Illinois Hoops Recruiting Thread (October 2016)
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^ All of this is correct. All of it.
If you follow recruiting closely, when recruits stop the planned schedule of visits, they know where they are going. They stop for a reason. They do not just stop, declare their intentions to announce, go on twitter and media to discuss it, and then go back on the table to decide. They know. And especially for Wilkes, that he is not under any pressure since his next scheduled visit was in a month.
If that was the case, you'd see a lot more examples of recruits doing it and picking a school from their earlier visits. I know it makes for a good story, recruit really loved Groce and Illinois, just took an extra 2 visits to make sure, but none beat Illinois, no need to take more, he is set for Illinois. We went over this scenario with Brunson and multiple others. Does not really happen, extremely rare.
Will it ever happen? Even if it does happen in the future (not just for Illinois), there is no denying that the probability/chances of happening are extremely small. Especially when the ball stops at the school some AAU coaches believed was his favorite.
I do not personally know Wilkes or his family. But right now, the chances are strongly in favor of Indiana. Even if you believe the courtesy visit and that he hates Crean, maybe you want to give some chances to UCLA. But stopping his visits, and going back two visits and picking Illinois, I just do not see it happening. It would be great and make for a great celebration, a much needed boost, a totally unexpected surprise. But that is what it would be, a totally unexpected surprise.
Yes, let's all just hope he pulls a DeAndre Ayton
And it can't be said enough, even if we land Wilkes, Groce is gone if we miss the tournament.
(If we get Wilkes I'm sure there will be some who start to disagree with that conclusion. I will then teach them the meaning of pain in the octagon
)And it can't be said enough, even if we land Wilkes, Groce is gone if we miss the tournament.
(If we get Wilkes I'm sure there will be some who start to disagree with that conclusion. I will then teach them the meaning of pain in the octagon
Doubt it. You sign Tilmon and Wilkes, Whitman's not likely to boot him.
Derrick Rose says hello
I do not think Groce would do what Crean did to Patterson.
You don't go hard after a kid, sign him to a letter of intent and then "Crean" him after he moves to campus early and takes summer classes, all because you oversigned. Groce can count. Clappy evidently couldn't in that instance.
On Patterson, because Crean is one of the least favorite coaches here, you can say that he he just forced the kid because he oversigned, for "no reason", but there was a reason highly reported, that the classes Patterson took were mandated by IU as part of their equivalent of the "bridge" program. There are multiple reports that mentioned "academic" performance issues on those courses.
You can say that Groce would not do it, but he was indeed ready to oversign. There is no denying that. He could indeed count. Now, the fact we were left at the altar, is not because of Groce's unwillingness to do so. Obviously, there is a very clear possibility here that Crean does know that some player players will indeed leave early, so when it comes to Wilkes, it is not a case (yet) that the oversigning will have any effect.
And it can't be said enough, even if we land Wilkes, Groce is gone if we miss the tournament.
(If we get Wilkes I'm sure there will be some who start to disagree with that conclusion. I will then teach them the meaning of pain in the octagon
he wont go any place even without Wilkes UNLESS its a major major meltdown like a well below 500 season and no nit then maybe
OK. I'll bite. Say he goes to Indiana and decides after the visit, that's the place. I can understand not necessarily announcing for Indiana without advance warning. But if it is Indiana, or any other school for sure, why cut a list? Just say: "I'm announcing next week, or on a specific date?" Say on Jordan Goodwin's birthday?
I agree, he likely will choose Indiana. But it appears there is a hesitation, possibly Crean or something else. I don't think it feels 100% right for him, but might be enough to earn IU a commit. Either way I'm a fan of this kid and his game. Hope he has success where ever he goes, his game is very NBA.
Deleted member 556108
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+1, anyone spot the golf cart convoy?
Everything is dependent on how well players develop. You can be Mr Basketball, Top 100, 50, even top 20, sometimes it doesn't matter. Groce and the staff have to be able to develop talent to its potential. We have seen many guys in the last 10 years who didn't live up to the hype. (Either they were just overrated, or more often the case were mis-used or under coached.
LOL! If you imply the last minute unofficial visit that Reggie and Derrick Rose made to watch the scrimmage in Champaign, that probably qualifies as the biggest hoax of a visit that I ever witnessed. Actually, that whole recruitment is probably one of the biggest hoaxes I have ever witnessed. So if you think there are similarities here with Wilkes and his recruitment, please be my guest and classify Rose's recruitment as one of those "extremely rare" cases mentioned in my post.
History and percentages do not lie. Someone indeed wins the lottery, but it does not improve the chances of winning. Now, you can convince yourself that our chances are much better, and if you want to believe that, that is fine as well. It is not that we never had the exact same conversation in the past, and we will surely have it again in the future.
And it can't be said enough, even if we land Wilkes, Groce is gone if we miss the tournament.
(If we get Wilkes I'm sure there will be some who start to disagree with that conclusion. I will then teach them the meaning of pain in the octagon
People will disagree because they forget how much the heat gets turned up during the season. Easy to say otherwise in the offseason. But if he can't win with what is essentially the most experienced roster we will ever have, he's not likely winning much with Tilmon and Wilkes either.
I tend to agree with that, let alone signing both Wilkes and Tilmon.
Again, I do not like our chances with Wilkes, but if it were to happen, I think talent (especially top talent) easily beats the experience we have currently on this team. Maybe not their first year (assuming we do really well this year in comparison, which is not a given) but definitely beyond that.
"History and percentages do not lie" please show us the numbers professor. I can tell you right now you've made conclusions that can't be supported by numbers or history. I don't buy lottery tickets, so you have the advantage there.
JFG isn't going anywhere. He gets two years especially with the class he's bringing in. If we land Kiir, this class is pretty loaded. Wilkes is a massive cherry on top. But not a necessity. And yes, I agree with everything everyone is saying, Wilkes is IU bound. JFG made it interesting though and for that he deserves credit. I would like to see Groce recruit coming of a 20+ win regular season and a respectable run in the NCAA - 2 wins??? Put a few of those back to back and he could really do some things.
Tilmon was the must get and JFG got it done. If he can close out strong, maybe even a 5th year transfer surprise, he gets 2 years.
Tilmon was the must get and JFG got it done. If he can close out strong, maybe even a 5th year transfer surprise, he gets 2 years.
Joel Goodson
- dawgville
Who is the numbers professor? And what the heck does he have to do with Wilkes?
They class is the bare minimum of what we can expect out of Illinois+Tilmon. I still like the class a lot, don't get me wrong. Even under Weber though we didn't have much a problem landing kids outside the top 100, which all of Damonte, Pickett, Frazier, and Kirr are. While Tilmon is a hell of a get, he is not a top 5 program changer. You don't sacrifice your program for that. If Groce isn't making the tournament this year, he's almost certainly not going to make it the next. But as I said I think it's easy to lack perspective in the offseason. One can make comfortable blanket statements now, but it's nothing vs real ongoing results when the seat gets burning hot.
Moot point though as I think we easily make the tournament and then there's not much question on job security.
Yeah, it needs to end. Dead horse.
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