This is very very true. I also find it fairly depressing.
The good news is we’ve got a golden opportunity to break through and leave: Purdue, Wisconsin & MState in the dust. Who’s with me?
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Bracketology
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The good news is we’ve got a golden opportunity to break through and leave: Purdue, Wisconsin & MState in the dust. Who’s with me?
Fighter of the Nightman
- Chicago, IL
During what years did the Big Ten underperform as a whole, and why is it a "fact" as you say? I took some pretty decent time arguing against that narrative for the last two seasons. The Big Ten obviously underperformed in 2021, but it OVER-performed in the Tournament before that (2019).
Personally, I am not willing to gobble down the national media's spoon-fed assertion that the Big Ten is always "overrated" when we aren't even rated highly in the first place!!!!
Fighter of the Nightman
- Chicago, IL
I think #2 is REALLY underrated, and I am not sure why our conference's OWN FANS are so willing to ignore it. Does anyone seriously think the 2005 Illini just simply "weren't good enough" to win a National Championship? Or 2007 Ohio State? Both of those teams ran into generationally great teams in the Title game. Not all seasons are created equally, and it would take a seriously self-hating attitude toward the conference to act like there has not been some bad luck involved. It certainly doesn't explain the NC drought entirely, but to jump from "We've lost the NC Game 7 times since 2000" to "We suck!" is crazy.
I'll throw another annoying thing out there ... you know why literally nobody talks about the Pac-12's NC drought that is 3 years longer than the Big Ten's even though they have ~Blue Blood~ UCLA and a perennially competitive Arizona?? Because the Big Ten has had a SERIOUS chance to win it all multiple times, and it has not been 1-2 programs carrying the conference to the Final Four.
EDIT: Lastly, I will die on this hill ... define "Blue Blood" however you'd like (I personally agree that it needs to have a historical component that actually even excludes the likes of Villanova or UConn), but whatever Indiana is, Louisville is. There are 7 Blue Bloods (UK, UNC, KU, Duke, UCLA, IU, UL) or there are 5 (excluding IU and UL).
We bleed orange and blue, so we're like at least half blue-blood, right? /s
Your own citations do not support your position. What an A+ troll job, hats off to you and your unyielding wisdom.
Your SI article:
Your Kentucky-based article - I refute it with the same thing I said about UCLA. Yes it is exactly "what have you done for me lately", with the timeline of 'lately' open for debate.
Your NCAA article lists about 30 different teams as blue bloods over its length, here's a snip from the early 50s - want to tell how Murray State has never lost its blue blood status? I mean, they were christened by the AP so this must be official, right?
Unfortunately my work blocks the MGMBet site, because I am sure I could find another example there of your own citations refuting your premise.
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
Are we really doing blue blood discourse in the Year of Our Lord 2024?
Fighter of the Nightman
- Chicago, IL
On this note, fine ... let's call Indiana a Blue Blood! Does this do ANYTHING but further stoke the delusional nature of their fan base? Lol, who cares? In our current environment, I am so incredibly skeptical that Indiana (a "Blue Blood") has an easier time maintaining a winning program than an Illinois (a "good-not-elite" program historically). Both have the fan support, facilities, resources, recruiting footprint, etc. to win big, and a skilled recruiter at Illinois will not be automatically at a disadvantage when recruiting against IU because Bob Knight won there 40 years ago.
Yale football loves you right now.
Indiana is indeed a blue blood, but it’s the blue blood family member who, long ago blew its money on foolish investments and lived well beyond its means. A blue blood in name, but without the family resources.
I'm much more interested to see if and how NIL (and its successor student-athlete payments systems) breaks down the historically successful schools.
Otherwise I agree...
I'm sure they would if this was 1930
ChiefGritty
- Chicago, IL
I was gonna say, show me the NIL receipts and I'll tell you who the blue bloods are.
(Pretty much the same mechanism that overthrew the European aristocracy where the term "blue blood" comes from now that we mention it, a handful of continent-wide bloodbaths notwithstanding)
Fighter of the Nightman
- Chicago, IL
But they still sit out on their porch drunk at 11:00 am yelling at everyone who passes by reminding them that they're a Blue Blood. We used to argue back at them, but now it's just kind of sad and we don't even care to say anything back.
Now this I can agree with. I was born and raised in Indiana and my entire family except me is IU fans and I just roll my eyes every time they start talking about their team.
look at UCONN
1999 1 seed
2004 2 seed
2011 3 seed
2014 7 seed
2023 4 seed
They only won one NC as a 1 seed If you look at us we only have made final fours as a one seed. We have had similar seeds as UCONN but not the post season success
Duke has won as a 1 or 2 seed
KU hasn’t won a NC much and has a win as 6 seed
Picking an outlier is a bad way to win an argument...
NCAA championships by seed:
1 - 24
2 - 5
3 - 4
4 - 2
5 - 0
6 - 1
7 - 1
8 - 1
Seeds of NCAA Tournament Champions - BracketResearch.com
Tables show how many times each seed has won the NCAA Tournament and the seed of each champ for every tournament.
bracketresearch.com
In my opinion I think the best indicator of tournament success should be based more on the Final Four compared to National Championships
Yes of course National Championships matter more as it shows (most of the time) who the best team was. There has only been 37 programs who have won a national champion, and only 18 of those schools have won it since 1985 when the tournament moved to 64 team bracket and all teams had to play 6 games. (Georgetown won in it 1984 the year before the switch so if you include them then 19 schools)
There are 351 Division 1 basketball programs and 80 power 6 schools currently. So, going off national champion success then we can narrow down the best of the best programs.
The Big Ten since 1985 has had 3 schools win a national championship (Indiana, Michigan, and Michigan St) (Maryland won it as well but wasn't in the Big Ten)
Now taking a look at final four appearances in that same time, the Big Ten has sent 25 teams out of a possible 144 teams (17.3% of the time)
Since 2000 the Big Ten has sent 16 teams out of a possible 88 teams (18.2% of the time). This is also the second most to the ACC 18 teams since 2000.
"https://collegesportswire.usatoday....-big-east-since-2000-mens-college-basketball/"
I agree championships should matter.......but when you take a look at final fours the Big Ten shows that the "lack of tournament success" is only for the final game which only 18 programs in the past 37 years have won
Yes of course National Championships matter more as it shows (most of the time) who the best team was. There has only been 37 programs who have won a national champion, and only 18 of those schools have won it since 1985 when the tournament moved to 64 team bracket and all teams had to play 6 games. (Georgetown won in it 1984 the year before the switch so if you include them then 19 schools)
There are 351 Division 1 basketball programs and 80 power 6 schools currently. So, going off national champion success then we can narrow down the best of the best programs.
The Big Ten since 1985 has had 3 schools win a national championship (Indiana, Michigan, and Michigan St) (Maryland won it as well but wasn't in the Big Ten)
Now taking a look at final four appearances in that same time, the Big Ten has sent 25 teams out of a possible 144 teams (17.3% of the time)
Since 2000 the Big Ten has sent 16 teams out of a possible 88 teams (18.2% of the time). This is also the second most to the ACC 18 teams since 2000.
"https://collegesportswire.usatoday....-big-east-since-2000-mens-college-basketball/"
I agree championships should matter.......but when you take a look at final fours the Big Ten shows that the "lack of tournament success" is only for the final game which only 18 programs in the past 37 years have won
Out of the 11 non 1 seed NC 4 have been UCONN. I don’t disagree being a 1 increases your chances unless you are UCONNPicking an outlier is a bad way to win an argument...
NCAA championships by seed:
1 - 24
2 - 5
3 - 4
4 - 2
5 - 0
6 - 1
7 - 1
8 - 1
Seeds of NCAA Tournament Champions - BracketResearch.com
Tables show how many times each seed has won the NCAA Tournament and the seed of each champ for every tournament.
So we definitely don't want the 5 seed.Picking an outlier is a bad way to win an argument...
NCAA championships by seed:
1 - 24
2 - 5
3 - 4
4 - 2
5 - 0
6 - 1
7 - 1
8 - 1
Seeds of NCAA Tournament Champions - BracketResearch.com
Tables show how many times each seed has won the NCAA Tournament and the seed of each champ for every tournament.
the national
- the Front Range
Don’t like this spot. Don’t want to face Houston.
www.foxsports.com
2024 NCAA Tournament projections: Bracketology and March Madness predictions | FOX Sports
Oregon (Pac-12) and NC State (ACC) each secured a bid, leaving St. John's and Seton Hall on the outside of Mike DeCourcy's latest NCAA Tournament projections.
www.foxsports.com
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Not bad. Only really wary of Houston there, maybe a little Alabama. Potential for rematches with FAU and Marquette. Would love FAU to take care of Houston. Gonzaga looks really weird that far down the bracket.Don’t like this spot. Don’t want to face Houston.
View attachment 31305
2024 NCAA Tournament projections: Bracketology and March Madness predictions | FOX Sports
Oregon (Pac-12) and NC State (ACC) each secured a bid, leaving St. John's and Seton Hall on the outside of Mike DeCourcy's latest NCAA Tournament projections.
GrayGhost77
- Centennial, CO
Nope. Don't want Houston but I'd take those first two round matchups all day.Don’t like this spot. Don’t want to face Houston.
View attachment 31305
2024 NCAA Tournament projections: Bracketology and March Madness predictions | FOX Sports
Oregon (Pac-12) and NC State (ACC) each secured a bid, leaving St. John's and Seton Hall on the outside of Mike DeCourcy's latest NCAA Tournament projections.
Illinicpa14
- Chicago
As a 4 we can’t draw Purdue by bracket rules so you have a 2/3 chance of getting UConn or Houston….
Houston and Iowa State would both be a big problem for us unless we have a good game plan for handling their ball pressure and traps. The level of pressure they put on the ball is so much more than other teams can bring and causes problems for teams with good ballhandling.
So we should be okay then… /s
- Status