The Illinois AD Search

Second and Chalmers · Nov 30, 2015

danielb927 said:
So wait, now there was tireless work and bold, visionary leadership? Earlier you said our history was a good-faith effort that built something ugly, rickety, and barely serviceable.

That was referring to the sports programs. Other aspects of campus have been more fortunate.

If you found those adjectives to be a bit much, clearly you haven't spent enough time in Gregory Hall. (The old Lincoln Hall was even worse, but they've fixed that now from what I understand).

dmac279 · Nov 30, 2015

Second and Chalmers said:
You know, people's "oh, there goes Illinois again" attitude about this is making me really upset today. I hate Ron Guenther with every fiber of my being, but to compare this to anything he did, or any other event in our history, is to slur and insult the hardworking, honest, good-faith efforts of everyone that has built this ugly, rickety, but to this point seaworthy vessel that is Illinois Athletics.

There is no analog in the history of modern major-conference athletics for what has happened here over the past month. None. This is the single biggest exhibition of incompetence in the history of commercial athletic endeavor. This has never been and will never be exceeded or even approached in any of our lifetimes.

I don't know what else to say. The English language does not contain descriptors severe enough for this.

No one should even consider giving our school a passing thought, let alone one red cent of their hard earned income in the aftermath of this, not for sports, not for academics, not for merchandise, not for anything. The University doesn't deserve to exist if it can't do better than this.

The truth

matt1all · Nov 30, 2015

Second and Chalmers said:
That was referring to the sports programs. Other aspects of campus have been more fortunate.

If you found those adjectives to be a bit much, clearly you haven't spent enough time in Gregory Hall. (The old Lincoln Hall was even worse, but they've fixed that now from what I understand).

Yeah Lincoln is nice now. But As my professor says about renovating old Altgeld hall "every year we are always on the first year of an 8 year plan"

brosox · Nov 30, 2015

LurkLongandProsper said:
There is no competence behind the scenes. Let us not pretend. Rutgers showed us how you handle an AD hire in the midst of a coaching carousel. We showed how not to do it. It's embarrassing, let's not pretend it is anything but embarrassing.

Does Rutgers have an interim chancellor? A president who has been on the job for only about a year? Face it, the UI is a complete mess at the top and the powers that be are looking to get the administrative situation in order before they tackle the football issue. In this respect, the decisions to extend Cubit and to not immediately name a new athletic director were not football decisions at all. Instead, they were organizational decisions pertaining to the university's structural hierarchy. From a strictly football standpoint, it stinks. However, if one thinks about it rationally, it makes perfect sense. The university can say what it wants about a search committee to hire a new athletic director. But, I think it all starts at the top and that means we won't likely won't see any progress in hiring a new athletic director until after the professorial types agree on a permanent chancellor. That way the permanent chancellor can have a say in the hiring of the AD, and the permanent AD can have a say in the hiring of a new football coach. In all honesty, it makes all of this stuff easier to swallow if one simply realizes that these are university decisions, and not football decisions, that are being made at this point.

Second and Chalmers · Nov 30, 2015

brosox said:
That way the permanent chancellor can have a say in the hiring of the AD, and the permanent AD can have a say in the hiring of a new football coach.

Which of course would all be not just possible, but timely and ideal if it happened in December 2018 after year 3 of our new coach's tenure, or failing that, year 4 of Bill Cubit's 5-year deal.

But alas, all public statements indicate that our interim AD will indeed hire a new AD that will be in place only a few months before his (or her) new boss is hired.

So lets be very clear here: what is being exhibited is NOT patience regarding the organizational structure, but insane, hysterical IMPATIENCE with respect to ousting Bill Cubit after only one more season, if not even sooner than that.

The "gotta have your chain of command in order" justification is a nice soundbite, but is totally, 100% factually incongruent with where we currently stand. It is a falsehood that should be disregarded by anyone interested in reality.

thatguy92 · Nov 30, 2015

To "go on the record", I do not believe that the new AD will be named soon. And when he or she comes, I do not believe they will immediately buy out Cubit as it will likely too late in the winter or spring to do so. That said, every single person that has full knowledge of this situation 100% agrees this is the right move for the University as a whole, and that includes several combined decades upon decades of athletic administration knowledge. Unfortunately, nearly nobody (including Ryan or almost anyone else of the Chicago media) fully is aware of the situation as a whole, and yes, it is unique to any other school including Rutgers.

Second and Chalmers · Nov 30, 2015

thatguy92 said:
it is unique to any other school

The day people with power and influence stop peddling this lie is the day I embrace my alma mater once again.

Deleted member 8405 · Nov 30, 2015

thatguy92 said:
To "go on the record", I do not believe that the new AD will be named soon. And when he or she comes, I do not believe they will immediately buy out Cubit as it will likely too late in the winter or spring to do so. That said, every single person that has full knowledge of this situation 100% agrees this is the right move for the University as a whole, and that includes several combined decades upon decades of athletic administration knowledge. Unfortunately, nearly nobody (including Ryan or almost anyone else of the Chicago media) fully is aware of the situation as a whole, and yes, it is unique to any other school including Rutgers.

What is the situation as a whole?

danielb927 · Nov 30, 2015

Second and Chalmers said:
That was referring to the sports programs. Other aspects of campus have been more fortunate.

If you found those adjectives to be a bit much, clearly you haven't spent enough time in Gregory Hall. (The old Lincoln Hall was even worse, but they've fixed that now from what I understand).

I spent plenty of time in MEB and Greg Hall, both comparable to the old classrooms out here at Stanford, which seems to be doing alright in terms of reputation. That's the same MEB that's about to be renovated thanks to a 12 million dollar gift from the CEO of Foxconn, in the department that's on a massive faculty hiring surge, in the college that's co-founding an engineering-based medical school and fundraising for a 100 million dollar undergraduate scholarship endowment.

The recent decisions in the athletic arena are not a harbinger for the failure of the university, nor should they be treated as such. Of course other schools are gunning for the top, just as they have been for the last century. I'm not sure what your goal is in trying to win people over to the belief that UIUC is doomed, but would be interested in finding out. We're certainly not going to continue to advance ourself as an institution without a lot of effort, so maybe if you make a convincing enough argument against giving any support, you'll help your own projections come true.

MoCoMdIllini · Nov 30, 2015

IlliniGuy said:
What is the situation as a whole?

I read that as potential lawsuits.

Second and Chalmers · Nov 30, 2015

danielb927 said:
I'm not sure what your goal is in trying to win people over to the belief that UIUC is doomed, but would be interested in finding out. We're certainly not going to continue to advance ourself as an institution without a lot of effort, so maybe if you make a convincing enough argument against giving any support, you'll help your own projections come true.

I mean, aren't you listening to our "insiders"? If Illinois ever tries to succeed at anything John Cullerton is going to jump out from behind a bush and beat us senseless with a sack full of doorknobs.

Tumbleweeds of red tape breezing across the dystopian, post-apocalyptic hellscape where Wright St. once ran. Only us, the prophecy read. Only us.

Soxfreak64 · Nov 30, 2015

MoCoMdIllini said:
I read that as potential lawsuits.

I can't find a lawsuit with any legs in this situation, though I'm certainly not a lawyer.

Who would sue if they hired a new AD? Who would sue if they fired Cubit? Hired a new coach? Should the fans bring a class-action lawsuit against the university for gross negligence?

I mean, there certainly could be, I just don't see it.

danielb927 · Nov 30, 2015

Second and Chalmers said:
I mean, aren't you listening to our "insiders"? If Illinois ever tries to succeed at anything John Cullerton is going to jump out from behind a bush and beat us senseless with a sack full of doorknobs.

Tumbleweeds of red tape breezing across the dystopian, post-apocalyptic hellscape where Wright St. once ran. Only us, the prophecy read. Only us.

:noidea:

MoCoMdIllini · Nov 30, 2015

Soxfreak64 said:
I can't find a lawsuit with any legs in this situation, though I'm certainly not a lawyer.

Who would sue if they hired a new AD? Who would sue if they fired Cubit? Hired a new coach? Should the fans bring a class-action lawsuit against the university for gross negligence?

I mean, there certainly could be, I just don't see it.

I'm certainly no attorney and I have 0 inside info. I think Beckman had rattled the legal saber. If Thomas is happily bought out, maybe there are no other possibilities on that front.

I have doubts they are concerned about public image.

Not sure what else "overall situation" could entail.

Second and Chalmers · Nov 30, 2015

Oh, also this

thatguy92 said:
every single person that has full knowledge of this situation 100% agrees this is the right move

sigint · Nov 30, 2015

thatguy92 said:
To "go on the record", I do not believe that the new AD will be named soon. And when he or she comes, I do not believe they will immediately buy out Cubit as it will likely too late in the winter or spring to do so. That said, every single person that has full knowledge of this situation 100% agrees this is the right move for the University as a whole, and that includes several combined decades upon decades of athletic administration knowledge. Unfortunately, nearly nobody (including Ryan or almost anyone else of the Chicago media) fully is aware of the situation as a whole, and yes, it is unique to any other school including Rutgers.

What could be so uniquely bad about the situation to put the main revenue generator for the entire DIA in position to fail for the next half decade or so? And, this doesn't even address the 2 year contract elephant in the room.

HerbertFish · Nov 30, 2015

I wouldnt fool yourselves on the academic side either. Illinois' academic reputation has taken a brutal hit over the last decade, largely to incompetence by the administration staff at the higher levels. Yes, the engineering school has so far largely been unscathed but they are the exception to the rule.

Soxfreak64 · Nov 30, 2015

sigint said:
What could be so uniquely bad about the situation to put the main revenue generator for the entire DIA in position to fail for the next half decade or so? And, this doesn't even address the 2 year contract elephant in the room.

That's what irks me the most about this entire situation. 2 YEARS?!

If you're going to hire Cubit, there is absolutely no reason you couldn't give the man a 4 year contract with the same amount of guaranteed money. I imagine he'd be happier. It'd be easier to recruit. The whole "2 Year" aspect makes no sense at all.

Second and Chalmers · Nov 30, 2015

sigint said:
What could be so uniquely bad about the situation to put the main revenue generator for the entire DIA in position to fail for the next half decade or so? And, this doesn't even address the 2 year contract elephant in the room.

Nor does it address the decision about and timing of Mike Thomas' firing. This also coming from the same person making veiled hints about the administration having an ace up their sleeve for an AD hire as early as ten days ago.

This is someone who is giving us post-hoc justifications for failed policies, probably at the behest of some of those responsible. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to try and silence ThatGuy whatsoever, and I encourage him to keep telling us what he knows. I am interested in and appreciative of his posts, but only to contemplate the depths of the delusions of our leadership.

Stevegarbs · Nov 30, 2015

Second and Chalmers said:
If you think this cluelessness and apathy won't eventually infect the engineering program, you're kidding yourself. Illinois didn't just sprout out of the ground as a world leader in engineering. It has emerged that way over the course of decades thanks to tireless work and bold and visionary leadership.

Plenty of competitors are coming for that throne.

Go away. If you are so full of hate and bitterness why do you bother posting on this forum?

Lake Camelot · Nov 30, 2015

Stevegarbs said:
Go away. If you are so full of hate and bitterness why do you bother posting on this forum?

I can answer for me. I am still withdrawing. It is hard for me to decide if I am mad enough to try and force myself to not watch anymore. But I am definitely mad. I am still hoping for a change that won't come. Maybe some one with big money feels the way I do.

This is being run by people that don't know what they are doing.

Illinvictus · Nov 30, 2015

Illinois Football: Rock bottom is stability, though not ideal.

thatguy92 · Nov 30, 2015

Let us envision three scenarios, all of which assume that there will not be a new AD by the end of the year (because it seems fairly obvious at this point that there will not be one). At this point, it is too late to hire a football coach for a new AD when he arrives.

1.) Try to hire a new head coach with the interim AD. While some people say that this is how Illinois hires the man to lead us to a future of continuos 6-9 win seasons, I would say that with as many vacancies as are available, this is a gamble at best. Best case scenario, you hire someone like Dino Babers and you achieve that desired result. Worst case scenario, you hire someone who is not a very good coach and picks you only because they were not in line for jobs like Mizzou, South Carolina, Miami, USC, etc. You have four more years of results similar to Beckman, and the AD job becomes less attractive to potential candidates who do not like the hire. Additionally, this could immediately saddle the school with another big potential buyout if the AD is not happy.

2.) Extend Cubit for 3-5 years. While this may seem like the "consistency" that most people are arguing for, it would also seem that most Illini fans feel that 3-5 years of Cubit would likely bring several more five or six win seasons with an offense that is not very inspiring. Best case scenario, five years of six or seven wins followed by retirement. Worst case scenario, things fall back to three to five win seasons and the program fades back into total irrelevancy or a buyout is once again on the books.

3.) Extend Cubit for 2 years. In reality, a two year extension is almost certainly a one year extension with a low second year buyout unless he achieves something incredible next season. It is low cost and allows total flexibility for the next AD. While it is fairly likely the vegas o/u for wins next season will be around 4, one must remember that the same odds were given to the Illini this year, and they ended up almost reaching six regular season wins. Some arguments against this are that recruiting will fall off, but the past few classes have all been 10-12th in the conference anyways and it is only one class. Additionally, people are saying many will transfer and the staff will leave, but most of the players seem to like Cubit better than Beckman, and it's not as if the current staff is exactly full of the Vince Lombardi types. Best case scenario, a year of clear improvements, followed by a 3-5 year extension on top of the current second year of the contract so he can recruit with a better backing behind him. Worst case scenario, three games are won, fans are disinterested, and then a new coach is hired by the new AD and things move forward with a total cleaning of house. And if Beckman can take the team from 2 wins to 6 in three years, I think it wouldn't take much to achieve the same results by the new coach.

Just my $.02

HerbertFish · Nov 30, 2015

Extend Cubit for 4 years and don't change a thing about the buyout. This should have been done in the VERY LEAST. What is Cubit going to do, say no? At least he'd then have the perception of being our actual coach.

Second and Chalmers · Nov 30, 2015

thatguy92 said:
Let us envision three scenarios, all of which assume that there will not be a new AD by the end of the year (because it seems fairly obvious at this point that there will not be one). At this point, it is too late to hire a football coach for a new AD when he arrives.

1.) Try to hire a new head coach with the interim AD. While some people say that this is how Illinois hires the man to lead us to a future of continuos 6-9 win seasons, I would say that with as many vacancies as are available, this is a gamble at best. Best case scenario, you hire someone like Dino Babers and you achieve that desired result. Worst case scenario, you hire someone who is not a very good coach and picks you only because they were not in line for jobs like Mizzou, South Carolina, Miami, USC, etc. You have four more years of results similar to Beckman, and the AD job becomes less attractive to potential candidates who do not like the hire. Additionally, this could immediately saddle the school with another big potential buyout if the AD is not happy.

2.) Extend Cubit for 3-5 years. While this may seem like the "consistency" that most people are arguing for, it would also seem that most Illini fans feel that 3-5 years of Cubit would likely bring several more five or six win seasons with an offense that is not very inspiring. Best case scenario, five years of six or seven wins followed by retirement. Worst case scenario, things fall back to three to five win seasons and the program fades back into total irrelevancy or a buyout is once again on the books.

3.) Extend Cubit for 2 years. In reality, a two year extension is almost certainly a one year extension with a low second year buyout unless he achieves something incredible next season. It is low cost and allows total flexibility for the next AD. While it is fairly likely the vegas o/u for wins next season will be around 4, one must remember that the same odds were given to the Illini this year, and they ended up almost reaching six regular season wins. Some arguments against this are that recruiting will fall off, but the past few classes have all been 10-12th in the conference anyways and it is only one class. Additionally, people are saying many will transfer and the staff will leave, but most of the players seem to like Cubit better than Beckman, and it's not as if the current staff is exactly full of the Vince Lombardi types. Best case scenario, a year of clear improvements, followed by a 3-5 year extension on top of the current second year of the contract so he can recruit with a better backing behind him. Worst case scenario, three games are won, fans are disinterested, and then a new coach is hired by the new AD and things move forward with a total cleaning of house. And if Beckman can take the team from 2 wins to 6 in three years, I think it wouldn't take much to achieve the same results by the new coach.

Just my $.02

Yes, those are the accurate weak sauce justifications. As long as we're retreading territory, you're gonna need to add the parts about how Mike Thomas "made his own bed", and if you could construct a slightly more thorough political bogeyman as an explanation for a 21 day AD search that hasn't even made it out of the hangar yet, that would probably help your cause.

The Illinois AD Search

Second and Chalmers

dmac279

matt1all

brosox

Second and Chalmers

thatguy92

Second and Chalmers

Deleted member 8405

Guest

danielb927

Orange Krush Class of 2013

MoCoMdIllini

Second and Chalmers

Soxfreak64

danielb927

Orange Krush Class of 2013

MoCoMdIllini

Second and Chalmers

sigint

HerbertFish

Soxfreak64

Second and Chalmers

Stevegarbs

Lake Camelot

Illinvictus

thatguy92

HerbertFish

Second and Chalmers