College Hoops Coaching Carousel

Bigtex · Jan 10, 2023

WyattEarp said:
A helicopter ? That’s so nuts IMO. So many coaches out there that are just as a good coach (in A LOT of cases better) than that guy.
(A lot of ‘em no one has ever heard of too.) It’s all about the splashy hire; I guess.

I appreciate the consistent results he was able to generate for a good long stint…but he’s not even doing that now.

Texas would be better off with some young-ish up-and-comer that’s hungry but has some experience… I could be wrong, but I think Cal’s best days are likely behind him. I’d be damned if I’d jump through all those hoops just to get a marquee name. JMO

Like Shaka? that didn't last very long

WyattEarp · Jan 10, 2023

illini0440 said:
Cal is awesome in his own way. He is like the head mafia boss of college basketball lol

Well, he is that. I dunno if I get it totally. But he is that. Lol

Aside from the miraculous recruiting for a long time, I think a big part of his success has been his ability to adapt and tweak things to fit his personnel. But I think there’s a lot better pure coaches out there…again JMO

GOOFY HYPOTHETICAL: It’s a summer basketball camp. The last day of camp there is a tourney. Coaches get to pick their teams after seeing them play in a pick-up game for 3-5 minutes.

But the kicker is, YOUR LIFE depends on who wins the tournament. Your choices of coaches are as follows:

Brad Stevens, Brad Underwood, Lon Kruger, Thad Matta, Bo Ryan, Tom Izzo,
John Chaney, Jim Calhoun, Mike Krzyzewski, Micah Shrewsberry, John Beilein, Bob Huggins, Rick Majerus Morgan Wooten, Bob Hurley Sr., Vance Wahlberg Gary Williams, Roy Williams AND John Calipari.

Calipari would PROBABLY be the last one I picked. I think Cal is adaptable but not all that innovative really. All coaches are plagiarists. But, I think his stuff is more than most. I’m not calling him a hack. But he’s definitely not an innovator. And, I think he needs talent to be successful, more than most of the guys on the list.

(Yes, it is a goofy hypothetical with silly parameters…with coaches living AND those now coaching at the NCAA Tournament in the sky.) *

WyattEarp · Jan 10, 2023

Bigtex said:
Like Shaka? that didn't last very long

No…I straight up think Shaka is overrated as hell.

Not to get into the weeds about the creepy domestic stuff…but more like Beard.

(Talking strictly BASKETBALL on Beard obviously…someone at about that level, about that age, and that acumen…I said young-ish too…)

illini0440 · Jan 10, 2023

Probably give me Lon or Brad stevens from that list. Self would be my number 1 pick for that scenario even though he isn’t an option

Bigtex · Jan 10, 2023

WyattEarp said:
No…I straight up think Shaka is overrated as hell.

Not to get into the weeds about the creepy domestic stuff…but more like Beard.

(Talking strictly BASKETBALL on Beard obviously…someone at about that level, about that age, and that acumen…I said young-ish too…)

but Shaka "was young-ish up-and-comer" but so was Groce, Shrewsberry, Painter (many years ago) Underwood (a little older), Beard (also a bit older), and many others....

My point is they tried to the young-ish up-and-comer and think they will go with the more established veteran.

IlliniFandom · Jan 10, 2023

I feel bad for Syracuse (not really), but they have this Hall of Fame coach that was great a decade ago, but since then has lost it without any hope of getting it back. It would be bad PR to fire him, but he doesn't seem to want to move into the sunset and enjoy retirement.

WyattEarp · Jan 10, 2023

illini0440 said:
Probably give me Lon or Brad stevens from that list. Self would be my number 1 pick for that scenario even though he isn’t an option

Oh yeah, crap…I should of put him on there for sure.

illini0440 · Jan 10, 2023

WyattEarp said:
Oh yeah, crap…I should of put him on there for sure.

He is the best recruiter and X and O combo I've seen.

WyattEarp · Jan 10, 2023

Bigtex said:
but Shaka "was young-ish up-and-comer" but so was Groce, Shrewsberry, Painter (many years ago) Underwood (a little older), Beard (also a bit older), and many others....

My point is they tried to the young-ish up-and-comer and think they will go with the more established veteran.

You might be right. I dunno.

ChiefGritty · Jan 10, 2023

WyattEarp said:
Calipari would PROBABLY be the last one I picked.

LAST!? Several guys on the list are dead!

skyIdub · Jan 10, 2023

So I totally get BU not tempted by UT.....but would UK call him if Cal bounces? Would that tempt him?
Am I a worry wart? A normal wart?
Have I had too much caffeine? Should I have more?

illini0440 · Jan 10, 2023

skyIdub said:
So I totally get BU not tempted by UT.....but would UK call him if Cal bounces? Would that tempt him?
Am I a worry wart? A normal wart?
Have I had too much caffeine? Should I have more?

Yes to all of these.

ChiefGritty · Jan 10, 2023

BU's lack of tournament success is a big problem for apex predator jobs and BB's inability to break through at Arkansas is a big problem for apex predator jobs.

Roundball Sage · Jan 10, 2023

skyIdub said:
So I totally get BU not tempted by UT.....but would UK call him if Cal bounces? Would that tempt him?

No. Only 'Elite' programs are tempting... like the Illini. And now that UK has become a Stepping Stone program... not likely.

'I - I - I'm not your Steppin' Stone... (No! Not me!)...'

WyattEarp · Jan 10, 2023

illini0440 said:
He is the best recruiter and X and O combo I've seen.

He’s awful good.

If you think he’s better than Underwood and Kruger…that’s some high praise.

Do you think he’s better than Stevens?
Self is prob. a better recruiter than Stevens.
But I dunno.

I think if my life depended on it, and I could pick one guy to draw up a game winner with :23 seconds…it’s gotta be Stevens.

alaskaillini · Jan 10, 2023

ChiefGritty said:
BU's lack of tournament success is a big problem for apex predator jobs and BB's inability to break through at Arkansas is a big problem for apex predator jobs.

I can understand how this narrative of lack of tournament success is adopted, but not really correct. He has taken six teams to tournament and underperformed twice (including as a 4 losing to a 5), performed to his seed twice (including a 91-90 loss to much higher ranked MI), and overperformed his seed twice (winning against a 3 seed as a 14, and wining against a 5 seed as a 12). Not sure those results evidence a lack of success in the tourney.

But I get it that he has yet to make a run to even the Sweet Sixteen. Not a lot of good oportunities.

illini0440 · Jan 10, 2023

WyattEarp said:
He’s awful good.

If you think he’s better than Underwood and Kruger…that’s some high praise.

Do you think he’s better than Stevens?
Self is prob. a better recruiter than Stevens.
But I dunno.

I think if my life depended on it, and I could pick one guy to draw up a game winner with :23 seconds…it’s gotta be Stevens.

That's tough.....I love Self(might get me booted off this board). Can't go wrong with either but I'm riding with Bill.

ChiefGritty · Jan 10, 2023

Stevens isn't even a coach anymore.

I think what all these "do a single X and O with a gun to your head" hypos miss is that the guys who have proven themselves as really top tacticians and professors of the game of basketball are able to change and adapt and find ways to impart their knowledge to their players in ways that are useable on the floor.

Because I promise you, the winner of a "draw up 10 great out of bounds plays in 60 seconds" contest would be Bruce Weber, and then his team would run 2 out the 10 properly.

Cal for a very long time had an unbelievable ability to get these hyped one-foot-in-the-NBA prima donnas to play really hard and together. Feels like that's waning a little with age, and as he loses his first-mover advantage in building rosters with that perspective on things.

Indy Illini Fan · Jan 10, 2023

21ChampaignSt said:
I like Micah. He's easy to root for especially since PSU isn't a huge threat (I know).

Seems like a life long Midwest guy though so there are only a handful of jobs outside the Big Ten that would make sense for him, in my mostly uninformed opinion.

Won't find a bigger Micah fan than me ... Great guy ... Great family man ... Elite X & O coach who gets his guys to play super hard ...

However, for a job like UK or Texas ... Probably not the right fit ... The second Painter calls it a career at Purdue, Shrews will be the first guy they call ...

Fighter of the Nightman · Jan 10, 2023

The Cal to Texas thing really is not that surprising when you consider the following:

1) Kentucky might be the most demanding fan base in the country, and his goodwill for past championships is just about up there ... they are NOT happy.

2) Cal's MO is elite recruiting and getting enough talent to consistently be really good, even if his coaching shortfalls stop his teams from being consistently elite year-to-year, at least by Blue Blood standards.

3) Texas Basketball has a history closer to Iowa than to Kentucky, and their fans/boosters likely know that. While they indeed think the world of themselves and probably think they "deserve" to be a lot better than they have been historically, they'd likely gladly settle for what Cal can provide for the next several years.

WyattEarp · Jan 10, 2023

ChiefGritty said:
LAST!? Several guys on the list are dead!

True, I did throw out a disclaimer though…

ChiefGritty · Jan 10, 2023

alaskaillini said:
I can understand how this narrative of lack of tournament success is adopted, but not really correct. He has taken six teams to tournament and underperformed twice (including as a 4 losing to a 5), performed to his seed twice (including a 91-90 loss to much higher ranked MI), and overperformed his seed twice (winning against a 3 seed as a 14, and wining against a 5 seed as a 12). Not sure those results evidence a lack of success in the tourney.

But I get it that he has yet to make a run to even the Sweet Sixteen. Not a lot of good oportunities.

I have total faith in him as an Illini fan that he's as likely as anybody to have deep tournament success as he continues here.

Kentucky fans won't see it that way. We wouldn't see it that way if the roles were reversed.

ChiefGritty · Jan 10, 2023

Fighter of the Nightman said:
The Cal to Texas thing really is not that surprising when you consider the following:

1) Kentucky might be the most demanding fan base in the country, and his goodwill for past championships is just about up there ... they are NOT happy.

2) Cal's MO is elite recruiting and getting enough talent to consistently be really good, even if his coaching shortfalls stop his teams from being consistently elite year-to-year, at least by Blue Blood standards.

3) Texas Basketball has a history closer to Iowa than to Kentucky, and their fans/boosters likely know that. While they indeed think the world of themselves and probably think they "deserve" to be a lot better than they have been historically, they'd likely gladly settle for what Cal can provide for the next several years.

For the record I don't think Cal is leaving Kentucky. He'd have left for the NBA by now if he was willing to leave.

the national · Jan 10, 2023

illini0440 said:
That's tough.....I love Self(might get me booted off this board). Can't go wrong with either but I'm riding with Bill.

alaskaillini · Jan 10, 2023

This thread reminded me of a couple of weeks ago when I was cleaning out my bookcase. I found a 30th Anniversary Great Alaska Shootout program and thumbed through it - there were 7 D1 teams in the Shootout plus UAA. The following coaches were included in that year's version - Bobby Knight, Brad Stevens, Mark Few, John Beilein, and Seth Greenberg. Damn I miss the Shootout (RIP).

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