Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread (April 2018)

[LBZ]

Lying to recruits about their role feels like the smart move until Mark Smith transfers away after one year.

There is ZERO evidence of any of this outside of blowing a message board post out of proportion. Besides, MS was given every chance in the world in addition to BU speaking highly of him all year long.

The Ramey's are intelligent enough to watch game film of BU teams over the past 4 years to know essentially how things are going to flow. Would think if anything, the conversations are circling around how soon Ramey can get to the NBA.

 

[Joel Goodson]

Lying to recruits about their role feels like the smart move until Mark Smith transfers away after one year.

If Ramey wants to be a Talor Battle-type ball dominator, Brad Underwood is lying to his face if he says that he can do that at Illinois. I am not a college basketball moralist, if it were me I would have Illinois lie, cheat and steal to whatever extent brought wins. But lying to a guy that can easily transfer, and whose father is an AAU impresario in one of our most important markets, is not a plan with a reasonable path to success.

lulz! Smith was given every opportunity to succeed as the lead guard, until it was patently clear that he doesn't have the requisite chops. And then he was given every opportunity as an off the ball guard. Same results. So, in your world, that's lying to his face? Sheesh!

 

[Megamind]

Lying to recruits about their role feels like the smart move until Mark Smith transfers away after one year.

If Ramey wants to be a Talor Battle-type ball dominator, Brad Underwood is lying to his face if he says that he can do that at Illinois. I am not a college basketball moralist, if it were me I would have Illinois lie, cheat and steal to whatever extent brought wins. But lying to a guy that can easily transfer, and whose father is an AAU impresario in one of our most important markets, is not a plan with a reasonable path to success.

Man, I’d hate for us to be the only program in the country that stretches the truth to kids to get a commitment! If we keep it up eventually we won’t even be able to get a single kid to come here. I can’t imagine another coach in the country lying to a kid to benefit their program, seeing as how morally upstanding college basketball is...

 

[BlindLoyalty]

I can’t imagine Ramey or Okoro wanting to play in the PAC10 over the B1G or SEC.
Eugene is a beautiful campus though.

Top players attend college to get to the NBA. The opening day rosters of the 2017-18 NBA season:

PAC 12 - 70 Players
BIG10 - 39 Players

That is w/ the B10 having two more teams. Every PAC12 school had a player on a NBA opening day roster. Only the ACC (also two more teams) had more NBA players on opening day rosters (89).

You want to get to the NBA you go to:

#1 ACC (only a slight edge)
#2 PAC12

 

[mattcoldagelli]

Lying to recruits about their role feels like the smart move until Mark Smith transfers away after one year.

I'm going to step up and do my part to strangle the budding "We lied to Mark Smith about his role and that's why he transferred" myth. He had a starting job and played double-digit minutes in every game but two.

The fact that Trent Frazier had the freshman year Mark thought he was going to have does not mean that we were dishonest.

 

[Emerson Bigguns]

ok - this will be more concise since it didn't post the first time. But - I've read that BU needs to tear down and rebuild, or there's a culture issue at Illinois, etc.

So - I wanted to re-visit last years roster:

Black - inherited player (turned pro)
Jordan - inherited player - best season in college BB last year
Lucas - inherited player (transferred)
Finke - inherited player (transferred)
Nichols - inherited player - an enigma - VERY good at his best

Frazier - inherited recruit that BU re-recruited
DWilliams - inherited recruit that BU re-recruited
MSmith - BU recruited (transferred)
Ebo, Alstork, Vesel - all BU recruits


I would argue that BU had plenty of influence on LAST YEARS roster - I think the "rebuild" and "teardown" arguments are straw men - this was BU's roster - he recruited 55% of last years team the remaining five players, three were at critical positions of need (PF/C) - then you have Lucas and Jordan, which were serviceable players for us last year.

Just my opinion - Go Illini

You could argue that he recruited them, but that's a very technical description. These were not players that he and his staff identified, and prioritized. Frazier, Williams, and Smith were either leans or committed already. They are good basketball players, and one thing for certain, regardless of who the coach was, the Illini needed more good players. With only 2-3 months to recruit, he didn't have time to be overly picky on the type of player he was pursuing. Obviously, Frazier was a great addition. I think Williams fits in well with what he wants to do. Smith never looked comfortable, especially on defense. Alstork was disappointing on all fronts. Ebo and Vessel were late adds were taller than the coach, which at that point was all you needed to get a scholarship offer. He was in scramble mode to fill his roster with players.
IMO, 2018 is Brad's first class.

 

[TCTORNADO]

lulz! Smith was given every opportunity to succeed as the lead guard, until it was patently clear that he doesn't have the requisite chops. And then he was given every opportunity as an off the ball guard. Same results. So, in your world, that's lying to his face? Sheesh!

Anthony Smith does not endorse this!!

 

[skyIdub]

Top players attend college to get to the NBA. The opening day rosters of the 2017-18 NBA season:

PAC 12 - 70 Players
BIG10 - 39 Players

That is w/ the B10 having two more teams. Every PAC12 school had a player on a NBA opening day roster. Only the ACC (also two more teams) had more NBA players on opening day rosters (89).

You want to get to the NBA you go to:

#1 ACC (only a slight edge)
#2 PAC12

How far back does this go? I was just referring to how awful it was this year.
Also I had AZ going all the way after a coin flip vs Nova so now it’s personal!

 

[Goldtop]

Lying to recruits about their role feels like the smart move until Mark Smith transfers away after one year.

If Ramey wants to be a Talor Battle-type ball dominator, Brad Underwood is lying to his face if he says that he can do that at Illinois. I am not a college basketball moralist, if it were me I would have Illinois lie, cheat and steal to whatever extent brought wins. But lying to a guy that can easily transfer, and whose father is an AAU impresario in one of our most important markets, is not a plan with a reasonable path to success.

All coaches tell recruits that they would like to give them the keys to the car, but they still have to earn it. Underwood did the same with Mark Smith. This is not lying to a recruit, and Smith was given all the opportunity in the world take a spot.

 

[TCTORNADO]

No we have an in home visit today with Ramey

Piper supposedly confirmed it on a radio show this a.m. I'm surprised that with as big of recruit as Ramey and 3 in homes today that the national guys aren't all this. Particularly, Bossi.

 

[skyIdub]

Lying to recruits about their role feels like the smart move until Mark Smith transfers away after one year.

If Ramey wants to be a Talor Battle-type ball dominator, Brad Underwood is lying to his face if he says that he can do that at Illinois. I am not a college basketball moralist, if it were me I would have Illinois lie, cheat and steal to whatever extent brought wins. But lying to a guy that can easily transfer, and whose father is an AAU impresario in one of our most important markets, is not a plan with a reasonable path to success.

I simply meant that the other possible PGs would be happy to, and very capable of, playing off the ball to allow more CR PG play, and that they would be very attractive options for assists and playmaking.

 

[Davo79]

Top players attend college to get to the NBA. The opening day rosters of the 2017-18 NBA season:

PAC 12 - 70 Players
BIG10 - 39 Players

That is w/ the B10 having two more teams. Every PAC12 school had a player on a NBA opening day roster. Only the ACC (also two more teams) had more NBA players on opening day rosters (89).

You want to get to the NBA you go to:

#1 ACC (only a slight edge)
#2 PAC12

If that's true then we have some clueless coaches in Pac12 considering the Pac12 outside of UCLA and Arizona never does a thing.

 

[Joel Goodson]

Anthony Smith does not endorse this!!

I'm sure he doesn't. Clearly, Underwood should have started Mark at the 1 & 2 spots. Even than, I doubt his dad would be satisfied.

 

[Second and Chalmers]

If that's true then we have some clueless coaches in Pac12 considering the Pac12 outside of UCLA and Arizona never does a thing.

 

[RIVERCITYCHIEF]

Agree, the Pac 10 is forgottonia of P5 college hoops.

They were just in the final four recently plus Phil knight has then some great facilities I'm sure. I hope he chooses Orange and Blue but I wouldn't underestimate Oregon vs us.

 

[mattcoldagelli]

Would you settle for "Smith felt mislead, for which there is some justification"?

I mean, now we're getting into the impossible realm of determining who feels what and with how much legitimacy.

He was certainly disappointed in that this did not go at all how he thought it was going to go, and in the end, that's really probably all that matters - people in the Metro East will hear that side of it, and our future recruits will hear our staff's side of it.

But we happy few, we band of brothers that slogged through every game of the 14-18 campaign this year, should have a pretty clear grasp on the fact that he was still getting lots of tick even after Trent burst onto the scene.

 

[rockillini]

Cool Alan Griffin graphic showing his ranking.

https://twitter.com/power_illini/status/981926867308630016

 

[NBB1979]

You could argue that he recruited them, but that's a very technical description. These were not players that he and his staff identified, and prioritized. Frazier, Williams, and Smith were either leans or committed already. They are good basketball players, and one thing for certain, regardless of who the coach was, the Illini needed more good players. With only 2-3 months to recruit, he didn't have time to be overly picky on the type of player he was pursuing. Obviously, Frazier was a great addition. I think Williams fits in well with what he wants to do. Smith never looked comfortable, especially on defense. Alstork was disappointing on all fronts. Ebo and Vessel were late adds were taller than the coach, which at that point was all you needed to get a scholarship offer. He was in scramble mode to fill his roster with players.
IMO, 2018 is Brad's first class.

trying to find some middle ground here - We can agree that Frazier and Williams were Groce commits that BU re-recruited upon his hire - right?

We can agree that he was hot and heavy for Mark Smith (who was a lean to IL upon his hire)

and we can agree that he (and only he) recruited Ebo, Matic, and Alstork

If you agree on those points - then BU recruited 55% of last years roster - sorry, but 2017 was in fact BU's first class. You can't discount the above facts.

It's ok to disagree though - that's what makes this country great.

Go Illini

 

[skyIdub]

I mean, my recruiting pitch in Ramey’s living room would be to show a tape of our bad team smoking Miznoz this year, a montage of the 05’ team, and finally a collection of dunks from the 88-89 Flyin’ Illini, then I would drop the remote sit back and stare at Ramey and his dad with a sinister grin.

 

[Deleted member 654622]

I can’t imagine Ramey or Okoro wanting to play in the PAC10 over the B1G or SEC.
Eugene is a beautiful campus though.

That Nike money run deep. Plus doesn't Oregon have Manute Bol's kid?

 

[TheFameProtector]

Man, I’d hate for us to be the only program in the country that stretches the truth to kids to get a commitment! If we keep it up eventually we won’t even be able to get a single kid to come here. I can’t imagine another coach in the country lying to a kid to benefit their program, seeing as how morally upstanding college basketball is...

Talk about missing the point. Sheesh :faint:

 

[WhiteRhino]

I mean, my recruiting pitch in Ramey’s living room would be to show a tape of our bad team smoking Miznoz this year, a montage of the 05’ team, and finally a collection of dunks from the 88-89 Flyin’ Illini, then I would drop the remote sit back and stare at Ramey and his dad with a sinister grin.

I would also show him 30,000 Illinois fans turning up for a *practice* when the Illini were in the Final Four in St. Louis.

And maybe a montage of all of the Braggin' Rights wins over the years

 

[SpoonRiverIllini]

Has this been confirmed anywhere other than message board rumors??

What more proof could you possibly need!

 

[TheFameProtector]

I mean, my recruiting pitch in Ramey’s living room would be to show a tape of our bad team smoking Miznoz this year, a montage of the 05’ team, and finally a collection of dunks from the 88-89 Flyin’ Illini, then I would drop the remote sit back and stare at Ramey and his dad with a sinister grin.

You're hired.

 

[robjilla]

That Nike money run deep. Plus doesn't Oregon have Manute Bol's kid?

Oregon has a top 5 class. Bol Bol and Louis King