Has done amazing things at Grand Canyon University as it jumped to Division 1. Assistant coaching experience in NBA and the Colangelo connection
2017 Coaching Carousel
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Has done amazing things at Grand Canyon University as it jumped to Division 1. Assistant coaching experience in NBA and the Colangelo connection
Maybe tomorrow :thumb:
You're not wrong. I think he'd be better than Groce, but tonight's 20+ point loss does make me feel sour towards him as does his 1st round exit last year with a top 3 NBA pick and arguably another first rounder in Rabb.
I would not say subpar, but not really good either. But he is able to recruit some highly ranked talent, without the big name school tag. If he can do that at Illinois, he will be successful.
People preach X's and O'x but in reality dream about those 5* recruits coming our way.
I would not say subpar, but not really good either. But he is able to recruit some highly ranked talent, without the big name school tag. If he can do that at Illinois, he will be successful.
People preach X's and O'x but in reality dream about those 5* recruits coming our way.
On the court success is what I'm dreaming of, whether that is delivered via 3* or 5*
Thanks for bringing this in.
The fear people have of Cuonzo and the Purdue-Weber-Keady-ball sticks out like a sore thumb. Maybe we'd get another 38-33 Penn St game. If you didn't know better you'd think Archie was from the same tree. And then there's Tony Bennett - wow.
On the court success is what I'm dreaming of, whether that is delivered via 3* or 5*
If Martin delivers 3*, unfortunately you will likely keep dreaming of that on court success.
If Martin delivers 3*, unfortunately you will likely keep dreaming of that on court success.
I never said I'm a Cuonzo guy (hint, I'm not, he's maybe my #4 right now) -- just that I don't care about the recruiting as long as we win games
Never said you were, just that if Martin gets the job, he would need to bring high level talent to win. I like the prospect of Martin, not my top choice but would be welcome. I do not believe he is such a sure thing for the job though as other believe.
Part of what makes hiring a coach so difficult is that no two programs are the same. Certain styles play better in certain conferences. Certain personalities fit better in different regions and at different schools. You can literally work the numbers in favor or against nearly every possibility regardless of your programs standing. Heck, duke will eventually replace K with a guy many on this board would argue is not qualified for Illinois. I'm choosing to put more weight on positive attributes at this point. Martin, Keats, and Musselman all have different strengths. It's a matter of personal preference I think.
Whitman has a challenging job here. But that's why he gets paid.
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Whitman has a challenging job here. But that's why he gets paid.
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mhuml32
- Cincinnati, OH
This would be true for everyone. The problem is recruiting correlates with on-court success.
Let's go after Bill Self. He has the Kansas thing out of his system, and he has sort of hit a ceiling there. Looks like his legacy is going to be just another very successful coach at Kansas. He was doing something special at Illinois. I know we appreciated him, but probably not enough after Lou and Lon. He's young enough to still be the best ever at Illinois. We will give him a statue, doubt if Kansas does that. New AD with a little charm, maybe some of those burnt bridges have left enough foundation to start again. You might think its crazy, but you would have said the same about Lovie. Remember those days when we thought we were being robbed in getting a 3 or 4 seed in the NCAA?
Here is the thing though. Would you rather win 2 or 3 championships at a blue blood while going to several more Final Fours or have a statue because you won one championship at Illinois? I'd probably choose the former. I may not be the best coach in the history of that program, but I will have had a lot of fun while I was there.
I agree with this. I think Cuonzo is a safe hire, but am not a believer in the upside. Many are high on his recruiting, but the underlying implication there is that his elite recruiting potential here will bump him higher than what he can achieve at other stops, and he's landed multiple 5* guys in his time at Cal and hasn't really done anything amazing with it yet. It is of course early in his tenure there, so maybe it is heading towards more, but you can also make an argument that the lack of playing with a roster entirely of his construction is somewhat of a concern.
Big win for Keatts last night, winning on the road at College of Charleston who was also 6-0 in conference to take sole possession of first in the CAA. They're getting close to sneaking into the Top 25.
If you want to pick a bone with his resume? There isn't some big impressive scalp on it. His best win ever might be @St. Bonaventure. They hung around with Duke last year in the tournament (which, full disclosure, is the only Keatts game I've ever watched), but they don't have some big win to point at.
Contrast that with Kermit Davis who has beaten a bunch of decent-to-good P5 teams at MTSU, plus obviously the upset of MSU last year.
My problem with Davis, other than geographic fit? He relies heavily on Jucos. Not sure that translates here.
LSU should fire Johnny Jones and hire Kermit.
If you want to pick a bone with his resume? There isn't some big impressive scalp on it. His best win ever might be @St. Bonaventure. They hung around with Duke last year in the tournament (which, full disclosure, is the only Keatts game I've ever watched), but they don't have some big win to point at.
Contrast that with Kermit Davis who has beaten a bunch of decent-to-good P5 teams at MTSU, plus obviously the upset of MSU last year.
My problem with Davis, other than geographic fit? He relies heavily on Jucos. Not sure that translates here.
LSU should fire Johnny Jones and hire Kermit.
illinitrav
- NW Suburbs
I second this.
262-17 at Hargrave Military Academy
Then brought in at Louisville as lead recruiter, where he had a ton of success. The one concern here is that he was lead recruiter during the scandal, however he was never directly linked to any wrongdoing.
Then he goes to UNCW where he takes over a team that had gone 10-20 and 9-23 the two years prior to his takeover. He shows immediate improvement going 18-14 and winning a share of the conference title. He is named CAA Coach of the Year.
In year two, the improvement continues. UNCW goes 25-8, wins the regular season and tournament championship and then loses to Duke by single digits. Keatts is once again named CAA Coach of the Year again.
This year, off to an 18-2 start. Last night, UNCW went on the road and beat their main contender in the conference, Charleston.
I'm resigning myself to the fact that we probably won't shell out $3MM-$4MM + and buyout for a basketball coach; either we won't get the chance to (people say no) or Whitman just won't have the capital with the boosters after Lovie.
So I'm pushing all my chips in on the Kevin Keatts bet.
- He can coach. Multiple HS championships and turned UNCW from a punching bag into an actual basketball team (relatively) in only 3 seasons.
- Has high level recruiting experience and success with Louisville.
- Coaches an up tempo offense that would be fun to watch and appeal to high level talent coming out of Chicago
- Elephant in the room, he's black and relatively young. Which, forgive my simple thinking, should give him a leg up getting his foot in the door with the AAA rated talent coming out of Chicago. Really, Goofy Brucie and Kevin Keatts knock on Derek Rose's door in 2006; knowing nothing about the two, who's getting the chance to talk first?
If you try to imagine what the ideal future career college coaching legend looks like, he'd look an awful lot like Kevin Keatts. It's a risk, as all mid major coaches would be, but I'd take him over the Cuonzo Martin's of the world any day.
So I'm pushing all my chips in on the Kevin Keatts bet.
- He can coach. Multiple HS championships and turned UNCW from a punching bag into an actual basketball team (relatively) in only 3 seasons.
- Has high level recruiting experience and success with Louisville.
- Coaches an up tempo offense that would be fun to watch and appeal to high level talent coming out of Chicago
- Elephant in the room, he's black and relatively young. Which, forgive my simple thinking, should give him a leg up getting his foot in the door with the AAA rated talent coming out of Chicago. Really, Goofy Brucie and Kevin Keatts knock on Derek Rose's door in 2006; knowing nothing about the two, who's getting the chance to talk first?
If you try to imagine what the ideal future career college coaching legend looks like, he'd look an awful lot like Kevin Keatts. It's a risk, as all mid major coaches would be, but I'd take him over the Cuonzo Martin's of the world any day.
89illinigrad
- Chicago
Yeah, I don't get the infatuation with Martin either. To me he sounds similar to Groce. A good recruiter, but maybe not so good at the X's and O's.
If the thinking is that he can bring in 5* talent, then why would we fire Groce we he has finally started to bring in the 5* talent himself.
I think the only difference is that Martin is an AA and could possibly make better inroads in the CPL. But if that is such an important factor, I'd rather have Keats.
89illinigrad
- Chicago
Yeah, I don't get the infatuation with Martin either. To me he sounds similar to Groce. A good recruiter, but maybe not so good at the X's and O's.
If the thinking is that he can bring in 5* talent, then why would we fire Groce we he has finally started to bring in the 5* talent himself.
I think the only difference is that Martin is an AA and could possibly make better inroads in the CPL. But if that is such an important factor, I'd rather have Keatts.
Illinois State KenPom
Tom Richardson:
2002: 140
2003: 215
Porter Moser:
2004: 177
2005: 120
2006: 170
2007: 86
Tim Jankovich:
2008: 58
2009: 60
2010: 89
2011: 236
2012: 93
Dan Muller:
2013: 64
2014: 148
2015: 62
2016: 120
2017: 35
Another fun fact about Jankovich, he was a player at Kansas State when Lon Kruger was an assistant there, and then got his first coaching job as Kruger's assistant at Texas Pan-American. He obviously was an assistant to Self here and at KU, and before that he was also an assistant to Kevin Stallings at Vandy, so he's connected to the Keady/Weber tree as well.
I'm intrigued and you can't stop me! :hand: SMU vs. Houston tomorrow at 5PM on ESPNU. Samscum has improved Houston, as you'd figure. I will watch with interest.
Tom Richardson:
2002: 140
2003: 215
Porter Moser:
2004: 177
2005: 120
2006: 170
2007: 86
Tim Jankovich:
2008: 58
2009: 60
2010: 89
2011: 236
2012: 93
Dan Muller:
2013: 64
2014: 148
2015: 62
2016: 120
2017: 35
Another fun fact about Jankovich, he was a player at Kansas State when Lon Kruger was an assistant there, and then got his first coaching job as Kruger's assistant at Texas Pan-American. He obviously was an assistant to Self here and at KU, and before that he was also an assistant to Kevin Stallings at Vandy, so he's connected to the Keady/Weber tree as well.
I'm intrigued and you can't stop me! :hand: SMU vs. Houston tomorrow at 5PM on ESPNU. Samscum has improved Houston, as you'd figure. I will watch with interest.
I second this.
262-17 at Hargrave Military Academy
Then brought in at Louisville as lead recruiter, where he had a ton of success. The one concern here is that he was lead recruiter during the scandal, however he was never directly linked to any wrongdoing.
Then he goes to UNCW where he takes over a team that had gone 10-20 and 9-23 the two years prior to his takeover. He shows immediate improvement going 18-14 and winning a share of the conference title. He is named CAA Coach of the Year.
In year two, the improvement continues. UNCW goes 25-8, wins the regular season and tournament championship and then loses to Duke by single digits. Keatts is once again named CAA Coach of the Year again.
This year, off to an 18-2 start. Last night, UNCW went on the road and beat their main contender in the conference, Charleston.
Keatts is a very interesting potential candidate. I really like this potential pool.
Keatts feels like a little higher floor candidate than Musselman to me because of his recruiting prowess.
I still think Cuonzo has highest floor, but i wouldn't be disappointed in any of the three. Currently my preference:
1. Keatts
2.Martin
3. Musselman
89illinigrad
- Chicago
I agree. The only issue is that if we can see that he is a rising young coach, others can too. Might there be other (more appealing) openings he could jump at?
Knock yourself out.
But hiring those would rival the most uninspiring hiring decisions in Illini basketball history.
Mizzou will open, NC State is looking like it might, Georgetown might, LSU might, Washington, Ole Miss and Clemson aren't out of the realm of possibility. Obviously the Crean situation is worth monitoring.
Ole Miss, Clemson and Mizzou I wouldn't worry about. LSU maybe. Washington would probably focus on more West Coast guys. Indiana would aim higher. Keatts would be a strong, obvious candidate at NC State or Georgetown, but NC State and Archie Miller seems like a marriage of destiny at this point.
Are we a better job than Georgetown or LSU? Those are three extremely different jobs, but I would be inclined to put Illinois at the top of those three.
LincolnIlliniFan
- Lincoln, IL
Wait, what? Are we talking about the same Bill Self? While we're at it we should interview Coach K and Roy Williams as assistants
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