I don't think its as much about who the 9th man is as I think that we need another 4/5 that would be serviceable in an injury, foul trouble situation. I think we are thin in those positions. We have plenty of gaurds and wings.
Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread
Last paragraph is so true. Every freakin year fans go through the same ritual. You’d think it would dawn on them sooner or later. Not every kid is going to meet expectations.
I think that's accurate.
Jake Davis as the 9th man in 2025, played in 32 games and made 22 threes.
If Zens can play in 28 games and make 18 threes (and not be awful on defense), I'd be more than good with it. However, that's still a gamble, as he's a freshman and we need to see it manifest.
The 9th man's role, more than anything, is to just not be unplayable.
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I dont think that once we are out of the non conference that Zens or Brown see the floor other than a blow out. Thats why if we have a 9th man at all imo it would be someone not yet on the roster to help Z back up T and Mirk. Not in full Ben mode but to some degree. Especailly if someone is in foul trouble or out among our top 3 post players.
I think our PG/wings are down to primarily 5 guys and the post to 3 right now. Maybe Zens will challenge Morrilo for that 5th wing spot? If we add someone maybe the post expands to 4 guys unless Jason is that guy. I doubt Zens is there yet.
THIS. It's unrealistic to believe Zens / Brown will be ready enough to get on the court for 3/4 of our big ten games. We likely won't have that option.
As someone in some thread pointed out, we almost always go into each season over-rating our depth. Somehow we have wildly over-corrected that sentiment. Never change, Loyalty.
LOL no kidding, everyone getting worked up and frothing at the mouth here like we didn't just go to a F4 last year playing mainly 8 deep (and hey: we had injuries and still survived!!)
Also we have people now saying this team won't be any good if Jake Davis plays a significant role - didn't he just play a significant role on last year's F4 team?
(fully realize there is typically a lack of subject matter here in the summer, and everyone's bored)
Judging from this thread, I can envision every question for our insiders regarding summer workouts, buzz, etc... being about Brown, Zens, and the #9thMan.
I do kind of see both sides to the ongoing discussion, so my take would be this:
1) I think it's false to say we couldn't get anyone to fill the "9th man" spot if we really wanted to. We got Jake Davis for a similar role literally two years ago, who averaged 9.0 points per game on a 16-17 Mercer team (actually, he came in with the idea of being the 11th man, but Carey Booth was a bust and Ty didn't play).
2) HOWEVER, the key to that statement is if we really wanted to. The quality of that player would not be all too potent, by any means, but could potentially serve a #9thMan role. The question is, are you willing to hamper the freshman's path to PT in order to bring in that player? If neither Brown or Zens was on the roster, I'm willing to bet we would've added that piece. But we already have those developmental pieces... so does that staff see ENOUGH out of those guys, to say "we're good?" As of today, the answer seems like a yes.
I do kind of see both sides to the ongoing discussion, so my take would be this:
1) I think it's false to say we couldn't get anyone to fill the "9th man" spot if we really wanted to. We got Jake Davis for a similar role literally two years ago, who averaged 9.0 points per game on a 16-17 Mercer team (actually, he came in with the idea of being the 11th man, but Carey Booth was a bust and Ty didn't play).
2) HOWEVER, the key to that statement is if we really wanted to. The quality of that player would not be all too potent, by any means, but could potentially serve a #9thMan role. The question is, are you willing to hamper the freshman's path to PT in order to bring in that player? If neither Brown or Zens was on the roster, I'm willing to bet we would've added that piece. But we already have those developmental pieces... so does that staff see ENOUGH out of those guys, to say "we're good?" As of today, the answer seems like a yes.
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I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that Morillo will be ahead of Brown/Zens in minutes played. On the one hand, he's clearly talented and has the positional size our staff loves and is our best ball handler off the bench.
But if he or Andrej don't improve their three point shot over the summer, it's hard to see them playing extended minutes together. Which limits Morillo's upside since Andrej is expected to be in a 30+ mpg role.
And in this, the year of Keaton Wagler 2026, I'm certainly not going to discount the possibility that a relatively unheralded recruit can come in and earn more minutes than their ranking might suggest.
To me, the 8th man not the 9th man is the more interesting thing to watch this summer and fall.
Final note - Don’t expect Jake Davis to concede his minutes to any of our newcomers. According to Evan Miya, our best 5 man lineup last year was Tomi, Mirk, Andrej, Jake, and Keaton. I know it's not as simple as swapping Vaaks for Keaton. But when 80% of your optimal lineup returns from a Final Four run, it would probably be good to keep them on the floor together.
But if he or Andrej don't improve their three point shot over the summer, it's hard to see them playing extended minutes together. Which limits Morillo's upside since Andrej is expected to be in a 30+ mpg role.
And in this, the year of Keaton Wagler 2026, I'm certainly not going to discount the possibility that a relatively unheralded recruit can come in and earn more minutes than their ranking might suggest.
To me, the 8th man not the 9th man is the more interesting thing to watch this summer and fall.
Final note - Don’t expect Jake Davis to concede his minutes to any of our newcomers. According to Evan Miya, our best 5 man lineup last year was Tomi, Mirk, Andrej, Jake, and Keaton. I know it's not as simple as swapping Vaaks for Keaton. But when 80% of your optimal lineup returns from a Final Four run, it would probably be good to keep them on the floor together.
Agree he would be a good 4th big- but the insiders have been pretty clear we're not going after another transfer that it will be someone from Europe
It's also a touch sell to get a starter at Pepperdine to take a 10mpg role here - you can sell him on starting the year after and getting the development and Fletched up to make it to the league, but he would likely want a bigger role next year wherever he goes
I do not look at it as a 8 or 9 man rotation as a whole. I look at as a 5 man rotation at the Pg/wing spots, and you could break that down further to Pg and the 2/3. Then i look at the rotation in the post which right now likely only consists of 3 guys unless someone gets hurt then it would have to be iffy. I dont think we have 9 guys on the roster now that will play regular minutes since i dont see us playing 6 guys at 1-3 nor do i see more than 3 that will play much at the 4/5 unless injuries happen or its a blow out. We dont have anyone in that back up role that likely will play much besides Z. Last year we had 2 in Ben and Z. Thats what scary if someone misses time.
Maybe Jaktys is better on the glass and defending than we realize. I hope he is because he has the size to play the 4/5 if called upon. He didnt look bad at all on the glass before the injury he had. He has battled in practice vs our guys for two years now, played fine in his role when asked and gotten stronger with Fletch. He really is ahead of where he should be still as a third year freshman. I really hope his health is better and he can be servicable to just defend and rebound a few minutes if we need him to if someone goes down. I think we have plenty of guys who can score the ball. They addee Jason to come and work hard, ger str8nger in the gym and in practice and hopefully contribute as a Jr or Sr. Well, he has had set backs but they may end up working out in his favor since he is still just a freshman, i certainly stronger and familar with our program. Hopefully, he will surprise up if called upon.
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Gotta do what gives you the best chance to win.
Everyone’s here for one year, ESPECIALLY the young guys at the end of the bench. Their path to playing time is much greater going to a mid major and putting up numbers (and eventually transferring up)… than sticking it out buried on a top 10 team. Logically it’s what makes the most sense (unless you’re Keaton Wagler; likely never to be done again).
Have we not gotten a confirmation from Andrej yet?
Not at all likely at the wing with Vaaks,Andre, Coleman, Jake , and Morrilo ahead of them now they may shine and surpass Morrilo or Jake at backing up the 3 role behind Andre but thats unlikely and i dont see Zens at the 1,2,4 or 5 so if they play its at the 3 where they are likely buried 4th in line backing up Andre.
Zens is listed as a power forward.
Not when i google him. 247, ESPN, and others have him as a Small Forward at 6'7" 215lbs. Illinois just says Forward. I dont think he was brought here to play power forward here either. Who ever that is that comes in after Mirk will have a lot more length and size than than that and be built more like Mirk at 6'9" 255lb. We had enough of Hawkins and even Ben being pushed around by true 4s. . Its foolish to think Zens can defend the power 4 in the B10.
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It's true, but again, Z didn't come back to play 17 mpg again... Mirk will play 30. (29.5 last year) The twins will split the other 50 low post minutes.
Tomi had the highest foul rate per 40 minutes of the 3 bigs at 3.2 last season. They just don't foul much...
Could we use another big body? Sure. Again, it's just a tough sell right now because there is no clear path to significant/if any minutes.
No one is going to expect Zens to play major minutes at the 4. Could he, if the game situation calls for it? (opponent goes small) Maybe... JJ is likely the "break glass in case of emergency" big guy.
"Plan A" will be some combo of the IC's on the court for the whole 40 minutes.
Joel Goodson
- it's all ball bearings, nowadays
and I'm a center