Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread (November-December 2016)

[Obelix]

A couple of points:

First, a "gap" does not necessarily mean "starter" IMO. We are losing Thorne and Mav at C, we do need at least one more big, there are good minutes, and we do have at least 2 scholarships left (2 even assumes assumes no additional player leaves for any reason).

Second, there is an argument people often make that "it is very hard to find a quality HS recruit because of player A or B... let's find a quality 5th year player." If you have a problem selling to a HS recruit who has 4 years in front of him, why is easier to sell to to a quality 5th year who has just one year ahead of him? IMO, the quality 5th year players would be looking for immediate PT more so than the HS recruit. Or, you are reaching lower in the pool of talent of 5th year players.

 

[TCTORNADO]

MT and Starks ended up both not being "true" 5th year guys. In both cases, we invested an extra year of ships to get 1 year of playing time each. In the case of TA we invested 6 years of ships to get 4 years of playing time.
correction: Starks was not a 5th year, but a hardship transfer.

 

[WesterveltVictoryCigar]

I don't disagree, I think the key is the best chance & the underlying implication in that statement. Sam had starter or first off bench with starter minutes at Illinois (2nd or 3rd minutes of bigs). Next year we are likely selling a clear 4th in minutes at big. Our hole in the lineup to sell isn't as large in 2017, which is a good thing overall, but will make it harder to find another Sam McLaurin. Not that we shouldn't look or try, but think we need to try to find a freshman big first & not be counting on a 5th year

True, McLaurin did get a lot of playing time, but I think he's the type we could get. I don't think he necessarily came to UI with the thought he'd play as much as he did, and he was only 7th in minutes played.

 

[89illinigrad]

I think that, if we don't land one of our current big targets, Groce should take a chance on some diamond in the rough big, kinda like Mav was, in hopes they develop like Mav did.

Then he could either bank the last scholly or go after a 5th year transfer, with the hopes of landing another big for 2018.

 

[Newman]

why is easier to sell to to a quality 5th year who has just one year ahead of him? IMO, the quality 5th year players would be looking for immediate PT more so than the HS recruit. Or, you are reaching lower in the pool of talent of 5th year players.

Maturity and reality. I've talked to several transfers about these types of things and that's why I've always felt more confident about a 5th year guy coming in.

 

[ILL in IA]

I get the point, but I don't think the strategy has to be all in either way. We have wing covered, so you swing for the fences on Wilkes.

At big our position is much worse, we need another big in the system, I think 2. Let's make sure we land one that we believe has a chance to be serviceable by 2019, on the second one you can be pickier. If you happen to land Kiir/Epperson or a good big with the first one better yet, then you have more room to swing for the fences on the second. Cover your bases first, then you can swing for the fences.

So use a scholarship on a guy that might be good in 2 years, or a guy you know you can use right now and only use a scholarship for 1 year. Id rather have the help now.

 

[Kathy]

So use a scholarship on a guy that might be good in 2 years, or a guy you know you can use right now and only use a scholarship for 1 year. Id rather have the help now.

+1

 

[troym22]

There is a lot of talent in the 2018 class. I am okay with staying put if we miss on Kiir. We do need help now, but it could open the door to 1 or 2 top 100 recruits in 2018. A 5th year big would be the best option IMO if we don't land Kiir.

 

[CAHALL15]

There is a lot of talent in the 2018 class. I am okay with staying put if we miss on Kiir. We do need help now, but it could open the door to 1 or 2 top 100 recruits in 2018. A 5th year big would be the best option IMO if we don't land Kiir.

Wooten and Epperson would work well also, but it sounds like we were late to the Wooten party.

 

[Chris Yates]

If anyone cares about such things, the Twitter machine (per @Justin_Albers) is now reporting that Wilkes has informed our staff and the IU staff that he has chosen UCLA.

 

[Newman]

If anyone cares about such things, the Twitter machine (per @Justin_Albers) is now reporting that Wilkes has informed our staff and the IU staff that he has chosen UCLA.

What a tool. Sure it's not really a surprise but why ruin the kid's announcement this early?

 

[Hoppy2105]

If anyone cares about such things, the Twitter machine (per @Justin_Albers) is now reporting that Wilkes has informed our staff and the IU staff that he has chosen UCLA.

Good for him and good luck being a one and done.

 

[illinoisfan11]

What a tool. Sure it's not really a surprise but why ruin the kid's announcement this early?

No kidding. There's a reason he wanted to wait to announce.

 

[Chris Yates]

No kidding. There's a reason he wanted to wait to announce.

In fairness, Albers is an IU guy. They don't like fun.

 

[OldGreg]

Good for him and good luck being a one and done.

It's going to kind of be an uphill battle for him to do so and be anywhere near a lottery pick...shoot, probably even a first rounder. Obviously, a lot can change within the next two years but he's not listed on either NBADraft.net or DraftExpress. He's ranked anywhere between 15-20 in his own class and his class has a LOT of one and done type talent. There's a lot of hyped international talent as well. UCLA since 2012 has had 3 one and dones, none drafted higher than 13th. Shabazz Muhammed went 14th after an up and down year and was a consensus top 3 prospect. Zach Lavine went 13 and obviously showed more potential than his composite rank of 51 would indicate. Kevon Looney went 30th and was a consensus top 15 recruit. It will be interesting to see where he winds up, as I have thought all along he would need more than one year in college to develop his perimeter game and add some strength but more power to ya young Mr. Wilkes.

EDIT: on top of that, look at all the one and dones who dropped significantly last year. Skal Labissiere and Dejounte Murray barely stayed in the first round and Diamond Stone, Deyonta Davis, Stephen Zimmerman and Cheick Diallo all fell into the second round. I'm not saying he won't succeed but to try to claim to want to be a one and done before even starting your senior year of college and you're not even a top 5-10 recruit is pretty incredulous to me.

 

[Deleted member 10676]

That info -- about the staff's knowing -- has been on premium sites since late last week so it's out there. Albers just making official what most national guys have been saying without saying how they know.

 

[Obelix]

What a tool. Sure it's not really a surprise but why ruin the kid's announcement this early?

No big deal and it does not seem like the kid wanted to keep it a secret. It actually seems the opposite, that Wilkes wanted to break the news, especially given that his choice is not home favorite IU. Reduced backlash during the announcement, and he gets the marketing benefit of making an ESPN appearance, so best of both worlds.

 

[Obelix]

EDIT: on top of that, look at all the one and dones who dropped significantly last year. Skal Labissiere and Dejounte Murray barely stayed in the first round and Diamond Stone, Deyonta Davis, Stephen Zimmerman and Cheick Diallo all fell into the second round. I'm not saying he won't succeed but to try to claim to want to be a one and done before even starting your senior year of college and you're not even a top 5-10 recruit is pretty incredulous to me.

All made NBA rosters though, so it is highly unlikely it will deter future defections. Wilkes is a talent but he needs to add weight/strength before making the NBA.

 

[Greensboro]

True, McLaurin did get a lot of playing time, but I think he's the type we could get. I don't think he necessarily came to UI with the thought he'd play as much as he did, and he was only 7th in minutes played.

I would throw Ekey in there as well, he obviously wanted the opportunity to play at a higher level. But my point is basically the same as Obelix above, we have a harder sell for a 5th year player in 2017 because we are selling backup 5 vs. starter or backup 4 & 5. Not as much playing time and not as appealing as our past situations where the hole was bigger. With the big holes we've had, it has made it a much easier sell, it won't be as easy in 2017

 

[Greensboro]

So use a scholarship on a guy that might be good in 2 years, or a guy you know you can use right now and only use a scholarship for 1 year. Id rather have the help now.

The problem is the seasons don't tend to overlap and I'm skeptical we will end up with an impact 5th yr big, we have been spoiled because we have had huge holes to fill where our 5th year seniors knew major minutes were available. If you knew you could land another Thorne or McLaurin in 2017 great. I don't think that is a sure thing. So a no impact 5th yr senior or empty schollie vs a freshman that has a fair chance to develop and contribute in 2018 or 2019.

 

[sacraig]

That info -- about the staff's knowing -- has been on premium sites since late last week so it's out there. Albers just making official what most national guys have been saying without saying how they know.

That's an example of why I don't pay for premium sites. I think it's kind of a shame that we basically support a business model whose sole purpose is essentially to spoil a kid's moment if they can manage to get a scoop.

 

[StateFarmCenter]

That's an example of why I don't pay for premium sites. I think it's kind of a shame that we basically support a business model whose sole purpose is essentially to spoil a kid's moment if they can manage to get a scoop.

They haven't said that. They've just said he favors UCLA with nothing official.

Honestly though if he did tell the staffs, then he shouldnt set his announcement date so far out. Also it's then the staffs fault for leaking it.

 

[Calvin]

It's going to kind of be an uphill battle for him to do so

+1

He might know it though. Saying you want to be a one-n-done doesn't mean you're planning for it.

 

[WesterveltVictoryCigar]

I would throw Ekey in there as well, he obviously wanted the opportunity to play at a higher level. But my point is basically the same as Obelix above, we have a harder sell for a 5th year player in 2017 because we are selling backup 5 vs. starter or backup 4 & 5. Not as much playing time and not as appealing as our past situations where the hole was bigger. With the big holes we've had, it has made it a much easier sell, it won't be as easy in 2017

Agree, that's why we more likely to get a guy like McLaurin vs a guy like Thorne who was also looking at KU and UK.

 

[Deleted member 10676]

They haven't said that. They've just said he favors UCLA with nothing official.

Honestly though if he did tell the staffs, then he shouldnt set his announcement date so far out. Also it's then the staffs fault for leaking it.

Actually, they did say that. Groce and staff had been told it was UCLA on Thursday or Friday and that was posted by an IL writer on Saturday morning. I'm sure Indiana was told at the same time. But I agree with the rest. You tell the staffs, you're setting up a leak. I also agree with Obelix that in this instance, KW probably facilitated a leak so Indy fans would have a few weeks to cool down before the official ESPN announcement. He still has to play in Indianapolis this season. And that's a different animal from announcing against Illinois and playing a season in Chicago.