JMHO
Click to expand...
Tell me you don’t watch the NBA without telling me you don’t watch the NBA.

LOL no team play. With Philadelphia’s defense keying on Trae Young, he responded in Game 4 of the 2nd-round series by posting a game of 18 assists and 2 turnovers.

Against Denver, Chris Paul had a game of 15 assists and 0 turnovers.

Probably the play of the playoffs so far was an inbounds pass from Jae Crowder.

I despise old people talking about the NBA of old and pretending that today’s version isn’t good. Absolutely flips a trigger in me.
 
#152      

pruman91

pruman91
Paducah, Ky
pruman91
QCtoKC said:
Tell me you don’t watch the NBA without telling me you don’t watch the NBA.

LOL no team play. With Philadelphia’s defense keying on Trae Young, he responded in Game 4 of the 2nd-round series by posting a game of 18 assists and 2 turnovers.

Against Denver, Chris Paul had a game of 15 assists and 0 turnovers.

Probably the play of the playoffs so far was an inbounds pass from Jae Crowder.

I despise old people talking about the NBA of old and pretending that today’s version isn’t good. Absolutely flips a trigger in me.
Click to expand...
Ok.....well I was giving my opinion and now you have given yours..
Fair enough.....I weaned myself from the NBA years ago and the only times I would watch at all was during the playoffs. But maybe I have been missing out by not watching now..
Thanks for sharing and I'm sorry about the triggering of any hostility
Not my intent at all..
HAGD
 
#153      

Emerson Bigguns

Emerson Bigguns
Emerson Bigguns
QCtoKC said:
Tell me you don’t watch the NBA without telling me you don’t watch the NBA.

LOL no team play. With Philadelphia’s defense keying on Trae Young, he responded in Game 4 of the 2nd-round series by posting a game of 18 assists and 2 turnovers.

Against Denver, Chris Paul had a game of 15 assists and 0 turnovers.

Probably the play of the playoffs so far was an inbounds pass from Jae Crowder.

I despise old people talking about the NBA of old and pretending that today’s version isn’t good. Absolutely flips a trigger in me.
Click to expand...
There is a TON of two man/pick and roll and Iso action in NBA games. Citing assist totals doesn't change that.

Kevin Durant tried to beat the Bucks by himself. (and almost succeeded)

You see very few possessions where more than 3 guys touch the ball, especially at the end of games.

Defense has been legislated out of the league. It isn't that guys don't want to defend, its that referees don't let them. Being physical is punished.

I am hopeful that some of the proposed rules in regard to offensive players initiating contact and getting free throws helps, but I doubt much will change.
 
#154      

texillwek

texillwek
🔶🔹🔸🔷
texillwek
QCtoKC said:
I despise old people talking about the NBA of old and pretending that today’s version isn’t good. Absolutely flips a trigger in me.
Click to expand...

How to tell someone to calm down without telling them to calm down:
Jack Nicholson Movie GIF
 
#156      

skyIdub

skyIdub
Winged Warrior
skyIdub
QCtoKC said:
Tell me you don’t watch the NBA without telling me you don’t watch the NBA.

LOL no team play. With Philadelphia’s defense keying on Trae Young, he responded in Game 4 of the 2nd-round series by posting a game of 18 assists and 2 turnovers.

Against Denver, Chris Paul had a game of 15 assists and 0 turnovers.

Probably the play of the playoffs so far was an inbounds pass from Jae Crowder.

I despise old people talking about the NBA of old and pretending that today’s version isn’t good. Absolutely flips a trigger in me.
Click to expand...

Don't be so triggered! Today's NBA is absolutely good....but......it's just different. Like all the major sports, money, statistics, and analytics have taken over the games. It doesn't mean they aren't entertaining any more...it's just different entertainment.

Today's players vs. yesterdays players is a fun debate if you can keep it civil.

I..like pruman...had pretty much given up on the NBA, for similar reasons. Watching the 80's NBA and the very infant stages of fantasy sports. Where we drafted with pencil and paper!

I had retreated to just NHL fandom as (IMHO) it is the last of the pro sports to really cling to traditions and not be taken over..yet...by stat nerds.😘
Jerry Jones killed my love for the Meowboys. Analytics is killing my love for baseball. A base hit is almost worthless now. So much for Pete Rose, Tony Gwynn, and Kirby Puckett. Wanna see a complete game? Good luck...analytics say pull the guy out after 93 pitches in the 7th inning because third time through...even though he's struck out 8 and given up 1 run and 3 hits. /rant off

Then this past year my brothers encouraged me to give the NBA a chance and watch Luka Doncic (Mavs fan). I became a fan again. I watched Trae Young...the Nets trio. The Clippers combo that ousted the Mavs. The last real NBA I watched was the Mavs run in 2011 with Dirk.

Todays NBA has some incredible talent...I'm glad I am watching again! I can't wait to watch Ayo and Kofi! I can't wait to see Curbelo drafted! Maybe even a lottery pick! Trae Young showing the way!

Perspective is the word of the century!
 
#157      

SescIllini

SescIllini
SescIllini
Comments on Ayo...Great job parents of raising him, Class Act! What an ambassador to the University and Pro Game, he will have a career both as a player and leader in the league. He handles himself better than the adults who are interviewing him.

Ayo does have a lot of the Bucks guard Jrue Holiday's game, both physical measurables and similar styles. I used to think when Ayo was compared to him that it wasn't high enough of a ceiling for Ayo, but I think it is more than a compliment now that I saw Holiday play more. In today's league where you are dealing with a lot of immature players and poor teammates, Ayo will stand out. Also see Ayo to continue to improve, he has the work ethic. Can see people questioning why he was drafted in low 1st round in a couple of years and asking why.
 
#158      

TCTORNADO

TCTORNADO
TCTORNADO
pruman91 said:
Ok.....well I was giving my opinion and now you have given yours..
Fair enough.....I weaned myself from the NBA years ago and the only times I would watch at all was during the playoffs. But maybe I have been missing out by not watching now..
Thanks for sharing and I'm sorry about the triggering of any hostility
Not my intent at all..
HAGD
Click to expand...
You handled that very well.
 
#159      

pruman91

pruman91
Paducah, Ky
pruman91
TCTORNADO said:
You handled that very well.
Click to expand...
Thanks TC.......i really mean it when i say I respect all opinions...As I age and go through some medical problems I have a better understanding of looking at other's point of view and trying to understand where they are coming from.....

SkyIdub had a very good post earlier in this thread that I wish I had made my original post about the NBA like he did...The point he stated about baseball really struck home with me.....seems like there is an analytic about the number of sunflower seeds spat out or the length of the spit travelling...

Any post that helps me understand a topic better is greatly appreciated.....
 
#160      

blackdog

blackdog
Champaign
blackdog
skyIdub said:
Don't be so triggered! Today's NBA is absolutely good....but......it's just different. Like all the major sports, money, statistics, and analytics have taken over the games. It doesn't mean they aren't entertaining any more...it's just different entertainment.

Today's players vs. yesterdays players is a fun debate if you can keep it civil.

I..like pruman...had pretty much given up on the NBA, for similar reasons. Watching the 80's NBA and the very infant stages of fantasy sports. Where we drafted with pencil and paper!

I had retreated to just NHL fandom as (IMHO) it is the last of the pro sports to really cling to traditions and not be taken over..yet...by stat nerds.😘
Jerry Jones killed my love for the Meowboys. Analytics is killing my love for baseball. A base hit is almost worthless now. So much for Pete Rose, Tony Gwynn, and Kirby Puckett. Wanna see a complete game? Good luck...analytics say pull the guy out after 93 pitches in the 7th inning because third time through...even though he's struck out 8 and given up 1 run and 3 hits. /rant off

Then this past year my brothers encouraged me to give the NBA a chance and watch Luka Doncic (Mavs fan). I became a fan again. I watched Trae Young...the Nets trio. The Clippers combo that ousted the Mavs. The last real NBA I watched was the Mavs run in 2011 with Dirk.

Todays NBA has some incredible talent...I'm glad I am watching again! I can't wait to watch Ayo and Kofi! I can't wait to see Curbelo drafted! Maybe even a lottery pick! Trae Young showing the way!

Perspective is the word of the century!
Click to expand...

Different is definitely the right word for. The level of skill of the average player seems to keep going up and thats even more true of the superstars.

Its not that guys don't play defense because if you don't play D you aren't making it to the league. The big thing now is officiating away some of the physicality but also in basketball good offense is going to beat good defense every time. These guys are out there regularly making shots where you just shake your head in amazement. The thing is they are making these shots because they practice them which goes back to my point about skill levels going up.
 
#161      

Ransom Stoddard

Ransom Stoddard
Ordained Dudeist Priest
Bloomington, IL
Ransom Stoddard
QCtoKC said:
Tell me you don’t watch the NBA without telling me you don’t watch the NBA.

LOL no team play. With Philadelphia’s defense keying on Trae Young, he responded in Game 4 of the 2nd-round series by posting a game of 18 assists and 2 turnovers.

Against Denver, Chris Paul had a game of 15 assists and 0 turnovers.

Probably the play of the playoffs so far was an inbounds pass from Jae Crowder.

I despise old people talking about the NBA of old and pretending that today’s version isn’t good. Absolutely flips a trigger in me.
Click to expand...
Don't worry, someday you'll be the old person talking about how things aren't as good now as they were back in your day. It's as sure as death and taxes.
 
#162      

SeattleSlim

S
SeattleSlim
Ransom Stoddard said:
Don't worry, someday you'll be the old person talking about how things aren't as good now as they were back in your day. It's as sure as death and taxes.
Click to expand...
I give you a “qualified” like on this post because it’s not quite as good as some you made in past years.
 
#163      

PIT_ILL

P
PIT_ILL
skyIdub said:
I had retreated to just NHL fandom as (IMHO) it is the last of the pro sports to really cling to traditions and not be taken over..yet...by stat nerds.😘
Jerry Jones killed my love for the Meowboys. Analytics is killing my love for baseball. A base hit is almost worthless now. So much for Pete Rose, Tony Gwynn, and Kirby Puckett. Wanna see a complete game? Good luck...analytics say pull the guy out after 93 pitches in the 7th inning because third time through...even though he's struck out 8 and given up 1 run and 3 hits. /rant off

Perspective is the word of the century!
Click to expand...
The NHL has a ton of advanced stats. I think you just don't notice it as much in the actual gameplay as you do with baseball or basketball. It's effect is more on personnel decisions. For instance you very rarely see a guy playing his off side unless there are injuries that force the matter.
 
#164      

illiniCA

illiniCA
DC Area
illiniCA
PIT_ILL said:
The NHL has a ton of advanced stats. I think you just don't notice it as much in the actual gameplay as you do with baseball or basketball. It's effect is more on personnel decisions. For instance you very rarely see a guy playing his off side unless there are injuries that force the matter.
Click to expand...

There are no 3 pointers or home runs which leads to a very different analytics result.


I am a huge huge huge baseball fan and the game is rough right now. However, MLB is aware and working on way to fix it.

I watched the NBA for a long time but stopped over the last 8-10 years. I will watch playoff games but the regular season in not enjoyable for me. I think the lack of physical contact, mid range, has lead to a boring game for me. The guys are uber talented though. They can hit from all over the place.
 
#165      

skyIdub

skyIdub
Winged Warrior
skyIdub
PIT_ILL said:
The NHL has a ton of advanced stats. I think you just don't notice it as much in the actual gameplay as you do with baseball or basketball. It's effect is more on personnel decisions. For instance you very rarely see a guy playing his off side unless there are injuries that force the matter.
Click to expand...

Yep...I can totally see the value of analytics in some respects like this...and definitely agree it's not as noticeable in the NHL even though it exists. It just hasn't changed the game as much as others.
 
#171      

blackdog

blackdog
Champaign
blackdog
PIT_ILL said:
The NHL has a ton of advanced stats. I think you just don't notice it as much in the actual gameplay as you do with baseball or basketball. It's effect is more on personnel decisions. For instance you very rarely see a guy playing his off side unless there are injuries that force the matter.
Click to expand...

I know this is getting a little off topic but advanced stats in the NHL are absolutely insane. I stopped reading my favorite team blog a couple years ago because it became really difficult to read with how stats heavy it was.

DFF% - Dangerous Fenwick For %
Dangerous Fenwick is a Weighted shot metric using shot distance location and type of shot to give each shot a "danger" value. DFF% is Dangerous Fenwick For/Against Ratio [(DFF/(DFF+DFA)]

Just a small example of one of the many stats used....

Anyway slightly more on topic another reason the NBA game has changed is the use of analytics and statistics. Teams can see what the best shots to take are and which players shoot the best from those spots.
 
#173      

IllinoisssssssVarsity

I
IllinoisssssssVarsity
This arguably the most offensively skilled NBA ever. They could revert to traditional defensive rules and not much would change. Do you really wanna sit help side when all 5 guys on the court can shoot? Same question on double teaming. Most players in the league can’t be guarded 1 on 1 anyway even if you allow a little more contact. They will use their handle to shake free. Tell me you truly think kyrie couldn’t shake off a hand check, or harden still wouldn’t be able to create space. These dudes are just a different level.

And I don’t even watch the nba like that anymore.
 
#174      

TheFameProtector

TheFameProtector
Champaign
TheFameProtector
blackdog said:
Different is definitely the right word for. The level of skill of the average player seems to keep going up and thats even more true of the superstars.

Its not that guys don't play defense because if you don't play D you aren't making it to the league. The big thing now is officiating away some of the physicality but also in basketball good offense is going to beat good defense every time. These guys are out there regularly making shots where you just shake your head in amazement. The thing is they are making these shots because they practice them which goes back to my point about skill levels going up.
Click to expand...
Well said. The individual skill level is definitely higher these days amongst players, and the trope about not playing defense is clearly off the mark. A guy like Jabari Parker is (basically) not in the league because he can't hold up on defense. Unless you're an elite offensive weapon (Trae Young), you need to be able to play both ends of the floor more than ever. I mean, the concept is rolled into the name of one of the most critical roles in the league: 3-and-D. Do both well and you can easily make $15 mil/year, but do only one (like Tony Allen) and you're going to have a much harder time sticking around than you would've 10 years ago. You also have to differentiate between the regular season and playoffs. I love the NBA, but the regular season is not as good of a basketball product, whereas the playoffs are a different animal and the style and demeanor of play changes dramatically.

BUT, part of what made the sport so enjoyable in the 80s and 90s was the physicality, along with the continuity of teams. Most of the physicality has been officiated out of the game (some is due to stylistic changes, since there are fewer mammoth guys banging in the post). The foul-baiting is absolutely a problem, but there is an effort to change the rules this offseason to reduce that behavior and hopefully that will succeed. Other changes are needed too, like the endless play reviews at the end of games. But some of these same criticisms are equally applicable to the modern college game (remember @ Indiana this year?? Brutal), and the lack of team continuity has been progressively getting worse at the college level too.
 
#175      

skyIdub

skyIdub
Winged Warrior
skyIdub
IllinoisssssssVarsity said:
This arguably the most offensively skilled NBA ever. They could revert to traditional defensive rules and not much would change. Do you really wanna sit help side when all 5 guys on the court can shoot? Same question on double teaming. Most players in the league can’t be guarded 1 on 1 anyway even if you allow a little more contact. They will use their handle to shake free. Tell me you truly think kyrie couldn’t shake off a hand check, or harden still wouldn’t be able to create space. These dudes are just a different level.

And I don’t even watch the nba like that anymore.
Click to expand...

Great points, and It's really beyond argument. While it's fun to compare the big superstars from history to now....1-10 the NBA is more talented now than ever.
While there were definitely several teams that could match 1-5 talent...the talent off the bench now is insane. My best example...with apologies due to mostly watching Mavericks games...is Jalen Brunson backing up Luka. Brunson is 100% starting on a lot of other NBA teams right now. He may get that chance next year.
But he's backing up a generational talent.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.