St. Louis Cardinals 2021

#1      
Colorado Springs, CO
Thought I would start the new season thread.

Still not much to talk about. Flaherty wants $3.9 million in arbitration and the Cardinals only offered $3.0 million. I see this going to a hearing. I also really don't see Flaherty signing a long term deal with us.

I'm still upset about Wong being released. If he isn't resigned it means more deteriorated Carpenter at 3rd and more deteriorated Fowler in right. What a product ownership is putting on the field for the fans. Who really wants to go watch that in person?
 
#2      
Cary, IL
I have no idea what is going on with FA signings, or lack thereof for most of the league. I would think that it would be a great time to "buy low" on some good talent. The division is there for the taking. Bring back Wong on a lower 3 year deal, sign a platoon outfielder that can hit right handed pitching (Joc Pederson?). Re-sign Wainwright to a similar deal that he had signed the past two years. I don't know what to do about Yadi, certainly don't want to pay him $10M+ for each of the next 2 years. I would likely match his best offer, but I doubt anyone else will offer top dollar to an aging catcher, whose bat has slowed. If they could pick up a 3rd baseman, that can hit/field, instead of signing Wong, I would be fine with that too. Especially on a short term deal, since Gorman should be up in 2022/23.
 
#3      
the Front Range
i agree with your assessments Illwinsagain. Wong is a guy you can build an infield around and would like to keep him for that reason. The fans are so fed up right now with Mo. He needs to win the fans back over with a strong plan for the next two season otherwise some fans will walk away. I'll be honest, I'm frustrated. If Yadi walks, I get it. It Waino walks, I get it. but show some fresh blood to get excited about. we are the only team that hasn't made a move this offseason - that's Crazy!
 
#4      
Agree with all the frustrations. Not that Mo is without blame, I'd rest the majority of the blame with ownership here. I think DeWitt has shown an increasing reluctance to pay what it takes to compete, and has been crying poor for years, even as the value of the team and related assets has skyrocketed. I'm getting concerned that it would take missing the playoffs a few years in a row or a significant drop in attendance (post-covid of course) to get ownership to change approach. I think DeWitt would be happy nabbing a wild card spot and making an early exit every year as long as the profits are ok.
 
#5      
Dewitt does come off looking cheap but Cards have spent bad money on Fowler and Carp. Good money on Goldy and paid Yadi well. Other questionable moves include Miller, Holland and another pitcher I can’t recall. How about Randy? Don’t go to Vegas with Mo!

I think one should keep their eyes on Flaherty. Will he sign an extension or is he looking to get out of St. Louis? Nothing drives a guy like him crazier than an offense incapable of getting him 18-20 wins per year.
 
#6      
Cary, IL
I have to admit, I thought that Fowler may be a bit of an overpay, but seemed necessary (I was wrong). The Carp extension, just didn't get it at the time. It wasn't necessary. Bad timing, worse results.
 
#8      
Dewitt does come off looking cheap but Cards have spent bad money on Fowler and Carp. Good money on Goldy and paid Yadi well. Other questionable moves include Miller, Holland and another pitcher I can’t recall. How about Randy? Don’t go to Vegas with Mo!

I think one should keep their eyes on Flaherty. Will he sign an extension or is he looking to get out of St. Louis? Nothing drives a guy like him crazier than an offense incapable of getting him 18-20 wins per year.
I think the system underpaying him in his early years is more annoying to him. While he says that he doesn't fault St Lou for following the rules as they are currently set up, he is a bit miffed they have not given him what he feels he is really worth. ($3 mil vs $3.9 mil this year as an example. That's Alex Wood money.) He will hit free agency and go to whoever pays him the most money. He wants to make up for all those lost years.
 
#9      
Cardinals get first chance at giving him more money through an extension. Otherwise I believe he has one or two years of arbitration left. If they offer a favorable extension and he declines, I think it might say something about how he feels about StL.
 
#10      
LIke to see a big bat come onboard.....just don't see the value in signing Adam W., unless for low ball money. Wong...yes, I'll miss the defense, need a bigger bat though.....
 
#11      
Doesn't it seem like we are the only team not circling any free agents? We have some holes to fill.
 
#12      
Cary, IL
It appears that there are 4(?) teams being active right now. Really, 3 holes to fill. An outfielder than can hit right handed pitching that can platoon with Bader/O'Neil, is there someone on the roster now? A 2nd or 3rd baseman. Catcher, either sign Molina, or someone else. I would like Wainwright back, on a similar deal to the past 2 years, but, eventually, he will retire, and there is depth in the pitching department.
 
#16      
Cary, IL
I thought that this was going to be the Arenado rumor that Google has on my phone. Apparently, the Cards and Rockies are talking, again. Without any details, it concerns me. It is a HUGE contract, he's 29 now. So, the next few years should be fine, mid 30's may not be good to be paying $35M. But what will they have to give up, what can they "give" back (Carp?).

ps- Happy to have Waino back at a reasonable price. Worried that Yadi may get paid too much to come back, and force his way into the lineup 5/6 days a week. OK with Wong, at the right price.
 
#17      
Colorado Springs, CO
It's interesting. He is getting older but as you said he should be find for a few years. We have to get rid of fowler. Somehow someway. And Yadi needs to understand his body will not hold up.

Wong should have been a no Brainerd in my opinion. If 1 WAR is 8 or 9 million and Wong is about 3 WAR then his value exceeded his cost. I get Edman could replace some of the value at a lower cost but that then means we are playing Carpenter at 3rd, Fowler in Right, etc. We take Edmans value away at that point. I know some people are not fans of Wong, but I love his fight and flair (not Ric). He always gives his all.
 
#18      
Cary, IL
It's interesting. He is getting older but as you said he should be find for a few years. We have to get rid of fowler. Somehow someway. And Yadi needs to understand his body will not hold up.

Wong should have been a no Brainerd in my opinion. If 1 WAR is 8 or 9 million and Wong is about 3 WAR then his value exceeded his cost. I get Edman could replace some of the value at a lower cost but that then means we are playing Carpenter at 3rd, Fowler in Right, etc. We take Edmans value away at that point. I know some people are not fans of Wong, but I love his fight and flair (not Ric). He always gives his all.
I don't expect the trade to happen, but an infield with Goldschmidt, Wong, DeJong and Arenado is filthy good! Pick up some ground ball pitchers....
 
#19      
Nolan Arenado had been my favorite player in baseball for awhile. I would love to have him on the Cardinals. I think this is possible if they take some money back in the short run (Fowler, Carp or Carlos). They’d surely want Gorman and a pitcher with upside. Make it happen!