St Louis Cardinals 2024

#76      
illiniwil
GILL-INOIS said:
Usually would agree but not all the Midwest teams have signed deals or received all of the money from Diamond(Bally). Small market teams and MLB will be making plenty of money on any broadcasting/streaming deal. It will be nice once every fan base can watch their team without the headaches.
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as long as MLB blacks out regional tv coverage on the scale they currently do, i cant understand their business model. i've long thought that id buy MLBTV
package if they'd show my team. i'm 160 miles from STL and am blacked out on MLBTV. the entire midwest is as well to see KC, STL ,Cubs, Sox.
 
#78      
illiniwil
Did i hear that the birds signed Sting and Billy Joel? So they did have salary to make a few moves.
Hope Sting still has that slider. He's probably in better shape than Lance Lynn.
 
#79      
illiniwil
but seriously: I don't like going full arbitration hearing with Edman. Those things can get a bit adversarial.
He's our rock. Plays every day, smart and my impression is he's a great clubhouse guy.
 
#80      
GILL-INOIS
illiniwil said:
as long as MLB blacks out regional tv coverage on the scale they currently do, i cant understand their business model. i've long thought that id buy MLBTV
package if they'd show my team. i'm 160 miles from STL and am blacked out on MLBTV. the entire midwest is as well to see KC, STL ,Cubs, Sox.
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I hear ya....within 20 minutes of St Louis and have that problem. Or when Blues are on NHL Network very randomly same thing happens. Hopefully this gets figured out in the next year or two at most.

Don't see it happening but at one time was almost hoping the Cardinals would start their own network and include local teams just to end this mess.
 
#81      
GILL-INOIS
pruman91 said:
www.stltoday.com

Cardinals gain payroll clarity with 5 deals, set salary offer to argue with Tommy Edman

The Cardinals filed an offer of $6.5 million for planned everyday center fielder Tommy Edman, and his representatives countered with an argument for $6.95 million.
www.stltoday.com www.stltoday.com
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That sounds real encouraging if they were that close on money out of the gate. Good pay raise for Edman whatever he ends up with

Sometimes you get those friction cases where the team offers 4.5 million and player wants 7.5 million
 
#82      
wpr
illiniwil said:
as long as MLB blacks out regional tv coverage on the scale they currently do, i cant understand their business model. i've long thought that id buy MLBTV
package if they'd show my team. i'm 160 miles from STL and am blacked out on MLBTV. the entire midwest is as well to see KC, STL ,Cubs, Sox.
Click to expand...
I'm 4 hours away. Clearly I will not pop in for a Tuesday night game. Each team should be limited to 100 mile radius.

If they want to grow their market, they need to do everything they can to attract a larger fan base. St Louis had such a large following because they had radio stations all over the Upper South and Greater Mid West. The Cubs Channel 9 and Ted's TBS "made" people follow their teams.

I have seen countless times where a family supports one organization but when the kids move out of state, their children want to follow the local team. It was easier when the Super Stations were broadcasting over the air or on the local cable channels. Now everything is behind a paywall so to speak. Many are saying they can keep it. The 2023 World Series had an average of 9+ million viewers. That's embarrassing.
 
#84      
pruman91
www.stltoday.com

BenFred: Five quotes from Mozeliak that suggested Cardinals' offseason moves aren't done

Actions always speak louder than words, but Cardinals president of baseball operations John Mozeliak indicated Saturday that he's still open to adding to the 2024 roster
www.stltoday.com www.stltoday.com

www.stltoday.com

Alec Burleson attempts a transformation to become a viable outfield option for Cardinals

Cardinals first baseman/outfielder Alec Burleson went into this offseason with a chip on his shoulder after last season.
www.stltoday.com www.stltoday.com

www.stltoday.com

BenFred: Sonny Gray is the Cardinals' biggest offseason addition, but it's much bigger than that

Big offseason acquisition Sonny Gray's performance on the mound and leadership off it will make him an influential figure in determining if Cardinals rebound or reset
www.stltoday.com www.stltoday.com
 
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#85      
illiniwil
I guess im just not sure how/why we aren't dealing some of these excess position players/
outfielders. Walker, Edman, Nootbaar seem to have spots locked up. Donovan, Carlson,
Gomez, V. Scott II right behind. Gorman, Baker and Burleson as bats without an everyday
position. (some would argue Gorman as our 2b, i wouldn't) one of Noot, Donovan, Gorman
or Edman should fetch a nice #2 pitcher and Carlson a bullpen arm. We cant have control
over the older guys for much longer. Nobody wants to trade Gorman, but he is a mediocre
to bad second baseman who has a bad back. Might hit 30 homers if he can stay healthy.
Donovan and Edman are better 2b's (Edman a gold glove there), good OBP plus projects10
-15 hr's. If defense is key after last year, strength up the middle is vital.
 
#86      
illiniwil
wpr said:
I'm 4 hours away. Clearly I will not pop in for a Tuesday night game. Each team should be limited to 100 mile radius.

If they want to grow their market, they need to do everything they can to attract a larger fan base. St Louis had such a large following because they had radio stations all over the Upper South and Greater Mid West. The Cubs Channel 9 and Ted's TBS "made" people follow their teams.

I have seen countless times where a family supports one organization but when the kids move out of state, their children want to follow the local team. It was easier when the Super Stations were broadcasting over the air or on the local cable channels. Now everything is behind a paywall so to speak. Many are saying they can keep it. The 2023 World Series had an average of 9+ million viewers. That's embarrassing.
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i have limited my trips to 2-3 times a year. ticket, gas prices and the quality of our product limits my interest. if i cant watch them at home,
im out all together. i admit, if i cant get a good ticket i wont come, so the upper decks are out.
 
#87      
GILL-INOIS
illiniwil said:
I guess im just not sure how/why we aren't dealing some of these excess position players/
outfielders. Walker, Edman, Nootbaar seem to have spots locked up. Donovan, Carlson,
Gomez, V. Scott II right behind. Gorman, Baker and Burleson as bats without an everyday
position. (some would argue Gorman as our 2b, i wouldn't) one of Noot, Donovan, Gorman
or Edman should fetch a nice #2 pitcher and Carlson a bullpen arm. We cant have control
over the older guys for much longer. Nobody wants to trade Gorman, but he is a mediocre
to bad second baseman who has a bad back. Might hit 30 homers if he can stay healthy.
Donovan and Edman are better 2b's (Edman a gold glove there), good OBP plus projects10
-15 hr's. If defense is key after last year, strength up the middle is vital.
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I don't disagree with you

The main factors are team control ($) and trade value. Majority of the guys you mentioned are under team control for many years. No need to move them(yet) if offers are low.

Two things I see slowing it down. Wait and see how free agency plays out and wonder if the Cardinals are waiting to see if Winn can develop and have a year like Walker did last season. If so, it makes other infielders/platoon guys more expendable during the season. If not, Edman slides back to SS and have the platoon at 2B.
 
#88      
Se Il Illini
I heard an old Mo series of comments stating that the projected starting outfield for 2024 as stated above is Walker, Edman, and Walker. The Cardinals were 19th, I believe, in run production in 2023. So now we have Edman projected in center with a career best RBI total of 56 and Nootbar projected in left with a career best RBI total of 46.
 
#89      
GILL-INOIS
Se Il Illini said:
I heard an old Mo series of comments stating that the projected starting outfield for 2024 as stated above is Walker, Edman, and Walker. The Cardinals were 19th, I believe, in run production in 2023. So now we have Edman projected in center with a career best RBI total of 56 and Nootbar projected in left with a career best RBI total of 46.
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Walker-Edman-Nootbaar

Though I would rather clone Walker myself ;)

JMO but I am more excited about projected lineup of Walker-Edman-Nootbaar this season than I was last year for O'Neill-Nootbaar-Carlson. Problem is an injury brings Carlson back into the mix.
 
#90      
illiniwil
GILL-INOIS said:
I don't disagree with you

The main factors are team control ($) and trade value. Majority of the guys you mentioned are under team control for many years. No need to move them(yet) if offers are low.

Two things I see slowing it down. Wait and see how free agency plays out and wonder if the Cardinals are waiting to see if Winn can develop and have a year like Walker did last season. If so, it makes other infielders/platoon guys more expendable during the season. If not, Edman slides back to SS and have the platoon at 2B.
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except "team control" is value on the trading block. once three or four of these guys are arbitration eligible, if they haven't panned out
they have no value. if you have an abundance of mediocrity, you have more problems.
 
#91      
illiniwil
GILL-INOIS said:
Walker-Edman-Nootbaar

Though I would rather clone Walker myself ;)

JMO but I am more excited about projected lineup of Walker-Edman-Nootbaar this season than I was last year for O'Neill-Nootbaar-Carlson. Problem is an injury brings Carlson back into the mix.
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OR MAYBE VICTOR SCOTT II IS READY AND EDMAN CAN MOVE BACK TO THE INFIELD WHERE HE BELONGS?
(not shouting, caps stuck for a moment)
 
#92      
GILL-INOIS
illiniwil said:
except "team control" is value on the trading block. once three or four of these guys are arbitration eligible, if they haven't panned out
they have no value. if you have an abundance of mediocrity, you have more problems.
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No doubt. Majority of the guys you mentioned in original post are pre-arbitration and have 4-6 years of team control. Even Edman has another arbitration year after this, Carlson two more arbitration years after this, etc. No pressure to trade anyone right now when value is low.
 
#93      
GILL-INOIS
illiniwil said:
OR MAYBE VICTOR SCOTT II IS READY AND EDMAN CAN MOVE BACK TO THE INFIELD WHERE HE BELONGS?
(not shouting, caps stuck for a moment)
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I would love for Scott to be MLB ready. Throw him into spring training and give him some playing time.

Reality of it is he has no time in AAA and needs to start instead of riding the pine in the majors. I am more fond of Edman in the infield as well.
 
#94      
illiniwil
i guess that i would only add that VSII's fall league time is pretty much AAA level or better.
MLB teams love to hide a kid a little longer just to protect those years of control. they just
changed that rule in some way?
 
#95      
Se Il Illini
GILL-INOIS said:
Walker-Edman-Nootbaar

Though I would rather clone Walker myself ;)

JMO but I am more excited about projected lineup of Walker-Edman-Nootbaar this season than I was last year for O'Neill-Nootbaar-Carlson. Problem is an injury brings Carlson back into the mix.
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I was and am neither exited about the 2023 version of the outfield nor the projected version of the 2024 outfield. By all accounts Walker is a future all star. Tommy Edman is a gold glove second baseman, who is going to be asked, apparently, to be the fulltime centerfielder. And Lars Nootbar is the flavor of the day and will play left field. I am on record saying that Nootbar is a good fourth outfielder. Maybe he will prove me wrong and become an all star.
 
#96      
GILL-INOIS
Se Il Illini said:
I was and am neither exited about the 2023 version of the outfield nor the projected version of the 2024 outfield. By all accounts Walker is a future all star. Tommy Edman is a gold glove second baseman, who is going to be asked, apparently, to be the fulltime centerfielder.
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I am not excited about the 2024 version. I am more excited about the 2024 version than the 2023 version. Guys hitting .220 range, waiting for TON to get hurt, low on base % happened way too long. I see more stability with this group if they stay healthy.

I agree and you are the 3rd person that has posted they would rather see Edman in the infield. Edman is the ultimate team player. He kept SS warm for Winn and keeping CF warm for Scott either later this season or next season.


Se Il Illini said:
And Lars Nootbar is the flavor of the day and will play left field. I am on record saying that Nootbar is a good fourth outfielder. Maybe he will prove me wrong and become an all star.
Click to expand...

I think if he can stay healthy he is fine. One of the few guys that can take walks and get on base at a high rate.
 
#97      
illiniwil
Edman is good, but isn't a natural in the outfield like he is at second. (or short for that matter) He has a smooth, natural, seemingly
effortless way to get to and throw balls to first that isn't taught. He looks like he has been in the middle infield his whole life. Playing
him elsewhere is a disservice to him and the team. Victor Scott II's emergence would be the best thing to happen to him.
 
#98      
GILL-INOIS
Cardinals are doing the "Cardinal Way" right now with Edman. Using him where needed under arbitration years. Edman is good but he isn't a top 5 player at any position. First, I hope Winn pans out/stays healthy or Edman gets moved back to SS. Cardinals were waiting for Winn to come up to SS, same with Scott in CF either this season or next. Edman has this year and another arbitration year next season unless he gets extended/moved. Front office playing the usual game of checkers.....
 
#99      
the national
Good bit of cardinals (Chip Caray) and MLB talk on the drive with Tay and Piper yesterday.

Maybe the Amazon prime deal isn’t dead?

open.spotify.com

1/17/24 Hour 2: Illinois' memorable recent games in Ann Arbor; Underwood previews Wolverines; Lon and Derek's 1-on-1 with Chip Caray, Brad Thompson

Listen to this episode from The Drive with Lon Tay & Derek Piper on Spotify. Lon and Derek discuss the Illini's upcoming trip to Michigan. Hear from Brad Underwood as he shares some thoughts off the Maryland loss and previews the Wolverines. Hear Derek's 1-on-1 with Chip Caray and Lon's 1-on-1...
open.spotify.com open.spotify.com
 
#100      
illiniwil
GILL-INOIS said:
Cardinals are doing the "Cardinal Way" right now with Edman. Using him where needed under arbitration years. Edman is good but he isn't a top 5 player at any position. First, I hope Winn pans out/stays healthy or Edman gets moved back to SS. Cardinals were waiting for Winn to come up to SS, same with Scott in CF either this season or next. Edman has this year and another arbitration year next season unless he gets extended/moved. Front office playing the usual game of checkers.....
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while others are playing chess....
 
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