Dan
Admin
Here's the podcast, lawsuit talk begins 53:30-
http://www.news-gazette.com/audio/2015-07-04/saturday-sportstalk-07-04-15.html
http://www.news-gazette.com/audio/2015-07-04/saturday-sportstalk-07-04-15.html
Illini Women's Basketball Allegations
As far as I'm concerned, Beckett is about as credible a source as you'll get for this kind of analysis. He was my trial advocacy professor and trial team coach in law school and always struck me as pretty rational and grounded, and he's also a practitioner (at least back then, about a decade ago, he was the most prominent criminal defense lawyer in Champaign County, don't know if that's still true), so I think he comes at things with a real-world perspective, unlike some of the more ideological academic-minded professors who clearly had their own agenda and whose takes on things you always had to consider with a grain of salt. I know he's a definite fan of the sports programs but I think if he saw any substance in this suit, he would say so.
But I see your point too. In the big picture it might not matter much that the suit may be totally frivolous. If the athletic department defends itself too vigorously, it can come off poorly in the press and court of public opinion, like they are just another antiquate institution from the bad-old-days perpetuating racial and gender discrimination. It's not fair but that's how it gets spun.
Anyway, the playbook on these kinds of "scandals" has been established the past few years -- first, find a high-profile scapegoat and terminate that person (or persons) with great fanfare. That satiates the pundits and afterwards, there being no more will-they-or-won't-they intrigue to headline, they all move on to the next thing. Then, quietly, a year or two later on the back page where nobody is looking, you settle the thing out of court with a token payoff, admitting no guilt and requiring everyone to sign a non-disclosure agreement. That's not going to be good news for Bollant but sorry, that's how these things get off the books in 2015.
Thanks. I found it interesting the Beckett said that he was not a booster, but said he did have season tickets and may have contributed $$ as part of those purchases. If that is true, he would certainly fall under the NCAA's definition of booster and of most of our definitions of a fan at some level. That said, he came across as pretty rational and not as an Illini paranoid fan. I have also heard him over the years discuss various legal issues related to college sports and he seemed well informed and very interesting.
I found it a little odd that he wasn't asked about the football situation that I recall. Perhaps because there hasn't been a formal lawsuit as of yet. No mention of the soccer player's lawsuit that I recall.
I think the realistic best case scenario for UIUC is not very good. They've been tainted and a settlement or court win will not erase that even if it should.
IlliniSavage12
I
Guest
Beckett was pretty blunt. Said another attorney he talked to who read the lawsuit called it a joke. Steve said he wouldn't be surprised to see a judge flat out dismiss it since it lacks any teeth. It isn't just "not well written", it's vague and accusatory with little to no substance to back up any claims.
I'd laugh if it gets dismissed and the university filed a countersuit for defamation. It would serve these "plaintiffs" and their attorneys right. It's a bunch of crap IMHO.
I'd laugh if it gets dismissed and the university filed a countersuit for defamation. It would serve these "plaintiffs" and their attorneys right. It's a bunch of crap IMHO.
Two questions about double jeopardy for you lawyers.
1) does double jeopardy apply if a case is dismissed ( as you mention as a possibilty) or only if a verdict is reached.
2) does double jeopardy apply in this type of case or is it only criminal cases?
Answering #2, double jeopardy only applies to prohibit the government from trying a criminal defendant twice for the same crime.
As for #1, the term for civil cases is res judicata, which basically means that you can't raise the same claim once it has been decited by a court on the merits. "On the merits" meaning, in layman's terms, that the court made some determination that one side or the other is right. Doesn't necessarily mean after a trial and verdict. After both sides have submitted their pleadings, either one can move for summary judgment, arguing that their claims are so obviously right that the court should just decide in their favor right away because there is no genuine dispute about some key fact or legal principal. Usually the defendant so moves, and if he wins, that's res judicata.
Res judicata usually doesn't attach when the court grants a motion to dismiss, because all they are saying is the allegations in the complaint aren't enough to establish a case. The defendant doesn't even have to present their side at that stage. And the plaintiff can go back and try to fix their pleadings and refile. But practically speaking, if the plaintiff laid out what they had in the complaint and it got dismissed and there's really nothing else to enhance the original allegations, that should be the end of it.
If I'm off on any of that, blame my law school civil procedure professor.
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ILLINIShox24
Orange Krush '04 & '05
From Wisch
Hearing CNN will air its investigation into allegations against #Illini women's basketball & football coaches at 3 p.m. CT this afternoon.
Hearing CNN will air its investigation into allegations against #Illini women's basketball & football coaches at 3 p.m. CT this afternoon.
Nope, you've got it.
Soxfreak64
- Bloomington
It's about to get ugly.
frozenrope9190
- Aurora, IL
Is men's basketball involved in any way?
In the sense that this is all bad publicity for Illini athletics in general, yes. But no allegations have been raised with the men's program.
It looks like we're all about to be accused of being racist. I hope they interviewed Bardo...
GreekIllini
G
Guest
CNN Investigation
I don't know if anyone just saw this but CNN just blasted the university on national television. Keeps on getting better ...
I don't know if anyone just saw this but CNN just blasted the university on national television. Keeps on getting better ...
GreekIllini
G
Guest
That's the point .... The fact that CNN decided to MAKE this into something more is disappointing. Especially when they added "soccer players stated mistreatment now"...... If you're an athlete. Sack the f up. There is no mistreatment. I'm friends with many players... They all told me the same thing. These kids are a bunch of whiners who complain at the smallest pain
Sorry but this is ridiculous. If the allegations are true, then it IS mistreatment.
The women's bball accusations seem much more credible to me than any of the football stuff, which just came across as sour grapes.
GreekIllini
G
Guest
I find it extremely hard to believe we have over 5 head coaches who are racist, don't care about the health of players, and are capable of hiding it.
Depends on which allegations.
I think the reason this story exists in a kind of suspended animation is because it kind of tiptoes the line of saying the standard methods of coaching college sports are no longer okay. That's a much different question than whether our women's basketball team ever held segregated practices.
GreekIllini
G
Guest
Then that is the conversation that needs to be had. On the count of segregated practice ..... ,HOW. HOW can a team that has female and black assistant coaches be able to do that for so long with no one speaking up. I just don't buy it. If I'm wrong I'm really sorry but my bull crap meter is on high right now
URH Snyder 490
Orange Crush '89
- Northern Illinois
I find it impossible to believe that multiple players on different teams made up the same stories of abuse. This is disgusting.
I don't think that many people watch CNN so we might be ok here.
GreekIllini
G
Guest
You mean "I played when I wasn't 100%. My coaches told me they'd like me to play so I did" .... Like every other sport in the world. Including the armed forces, hockey, football, basketball, etc. I find it hard to believe so many coaches abused players. That is how sports are played. If you want to have a conversation about babying players from now on , fine. But don't bring the name of one institution down when this is how men and women give their all to a sport they signed up for